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  1. #41
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    Fidelia you hit the mark. I mean patience with the other person. More specifically, I mean patience during the early phase of the relationship when I already know that I like them, but they need however long to figure out if its reciprocated. I have often scared off girls that I pursue too vigorously before they have made up their mind about me.

    The biggest thing you can do to make an INFJ happy is be willing to listen to them vent (and in doing so you are bleeding off the emotional excess they are feeling so they can get on with problem solving - so you are actually performing a great service in getting on with the process) and also wanting to understand them. INFJs are very forgiving and pretty good at considering your interests, needs and points of view.
    I personally love to listen to other people vent about their issues. And I think one of the greatest pleasures of a deep relationship for me would be having the opportunity for someone else to tell me everything about themselves.

    I may not have the patience I need yet, but I'll listen, understand, and try to change myself if that's whats needed unto the ends of the Earth.
    Last edited by fidelia; 09-22-2010 at 06:34 PM.

  2. #42
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Where do you find your patience is most tried?

  3. #43
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    In daily life - dealing with those who are both malicious and ignorant

    In relationships - when I'm trying to understand but she wont tell me and expects me to mind read

  4. #44
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    patience for entjs is not allowing judgment and objectives to totally wholly completely define their relationship to reality. they get on an objective and anything thtat gets in the way or doesn't completely fit is WRONG. this is wrong. they need to open themselves up, expand their perspective, take in more information, circle the scene, replay it from many different angles, and get a better sense of what right is. they are often so pushy, directive, and forceful that they assume they are right without being patient enough to take the time to get the best information that will allow their Te to actually be smart. just slow down and wait for the right word, and you will be infinitely smarter than just spouting out whatever comes to the tip of your tongue when you are on full blast.

  5. #45
    Kraken down on piracy Lux's Avatar
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    I hope this will not be considered to be too off topic, it seems to fit. I have been with my ENTJ husband since we were both twenty (we're twenty-eight now), so in essence we grew up together. We have grown into a couple that's so solid it's beyond question our relationship could ever be severed. From the beginning I was attracted to his passion, knowledge, his articulation, his sincerity, humor, and his morals; but, I could easily have been lost in such a bright light, and he waited for me to catch up. That is not to say that I am dull, its more that I don't share much with people until I know it is safe. I can talk with anyone but not many people really know much about what makes me tick.

    The key to it all was that he waited for me, he waited for me to open up and tell him who I was. He let me tell him who I was. I felt he was truly interested in who I was, and the sincerity that I detected made all the difference. I wanted someone to want to know me. I wanted someone to try and figure me out. He did and he kept with it, which was the most important part.

    It seems to me that the defining moment was when he decided to wait and see what unfolded. It goes back to what everyone here was talking about, the vital patience on the part of the ENTJ.

    I really think that the ENTJ/INFJ match can be perfect. Good luck!
    Last edited by Lux; 10-19-2009 at 12:04 PM. Reason: Grammer
    "It is not length of life, but depth of life." ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Thought breeds thought." ~ Henry David Thoreau

  6. #46
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    Thanks for sharing that post was VERY illuminating.

  7. #47
    Junior Member pragmatic_skeptic8's Avatar
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    I think you're right on here Fidelia. Mature ENTJs can and do allow themselves to be vulnerable and real about their feelings sometimes. I can do it and enjoy doing it, although it is definitely not my strongest suit, nor do I do it without seriously assessing when, how much and with whom I make myself vulnerable. I've been careless about these in the past, much to my detriment. Now I prefer to be selective about whom I trust with that kind of contact.

    I also agree with you regarding how to base a relationship with an ENTJ. S/he would need to respect the INFJs independence and value what s/he is doing/creating on their own as much as the ENTJ does his/her own work. To have one's partner be a rose on a lapel primarily is arrogant and selfish. A mutual recognition of each other as equally centric would be more appropriate. What sort of things do you think ENTJs and INFJs could create/work on together? Maybe some kind of project with deliverables benefitting people, communities, individuals, and nonhumans, with a scope requiring an ENTJ approach on some level as well?
    Form is none other than emptiness; emptiness is not separate from form.

    Recognize the truth, maintain the view, rest in spontaneous liberation.

    Whenever possible, act decisively, with intent and execute skillfully. When this is impossible, avoid acting until it becomes possible, or improvise and act conservatively.

    What is your vision? How do you make it come alive?

  8. #48
    Junior Member pragmatic_skeptic8's Avatar
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    Thank you for sharing this insight about your story. It is very encouraging. I have not been an especially patient ENTJ, often far less than patient, but your saying this encourages me to practice it more since your husband found it so worthwhile. Indeed, may I too enjoy that same fortune and have such a solid relationship.
    Form is none other than emptiness; emptiness is not separate from form.

    Recognize the truth, maintain the view, rest in spontaneous liberation.

    Whenever possible, act decisively, with intent and execute skillfully. When this is impossible, avoid acting until it becomes possible, or improvise and act conservatively.

    What is your vision? How do you make it come alive?

  9. #49
    Junior Member pragmatic_skeptic8's Avatar
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    I see we are hearing the same message. Glad you're recognizing it and speaking transparently to that effect
    Form is none other than emptiness; emptiness is not separate from form.

    Recognize the truth, maintain the view, rest in spontaneous liberation.

    Whenever possible, act decisively, with intent and execute skillfully. When this is impossible, avoid acting until it becomes possible, or improvise and act conservatively.

    What is your vision? How do you make it come alive?

  10. #50
    Junior Member pragmatic_skeptic8's Avatar
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    While I think this question was directed @Disco, I'd like to answer also.

    I was in a relationship with an ENFP woman for about six months recently. We clashed often and competed with each other to lead and set terms and goals. I let her lead, but this was bad, because then I wasn't very invested and took the situation for granted. When I wanted to be more invested, she could not or would not let me lead. Things quickly fell apart thereafter.

    Last year I was seeing a friend I was interested in dating. I'm not sure what her type was, definitely introverted, probably N/S borderline, definitely Fe, and probably J. She was so closed and private that I felt I couldn't trust her, because she shared so little of real significance to me about herself. Her guardedness, and distance was too much for me to accept, and I lost patience with her extraordinarily slow, open-ended pace after a couple of months, although it could have been a match had I had a different attitude.

    I really like the open-ness of E over the closed-ness of I (as I've found it), although the ENFP combination wasn't as interesting to me as I had hoped, as I did not find her intellectually interesting, which is crucial for my liking someone.
    Form is none other than emptiness; emptiness is not separate from form.

    Recognize the truth, maintain the view, rest in spontaneous liberation.

    Whenever possible, act decisively, with intent and execute skillfully. When this is impossible, avoid acting until it becomes possible, or improvise and act conservatively.

    What is your vision? How do you make it come alive?

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