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  1. #61
    brainheart
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    Through the years I have noticed that if I truly open up and express how I feel, people think I am childish, immature, concerned about unimportant things, selfish, defending the wrong person/wrong cause, making things up, living in a fantasy world.

    I think the perfect example of the INFP experience is the Calvin and Hobbes when he is signed up for baseball during recess. They put him in the outfield because no one wants him on their team. The teams switch, he's still in the outfield, he actually finally catches the ball and he's so proud of himself, but it's for the wrong team so everyone yells at him and tells him he's an idiot. I still have a hard time reading that comic, it resonates far too well.

    The only time I feel like I am appreciated by others is when I listen to them and help them out with their lives. If I ever try to talk about myself or my concerns, I'm a greedy bastard. The fact that I'm happy writing/playing music but don't care all that much about getting it published or being successful makes others wonder when I am going to 'make something of myself'. It's like I can't win.

    And I'm sure many others are going to read this and think I'm whining. 'Fucking deal' they will say. 'That's life. Get over yourself.' Years of not knowing how to interact with others the way others seem to so naturally can take it's toll. It's exhausting and it's gotten to the point that I don't talk to anyone freely other than my kids, because I know they respect and appreciate me and aren't going to tell me my concerns or interests are a waste of time or ridiculous. For now, anyway.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Through the years I have noticed that if I truly open up and express how I feel, people think I am childish, immature, concerned about unimportant things, selfish, defending the wrong person/wrong cause, making things up, living in a fantasy world.
    I have noticed that too. I have several people in my life that has told me to open up and be honest. The moment I do open up, they give me the most negative reaction possible. Now I don't need people to agree with my feelings or my opinions, but I want them to acknowledge that I am feeling this way and they should respect that.

    I end up closing myself off from those people again and they get confused why. Then when I explain to them why the process repeats again and I feel like shit.

    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    The only time I feel like I am appreciated by others is when I listen to them and help them out with their lives. If I ever try to talk about myself or my concerns, I'm a greedy bastard. The fact that I'm happy writing/playing music but don't care all that much about getting it published or being successful makes others wonder when I am going to 'make something of myself'. It's like I can't win.
    Wow.... This sounds so familiar.

    People seem to think that a person's worth can be measured by the person's career choices.

    I have a friend who work at Hooters. She is a nice hard working girl who treats her consumers very well. She is independent with her own apartment which she pays for by herself. She pays her own food and clothes too. As of right now she is happy with her life.

    Once in a while we come across people who thinks she is worthless because of her job title. This gets me pissed. ANYONE WHO THINKS LOW OF OTHERS FOR WORKING HARD AND NOT BEING A BURDEN IN SOCIETY SHOULD DIE!!!!!!!.......

    Ok maybe what I just said was extreme. The point is there are jerks out there who are so selfish to think that someone's career choice is suppose to "oohhh" and "aaaahhh" them for entertainment purpose.

  3. #63
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Through the years I have noticed that if I truly open up and express how I feel, people think I am childish, immature, concerned about unimportant things, selfish, defending the wrong person/wrong cause, making things up, living in a fantasy world.

    The only time I feel like I am appreciated by others is when I listen to them and help them out with their lives. If I ever try to talk about myself or my concerns, I'm a greedy bastard.
    Quote Originally Posted by sunshinebrighter View Post
    I have noticed that too. I have several people in my life that has told me to open up and be honest. The moment I do open up, they give me the most negative reaction possible. Now I don't need people to agree with my feelings or my opinions, but I want them to acknowledge that I am feeling this way and they should respect that.
    I've experienced this as well. I've never been called whiny, to my face anyway, but I have been told by different people that I "have a wall up". However, when I respond to their attempts to get me to open up, they often just cut me off impatiently.

    I guess that is why I take offense at the whiny label. I'm not allowed to be whiny even if I wanted to be. And yet, I hear tons of whining all around me. I'm the person to call up when you want to whine and get some support, because I will actually listen to people and not trivialize their feelings. I rarely get that kind of support returned to me though, and if I ask for it or fall for whatever trick they're throwing at me to "open up", then apparently I am self-absorbed.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  4. #64
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Through the years I have noticed that if I truly open up and express how I feel, people think I am childish, immature, concerned about unimportant things, selfish, defending the wrong person/wrong cause, making things up, living in a fantasy world.
    Yeah, I know how you feel. All it takes is a couple of influential people in our lives to do that to us for awhile, and it really screws up our head. Despite the progress I've made, when I open up I still feel like the person is judging me in that way, even when it's pretty clear they aren't.

    The thing is that type of behavior often reflects on the person judging you more than it does on you. Did you ever wonder why they can't listen to your issues without judging you negatively, despite you having been there for them?

    It takes a pretty strong person to be able to listen to another person's problems. Weaker people usually can't be bothered, and it's a shame INFPs automatically assume such people are better than us, just because they judge us negatively.

