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Thread: NFs with NFs

  1. #1
    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Default NFs with NFs

    Here is a descripton of the NF "Mating Style", and of the NF-NF pairing, taken from the following link: Intuitive Feeler (NF)Empathist.

    (My apologies if there is another thread about this.)


    Relationships are the central concern for the existence of the intuitive feeling (EMPATHIST) type. Values are what matter in life.

    As an EMPATHIST you strive for a special union, a mystical connection, a knowledge of the other that is so profound that words aren't needed for communication. The EMPATHIST wants to make a mystical connection with one special partner: growing, learning, understanding, maturing, as a continuous process throughout life.

    Coming to know oneself, coming to understand one's needs, one's fears, one's strengths, one's intuition, one's sensitivity: that is the mission of the EMPATHIST.

    The EMPATHIST spares no time, energy or commitment in relationships. The EMPATHIST will compromise all other parts of life for the sake of caring, for the sake of satisfying the life-mission.

    The EMPATHIST hopes to find a partner to share life's journey. The EMPATHIST seeks a fellow pilgrim open enough and flexible enough to encounter self and mate without pretense or facade, to embrace the unfolding process without reservation, to love unconditionally, to accept another totally and to be accepted in return.

    The EMPATHIST generally sees this lifetime as an interlude, a preface to some more cosmic form of existence and being.

    Joan of Arc was an EMPATHIST. They thought she was crazy and they burned her at the stake. EMPATHISTs: take this as a serious harbinger of the fate that befalls you idealistic souls who search for a flawless relationship, especially with any of the other temperamental types!

    The EMPATHIST is romance personified. The phrase ``falling in love'' was certainly coined to describe this type. Love may come with a glance, a single word.

    The object of an EMPATHIST's affection will be called ``dear'' and ``honey'' and original pet names. ``I love you'' will punctuate each phone conversation and note. The EMPATHIST wants to spend every moment with the loved one or at least a lot of time. Taking care of the mate is a reflexive activity for EMPATHISTs, and gift giving is a natural part of any EMPATHIST love relationship.

    The EMPATHIST is usually more interested in romantic possibilities than in the day-to-day reality of relationships. Thus, when disillusionment strikes, when the relationship degenerates to humdrum predictability and staleness, the EMPATHIST may immediately begin eying the greener grass on the other side of the fence. Then the honeymoon is usually over for good!

    The EMPATHIST can use that characteristic sensitivity to tune in to every ripple of mood and sentiment in a mate. Or the EMPATHIST can become destructively hypersensitive and suspicious. In the course of any relationship, both modes usually occur.

    For the EMPATHIST, sex is fraught with meaning. The EMPATHIST overwhelmed by love aches for union. The EMPATHIST, angry about some routine matter, can't think about sex. Everything must be right, the mood, the setting, the person. Sex may always be an on-again, off-again thing for EMPATHISTs in the usual up and down love relationship.

    The EMPATHIST's conflicts with all the other types will revolve around definitions of the words relationship and love. The EMPATHIST's meaning for these terms is central to the EMPATHIST identity. The EMPATHIST's frustration and pain over missed communications and hurt feelings are totally incomprehensible to all the other types.

    A chronically broken heart is a way of life for many searching, seeking EMPATHISTs.


    When Like Likes Like, or
    When (NF)Empathists Mate


    Stolen glances, romantic meetings, exotic flirtations, painful infatuation, smoldering passion, shivering sighs and shuddering palpitations, willing self-disclosure, tearful pledges of commitment, intense intimacy, and almost mystical fireworks are t he way EMPATHIST-EMPATHIST love relationships begin.

    Disillusionment, hypersensitivity, hurt feelings, tears, a cosmic sense of abandonment, and a broken- hearted depression which can be alleviated only by a new romance: that's how EMPATHIST- EMPATHIST love relationships end.

    To EMPATHISTs, love is such a roller coaster that other types must wonder if the ``goin' up is worth the comin' down,'' but that's the way passion operates among these temperamental types. These are the relationships that F. Scott Fitzgerald herald ed.

    When EMPATHISTs mate, their shared idealism is usually involved: a common quest, a spiritual commitment, a philosophical common-ground.

    Relationship, per se, usually is a conscious focus of life, as is the exploration, expression and perfection of self. Combining those two objectives often presses EMPATHIST mates toward a continual redefinition and reworking of the relationship: a process of evolution and growth.

    With such change comes a sense of excitement, aliveness, newness; with it, also, comes some degree of turmoil and discomfort.

