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[NF] I'm a Damned Liar.

G

Ginkgo

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I have realized that almost everything I say is sugar-coated, wretched, or manipulative in nature. Everything. I have also realized that blunt honesty can be just as helpful as encouragement.

This may seem like a no-brainer, but it opens up many, many possible explanations as to why our culture is the way it is, and why I need to change.

-Most of the time, we must avoid stepping on people's toes because we are afraid of conflict.

-But why are we afraid of conflict? Was it manifested by childhood experiences? Is it ingrained into our very nature as human-beings?

-Have we developed self-censorship as a species because we cannot handle the truth that everything is faulty, and we are often powerless to change it?

I have been lying to myself and those around me because I can't even handle the truth.

I don't even want to add emoticons to this thread, because I know that they are simply tools used to manipulate the psyches of readers.

I'm extremely tempted to add a "cry" emote here. NO!

I am putting this in the NF section because it seems that we are the most susceptible to use interpersonal manipulation.
 

Athenian200

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[Youtube="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uGmRaInspo"]I am here[/youtube]

I understand your helplessness
you stand shrouded in the shadow
of a world bigger than you
looking for anything to get you through

I am here to lie to you
I am here to break the fall
I live only to deny you
I am here to end it all

I'm possessed by hopelessness
still you look to me for truth
but you can't even understand
the insignificance of you

I am here to lie to you
I am here to break the fall
I live only to deny you
I am here to end it all


I know what you mean. But I've made my peace with it. I accept what I am. You should do likewise. :yes:
 
G

Ginkgo

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I know what you mean. But I've made my peace with it. I accept what I am. You should do likewise. :yes:

/turns off filter (not that I really can, because language itself is a filter, but whatever)

Why should I accept myself? I am imperfect, and I will always be.

Accepting myself is only bowing to ignorance. It is accepting self-defeat, as my primary purpose in living is to improve myself.

Self-acceptance hinders self-improvement.
 

Athenian200

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Why should I accept myself? I am imperfect, and I will always be.

Accepting myself is only bowing to ignorance. It is accepting self-defeat, as my primary purpose in living is to improve myself.

Acceptance hinders self-improvement.

Simple. Because self-improvement is just another illusion. You don't really improve yourself in terms of your goals or ambitions, you just become more skilled at rationalizing and achieving them in a tangible way. Your motivations and intentions, the things that really matter, will never be any better than they were to begin with, and you cannot improve them. So you might as well accept yourself.

People create arbitrary systems of measurement by which they can believe they have improved, so that they don't have to face the fact that their entire life is just a slow march to death, impeded only by their instinctive desire to stay alive. We even design time in such a way as to avoid facing this fact. Why else would we represent it as a cycle that repeats rather than simply measured in a straight line from beginning to end? Because the latter reminds us too much of our mortality, and the former unconsciously conveys the false idea that things that go away will always come back. You cannot escape.
 

Hexis

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I use bluntness when I want make myself clear as crystal no matter who it might offend. Many of my friends find this to be one of my best attributes.

But when I deem it necessary ill lie, manipulate or blemish the truth to my advantage. I dont see this as anything bad or something I need to change. If anything I view at as one of my "talents" for Im pretty good at it.

Just cause people who are weak like to say these things are bad or not right doesn't mean they are. The ends justify the means, if your intentions are noble it doesn't mean the path that leads you their will be.

The world isnt black and white, its a shitty hue of gray.
 
G

Ginkgo

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Simple. Because self-improvement is just another illusion. You don't really improve yourself in terms of your goals or ambitions, you just become more skilled at rationalizing and achieving them in a tangible way. Your motivations and intentions, the things that really matter, will never be any better than they were to begin with, and you cannot improve them. So you might as well accept yourself.

No. I disagree.

Time moves in a linear fashion. It doesn't stay stagnant. Likewise, people change, and either become better or worse in various aspects.

If I just accept myself as I am, I might as well just slit my wrists right now and call it quits.
 

Thalassa

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Simple. Because self-improvement is just another illusion. You don't really improve yourself in terms of your goals or ambitions, you just become more skilled at rationalizing and achieving them in a tangible way. Your motivations and intentions, the things that really matter, will never be any better than they were to begin with, and you cannot improve them. So you might as well accept yourself.

People create arbitrary systems of measurement by which they can believe they have improved, so that they don't have to face the fact that their entire life is just a slow march to death, impeded only by their instinctive desire to stay alive. We even design time in such a way as to avoid facing this fact. Why else would we represent it as a cycle that repeats rather than simply measured in a straight line from beginning to end? Because the latter reminds us too much of our mortality, and the former unconsciously conveys the false idea that things that go away will always come back. You cannot escape.

+1
 

Athenian200

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No. I disagree.

