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Thread: Idealizing Community

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array TopherRed's Avatar
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    Jul 2009
    2w3 so/sx

    Default Idealizing Community

    So, I think I have some problems idealizing community...or rather, strongly desiring a healthy, loving, (good) family-like interpersonal connection among the memebers of a given community, to the point where I get very frustrated when that doesn't happen, and by definition, community becomes lack-there-of.

    Things I realize on the surface:
    • "Perfection" is never possible.
    • I try to fix problems when I'm not in charge, only leading to more (or deepening) problems.
    • I can't shake Ni off, *knowing* when "cracks" form in the community base; I tell people in charge, but they think I'm being a naysayer, until the crack in the ground is so obvious, that there is no more community. 'I told you so' just never seems to satisfy me.
    • I wonder if I'm just in the wrong community(ies), or if I need to be content and enjoy what I've got, while I got it.
    • Should I try to supress my J-ness and be content with the community I have (i.e. should I just stay out of trying to fix anything?)?
    • Should I move on, and search for more stable communities?
    • Should I be looking for opportunities to be in charge, so that I might have exert more influence over communities?
    Love is the point.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Array Keps Mnemnosyne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009


    One quick question, how do you try to fix things? Maybe that is the problem.
    Love wouldn't exist without loneliness to inspire it.

    Peach yogurt is made of love. And gnome kidneys. - Domino

    I can cope and will cope without polluting my lungs. - Saslou

  3. #3


    There's no such thing as a perfect person. A community is made up of imperfect people, therefore it'll never be perfect. There will always be problems. You'll get moments when things seem to run smoothly - just enjoy them. Shit'll hit the fan again sooner or later, then you just do your duty and what seems best to you, and it blows over and things are calm again. Adapt to any changes that have taken place due to the blow-up. Repeat cycle. Accept it
    I'm male and over 30, FYI.
    Preferences: 20% Extravert, 98% Intuitive, 68% Thinker, 17% Perceiving

  4. #4
    .~ *aĉa virino* ~. Array Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Apr 2007
    549 sx/sp
    LII Ni


    I know you're also speaking (in terms of practical experience) of "Christian community," and that has its own set of issues... namely a strong ideal that rarely is met, along with a particular moral template that I actually believes throws wrenches in the community-development process... people are torn between doing things that instinctively build community vs enforce the accepted ethical code.

    I'm an introvert, and that contributes to me thinking that change starts inside the individual person. change can be inflicted from the outside but not as successfully; however, creating the right structure to plug people into can allow the inner communal instinct to flower.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  5. #5
    Paragon Gone Wrong Array OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Mar 2009
    4w5 sp/sx
    IEI Ni


    I agree with Jennifer as far as turning inward, but then that's an introvert solution. The idea of it is, if everyone turned inward and took responsibility for their part, instead of pointing fingers, then everyone would be improving in some way and that would cause the entire group to improve as a whole.

    Not focusing on just the cracks helps, which includes consciously reminding yourself of what is good about people and a community on the know, "Love covers a multitude of sins". Supporting people in charge can make their job easier and make things more successful, because you have cooperation. It takes some humility to do that of course.

    That said, it doesn't mean to turn a blind eye. If the negatives far outweigh the positives and the basic values of the group are violated again and again by those in charge, then it may be time to seek some other community.
    "Charlotte sometimes dreams a wall around herself. But it's always with love - So much love it looks like everything else. Charlotte Sometimes - So far away, glass sealed and pretty." - The Cure

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx - 451| RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive

  6. #6


    It's an extravert solution as well. An extravert can't genuinely change any more than an introvert can, without wanting to, which would mean seeing for themselves the reason to and being adequately motivated.

    Might be hard for an ENFJ to internalise, but you can't force people to see what they don't want to see, or to change or do things that they don't understand the need for. And there's often no point either, in urging them verbally, because they'll just see it as guilt trips or pressure or you bossing them about, telling them what they should do. Some will go along with it, but resent it, whilst others will do the exact opposite just to spite you.

    It's better to let other people look to their own personal development. They'll see things when they're mentally ready to see them, and they'll change when they want to. In the meantime, you've got to just be patient with their faults as you no doubt hope they are with yours.
    I'm male and over 30, FYI.
    Preferences: 20% Extravert, 98% Intuitive, 68% Thinker, 17% Perceiving

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