    Growth is the goal, the process, the pitfall and the glory of EMPATHIST-EMPATHIST matings.

    When two EMPATHISTS are in a situation which allows them to share their intuition and feeling, they are happiest. That's when the relationship usually works best: sharing a spiritual experience, critiquing a play.

    Unfortunately, most real-world relationships involve a certain amount of ``taking care of business'': attending to the sensing and thinking demands of society (working for a living, washing dishes, doing laundry, taking out trash, paying bills, keeping the car running and the house repaired, going to the grocery, the cleaners, the PTA, and such). So, in a typical pair-bonding situation, EMPATHIST couples need to volunteer for, delegate, or otherwise cover the reality chores of living together. And that's not usually an easily hurdled obstacle.

    One of the first major adjustments that occurs in most EMPATHIST pairings is that one (or both) of them appears to change type. The one who's less gung-ho as an intuitive may be transformed into an (SP)REALIST or an (SJ)LEGALIST. The one whose preference for feeling is less strong may take on the robes of the ``thinker.'' Pretty soon, you might be hard-pressed to recognize them as EMPATHISTS.

    Then, you can bet, one or both feels compromised, dishonest with the inner self, and resentful of the other and of the relationship. ``The grass is always greener'' phenomenon may strike particularly hard when two EMPATHISTS try to carry on a long-term relationship.

    Ah, but in its moments of glory, the EMPATHIST couple is the stuff of which sonnets are written! Since communication skills are peak for this temperamental type, speech and writing about love's ups and downs are likely to be part of the relationship : poems, notes, letters, and heartfelt telephone conversations may punctuate the days and nights.

    Communication, in a general sense, is of interest to the EMPATHIST couple. Critiquing plays, stories and novels is an accepted dinner-time conversation, and the fine-honing of personal philosophy is usually somewhere at the heart of these sharing experiences. Do EMPATHISTS talk (and talk) about their relationship? Do they breathe?

    Two EMPATHISTS together may become ``self-actualization'' junkies: following one personal development or spiritual training experience after another, sharing meaningful books and films, following after one or another guru. When there's no money in the budget for frills, there may still be funds for group therapy or private counseling sessions. The quest for self and identity is unceasing for many, if not most, EMPATHIST types, especially when they can feed off each other's energy and commitment.

    In a connected relationship, EMPATHISTs tend to ponder the meaning and significance of every gesture, posture, glance, expression, word and silence. EMPATHISTs, in their own unique way, probably ``work'' at love more than any other type, and when carried to extreme the continual analysis of what everything means can be exhausting, even to another EMPATHIST! It may be very difficult for two EMPATHISTs to ``lighten up'' when it comes to just enjoying a relationship.

    In their most intense state of connection, the EMPATHIST pair is almost psychic: anticipating each other's mood swings, wants, needs, fears, dreams, thoughts and aspirations, without ever speaking.

    As one EMPATHIST woman put it: ``We have our hard times, sure, but we have times together when we breathe in rhythm; I feel his thoughts. I hurt with him. I sense his joy. And he's capable of feeling me the same way. We can tell each other our deepest thoughts. I wouldn't trade that kind of connection for anything!''

    But, when the magic needs a tuneup, the dark side of that EMPATHIST sensitivity may rear its head. Suspicion, paranoia, hypersensitivity, and other products of runaway imagination may pollute every interaction, color every communication.

    ``Somehow, she got the impression that I was having an affair. I wasn't. I told her I wasn't. Then she got angry because she could accept the fact that there was another person, but not the fact that I was lying. Except there wasn't another person, and I wasn't lying.

    ''For one crazy minute, I thought it might be easier to lie, tell her I was having an affair that she was right and make her feel better. But I didn't, because I don't like to lie to her!

    ``Now she says she thinks she knows who the person is a good friend of ours and she's going to confront her. But I'm not having an affair! Now what do I do? When she confronts our friend and she denies it, she'll just assume that it's another lie! I can't win!''

    These are some of the troublesome typical pitfalls of the EMPATHIST-EMPATHIST pairing, but we've only been looking at the aspects that are generated by the ``temperamental cornerstone'' of iNtuition and Feeling. As we said in the ``Introduction to Insight,'' these are important characteristics, but not the only ones.

    First of all, the partner whose preference for intuition is stronger may see the other as a sensor! And the partner who's most comfortable with ``pure'' feeling may regard the other as a hard-hearted thinking type.

    In other words, EMPATHIST couples who differ markedly in the strength of their preferences for feeling and intuition may actually regard each other as ``foreign'' types!