Time moves in a linear fashion. It doesn't stay stagnant. Likewise, people change, and either become better or worse in various aspects.

If I just accept myself as I am, I might as well just slit my wrists right now and call it quits.

But who defines this improvement as meaningful? You do.

You won't slit your wrists now, for two reasons:

1. Survival instinct. That's what keeps you looking for ways to keep your mind occupied rather than just deciding that since you'll die eventually, you might as well get it over with to be efficient.

2. You can find meaning in anything. Most people find it in improvement, but you can also find meaning in accepting yourself. It can be more rewarding than you think.
 
G

Ginkgo

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People create arbitrary systems of measurement by which they can believe they have improved, so that they don't have to face the fact that their entire life is just a slow march to death, impeded only by their instinctive desire to stay alive. We even design time in such a way as to avoid facing this fact. Why else would we represent it as a cycle that repeats rather than simply measured in a straight line from beginning to end? Because the latter reminds us too much of our mortality, and the former unconsciously conveys the false idea that things that go away will always come back. You cannot escape.

And reminiscing in the inevitability of death gives one an excuse to never try and make something of their life. To never inspire those around them. To never help those in need.
 

Thalassa

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No. I disagree.

Time moves in a linear fashion. It doesn't stay stagnant. Likewise, people change, and either become better or worse in various aspects.

If I just accept myself as I am, I might as well just slit my wrists right now and call it quits.

Self-acceptance and forming authentic relationships are a huge part of any kind of 'real' self-improvement, I think for human beings in general, but even more so for an F.

"Better" and "worse" become more and more false categories to me as I grow older. A lot of what Athenian says is true, but please don't slit your wrists. :hug:
 

BerberElla

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Self-acceptance and forming authentic relationships are a huge part of any kind of 'real' self-improvement, I think for human beings in general, but even more so for an F.

"Better" and "worse" become more and more false categories to me as I grow older. A lot of what Athenian says is true, but please don't slit your wrists. :hug:

But how much self acceptance is really good for you? surely there are some things one should never just accept about themselves?
 

Thalassa

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And reminiscing in the inevitability of death gives one an excuse to never try and make something of their life. To never inspire those around them. To never help those in need.

It makes some people more thankful for what/who they have...the awareness of death makes some people live life more fully, more authentically.

I'm really sorry you're going through this.
 
G

Ginkgo

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Self-acceptance and forming authentic relationships are a huge part of any kind of 'real' self-improvement, I think for human beings in general, but even more so for an F.

"Better" and "worse" become more and more false categories to me as I grow older. A lot of what Athenian says is true, but please don't slit your wrists. :hug:

I won't, don't worry.

I hope you aren't misconstruing my use of the phrase "self acceptance" as something akin to "self acknowledgment".

Self-acknowledgment should be put first and foremost before self-improvement or self-acceptance.
 

Thalassa

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But how much self acceptance is really good for you? surely there are some things one should never just accept about themselves?

I think you misunderstand what I mean by 'acceptance.' I don't mean that I think every single thing about myself is wonderful and perfect, but I accept that I am human and therefore flawed and will never be "perfect." I am deserving of love just as I am, and so are other people.
 

BerberElla

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I think you misunderstand what I mean by 'acceptance.' I don't mean that I think every single thing about myself is wonderful and perfect, but I accept that I am human and therefore flawed and will never be "perfect." I am deserving of love just as I am, and so are other people.

I agree, but as a god damn perfectionist that's really hard to just accept lol ;) I find my version of accepting myself is more like depressed resignation that these flaws I hate may actually be part of me until the day I die.

I get what you are saying now though. :yes:
 

Thalassa

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I won't, don't worry.

I hope you aren't misconstruing my use of the phrase "self acceptance" as something akin to "self acknowledgment".

Self-acknowledgment should be put first and foremost before self-improvement or self-acceptance.

It's good to do things that you feel "better" yourself. It's great to have goals and to have something to look forward to. I am not disagreeing with that at all. I'm not suggesting you sit around and do nothing and be nihilistic.

I'm suggesting that you are a worthy human being even without "self-improvement."

Where ever you go, there you are. That's a Buddhist saying. I'm not trying to be vague - I'm just trying to illustrate that no matter how many external goals you set for yourself, you will still be you. There's another old saying that when you run away, the thing you're running away from is the first thing you pack.
 

Quinlan

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Perfect is overrated, so is idealism.
 

Thalassa

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Because they tell you a part of you is over-rated? :shock:

Idealist opens thread, gets told to accept themself, then gets told idealism is over-rated. :violin:

In a way they're both true, though. Yeah, idealists should accept ourselves for being idealists and continue to cherish our ideals. But sometimes it's also important to remember that there's a goodness is what is.


I see it less as a dichotomy and more as a paradoxical balance.
 
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