    Other important conflicts and misunderstandings may revolve around the dimensions of judging-perception and introversion-extraversion.

    For example, an EMPATHIST who prefers judging may consider a perceptive-type partner to be unclear on personal values or inadequately committed to the relationship or to other ``causes.'' The perceptive, in turn, may call the judge narrow-minded and rigid, both in terms of defining the relationship and pursuing personal goals. In either case, they may minimize their areas of compatibility and focus instead on their differences.

    By the same token, introverted EMPATHISTS may find their need for peace, privacy, and personal territory continually violated by extraverted EMPATHISTS, whose requests for socializing, contact, conversation, compliments and other strokes and feedback are frustrated by introverted partners.

    Neither may recognize the other as a kindred soul because their needs for interaction are so different.

    The significance of differences along the introversion-extraversion dimension cannot be overstated. Even though they're both EMPATHIST temperamental types, an ENFP and an INFP represent vastly different personality styles in a close relationship. And an ENFJ and an INFJ may have to work very hard at understanding each other's needs even though they have three out of four of the personality factors in common.

    1. NFs, have you been with other NFs?

    .....If so, does this description ring true to you?


    2. If you are an NF currently in a relationship with another NF, how is it going?

    .....What, if any, are the main issues you struggle with?

    .....Any tips for other NFs with NFs?


    3. If you're curious about the NF-NF pairing, does this description help you at all?


    Your feedback would be very much appreciated.
    __________________


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    IT'S BEEN FUN.

    TAKE CARE.

    PEACE OUT!!!


  2. #2
    brainheart
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    1. NFs, have you been with other NFs?


    It's likely that he was.

    .....If so, does this description ring true to you?

    aspects, maybe if the volume was turned down from 11 to 2. Who wrote this description... a romance novelist?

    One of the first major adjustments that occurs in most EMPATHIST pairings is that one (or both) of them appears to change type. The one who's less gung-ho as an intuitive may be transformed into an (SP)REALIST or an (SJ)LEGALIST. The one whose preference for feeling is less strong may take on the robes of the ``thinker.'' Pretty soon, you might be hard-pressed to recognize them as EMPATHISTS.

    Then, you can bet, one or both feels compromised, dishonest with the inner self, and resentful of the other and of the relationship. ``The grass is always greener'' phenomenon may strike particularly hard when two EMPATHISTS try to carry on a long-term relationship.
    I think this seems quite likely, although I think it also could be true for SFP/NF pairings.

  3. #3
    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post

    aspects, maybe if the volume was turned down from 11 to 2. Who wrote this description... a romance novelist?
    LOL--I don't know.

    Maybe it was written by an ENFP.
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    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    It seems a little highly coloured to me. I nearly ended up dating an INFP, but he was going through a low point and as such was self-destructing. I think I enjoyed the shared sense of humour, his creativity, thoughtfulness and so on. Overall, I could see how it could work. I've heard people highly recommend ENFJ/INFJ. I think it probably is true though that they end up taking on one of the other three categories in an effort to compensate for weaknesses within the pairing.

    Wonka, you and the wife are INFP/ENFP. Do you think it helps that you both use Fi, or would Fi/Fe be a better balance even if it is less comfortable? Do you have any observations for us that would be useful? I've wondered about the NF-NF matchup for some time...

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    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post

    Wonka, you and the wife are INFP/ENFP. Do you think it helps that you both use Fi, or would Fi/Fe be a better balance even if it is less comfortable? Do you have any observations for us that would be useful? I've wondered about the NF-NF matchup for some time...
    Well, I think that the NF-NF pairing is a great one, for all of the reasons listed in the quote. And I think it's also a challenging one, for all of the reasons listed in the quote.

    There are two things in particular which stand out to me:

    The EMPATHIST hopes to find a partner to share life's journey. The EMPATHIST seeks a fellow pilgrim open enough and flexible enough to encounter self and mate without pretense or facade, to embrace the unfolding process without reservation, to love unconditionally, to accept another totally and to be accepted in return.
    When two EMPATHISTS are in a situation which allows them to share their intuition and feeling, they are happiest. That's when the relationship usually works best: sharing a spiritual experience, critiquing a play.
    This is the "glue" holding our marriage together.

    We definitely have all of the above.

    The challenge really comes in with things like this:

    Unfortunately, most real-world relationships involve a certain amount of ``taking care of business'': attending to the sensing and thinking demands of society (working for a living, washing dishes, doing laundry, taking out trash, paying bills, keeping the car running and the house repaired, going to the grocery, the cleaners, the PTA, and such). So, in a typical pair-bonding situation, EMPATHIST couples need to volunteer for, delegate, or otherwise cover the reality chores of living together. And that's not usually an easily hurdled obstacle.
    And as far as Fi versus Fe, I think it would be pretty challenging for me to be with a Dominant or Secondary Fe user.

    My general discomfort with Fe is certainly part of it, but I think it has more to do with the J preference clashing with my preference for P.

    As was stated in the quote:

    For example, an EMPATHIST who prefers judging may consider a perceptive-type partner to be unclear on personal values or inadequately committed to the relationship or to other ``causes.'' The perceptive, in turn, may call the judger narrow-minded and rigid, both in terms of defining the relationship and pursuing personal goals. In either case, they may minimize their areas of compatibility and focus instead on their differences.
    This seems like a major problem to me.

    I think I'm better off with another Perceiver.


    I think any two types can have a successful marriage---there are just some inherent challenges for each type match, and I believe that some matches might be better than others.

    Though some opposite qualities may be a good compliment, it seems that having similar preferences in certain areas is critical.

    I think N-N and S-S is extremely important.

    After that, I think that J-J and P-P may be pretty important.

    Not sure after that. Maybe the same temperament (NF-NF, SJ-SJ, NT-NT, and SP-SP).


    In any case, I think NF-NF is a good match, even with all the challenges that come with it.
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    I'M OUTTA HERE.

    IT'S BEEN FUN.

    TAKE CARE.

    PEACE OUT!!!


  6. #6
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    It seems a little highly coloured to me. I nearly ended up dating an INFP, but he was going through a low point and as such was self-destructing. I think I enjoyed the shared sense of humour, his creativity, thoughtfulness and so on. Overall, I could see how it could work. I've heard people highly recommend ENFJ/INFJ. I think it probably is true though that they end up taking on one of the other three categories in an effort to compensate for weaknesses within the pairing.

    Wonka, you and the wife are INFP/ENFP. Do you think it helps that you both use Fi, or would Fi/Fe be a better balance even if it is less comfortable? Do you have any observations for us that would be useful? I've wondered about the NF-NF matchup for some time...
    i think it works pretty well. it is but one way of grouping priorities, so it makes sense to use these as a guide to understand how you would relate to someone and have similar life goals.

    i prefer cognitive functions that i find desirable, agreeable, and complementary. i prefer N doms first and foremost in terms of sheer communicability, but i also have certain enneagram types who inspire me and i find attractive (7, 4, 5, and sometimes 6 and 9 work well for me too). nf is high on the priority list, anyone who doesn't have a strong desire for self-actualization is dead to me, but nt types often have this too- it just sometimes comes in a different package depending on enneagram defense. infps and intps are really viable mates for infj too, i find- enfj would be really tough, i can't imagine myself with enfj or entj.

    throughout the course of my life sparks have *almost* exclusively been with other nfs. a few other isfjs and sfps.

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    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I know, I've thought about all the pros and cons of each letter in a mate. Even theoretically, I can't make it work! I want it all!

    I've also thought that it would be better to stick to INFP/ENFP or INFJ/ENFJ if it were NF-NF. Then I wondered if that would leave too many areas where there were gaps that we both were missing.

    What do you think about the P vs J thing with some of the classic pairings of INFJ-ENTP or INFP-ENTJ? I really don't know enough NTs in real life or have an extensive enough knowledge of the functions to know if that would be as clashy as the NF-NF fight between J and P.

    Do you think Enneagram type makes any difference, or NF subtype if you want to call it that? For example, I know with INFJs there are at least three distinct varieties of them. Does that skew the outcome of different pairings with other NFs?

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    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    I find the biggest issue in an NF-NF paring is conflicting values. If the values don't conflict it shouldn't be that bad.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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    i was with a great ENFJ on and off (mostly on really) for about three and a half years... i fascinated her and drove her crazy at the same time... *unbelievable* chemistry... i loved her a ton and i had (still have) a lot of respect for her... she liked listening to music but did not have a musical fiber in her body, that was a huge downer for me as it's tough not to be able to share at least a bit of my passion with my lover... at the end my tendency to spend too much time off in my own world and lack of daily structure in my life is probably what did it in... LOT of p/j conflicts and as hard as we loved each other we were super good at hurting each other and mindf-ing each other as well... it was INTENSE. big ups and big downs. amazing experience... we taught each other a ton, helped each other a ton, and grew up a lot together. i look forward to something more even keeled and to the "up" next time i'm in a long-term.....
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