    The only time I feel like I am appreciated by others is when I listen to them and help them out with their lives. If I ever try to talk about myself or my concerns, I'm a greedy bastard.
    That's a pretty common INFP mentality, and something that makes it hard for us INFPs to value ourselves. Even our title, "The Healer", pretty much suggests that our value as people, and our 'role', comes from what we do for others. Well, what happens when we want to focus on ourselves for awhile? Do we lose our value at that point?

    Yet another reason I think the INFP profile can be rejected by INFPs.

  5. #65
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Through the years I have noticed that if I truly open up and express how I feel, people think I am childish, immature, concerned about unimportant things, selfish, defending the wrong person/wrong cause, making things up, living in a fantasy world.

    And I'm sure many others are going to read this and think I'm whining. 'Fucking deal' they will say. 'That's life. Get over yourself.' Years of not knowing how to interact with others the way others seem to so naturally can take it's toll.
    Don't get me wrong, I don't think there is anything wrong with expressing feelings, including more melancholy feelings. I just noticed that there tends to be an overall pessimistic, martyr-ish tone to the complaining which does not seem at all proportional to circumstances; and in general there is more complaining than one would expect from the average person. INFPs aren't any more impaired in the world than are INTPs or INFJs, for example. Which is why I ask if there is something within the INFP type that makes them see themselves as being continuously hurt by the world, and that others are much better off than they. I think it's more a matter of perception than anything else.

  6. #66
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I don't think there is anything wrong with expressing feelings, including more melancholy feelings. I just noticed that there tends to be an overall pessimistic, martyr-ish tone to the complaining which does not seem at all proportional to circumstances; and in general there is more complaining than one would expect from the average person. INFPs aren't any more impaired in the world than are INTPs or INFJs, for example. Which is why I ask if there is something within the INFP type that makes them see themselves as being continuously hurt by the world, and that others are much better off than they. I think it's more a matter of perception than anything else.

    See, you say that, and I know I shouldn't take it personally, but I do. Maybe that's the thing; I take criticism pretty personally, even if it isn't intended to be so. Couple that with the fact that I pretty much feel the feelings of every living thing surrounding me, real or imagined, and it adds up. And then when I talk about these feelings I get shut down, so then I shut up, and I can basically have no release for every feeling out there for a big chunk of time, so when I finally do talk, maybe there is a twinge of the melancholic or the pessimistic or the martyr. It's like pressurized feeling, exploding. And it happens for me about once every few years. Maybe it seems more extreme at the time to others, but considering how my sister expects me to listen to her boyfriend woes for a good hour once every few weeks, I don't think it's all that extreme. (Other INFPs good to hear you relate in this respect.)

    Imagine this: I don't know if it's this way for you, LaurenAshley, but opening my mail can be a semi-traumatic experience. Every nonprofit that rescues tortured tigers or cares for elderly impoverished Native Americans knows what a chump I am, so I am on leagues of mailing lists, asking for money. And I can't help but give. I try to be tough and not even acknowledge it, but there is so much suffering and hardship out there and I have it so good. I am putty in every one of their charitable hands, with their pictures of emaciated horses and stories of genocide. So I donate. But this doesn't make me feel good about myself, because those stories of the evil humans can do are stuck with me in a very visceral way and I can't just shrug it off. It becomes a part of my feelings, like it or not.

  7. #67
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    See, you say that, and I know I shouldn't take it personally, but I do. Maybe that's the thing; I take criticism pretty personally, even if it isn't intended to be so.
    Yeah, I do too. I pretty much have accepted that I'm going to take the hit when someone criticizes me, and there's not anything I can do about it. (Actually, that's not true, but I don't like who I become when I toughen myself up like that.)

    So I've just had to learn to accept that part of myself, and not use it as an excuse to listen to and ask for constructive criticism about my potential flaws. Once I shoulder the initial blow, I'm usually more open to evaluate the possible merits (or lack thereof) of their statements.

    Couple that with the fact that I pretty much feel the feelings of every living thing surrounding me, real or imagined, and it adds up.
    I get squeamish when I see a fly get killed. Seriously. I remember telling someone that once and getting joked pretty hard about it, and I remember thinking about how it's not like I chose to feel it. I just do. And I didn't really understand why their lack of empathy gave them the right to look down on me in that regard.

    Still, it doesn't give me an excuse to not be functional. If a fly gets inside and is all over my fresh food with its germs, it needs to go down! Most people don't understand how much we have to overcome to do what to them, is very basic. (And I'm not saying that looking for pity either. It simply is what it is.)

  8. #68
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    See, you say that, and I know I shouldn't take it personally, but I do. Maybe that's the thing; I take criticism pretty personally, even if it isn't intended to be so. Couple that with the fact that I pretty much feel the feelings of every living thing surrounding me, real or imagined, and it adds up. And then when I talk about these feelings I get shut down, so then I shut up, and I can basically have no release for every feeling out there for a big chunk of time, so when I finally do talk, maybe there is a twinge of the melancholic or the pessimistic or the martyr. It's like pressurized feeling, exploding. And it happens for me about once every few years. Maybe it seems more extreme at the time to others, but considering how my sister expects me to listen to her boyfriend woes for a good hour once every few weeks, I don't think it's all that extreme. (Other INFPs good to hear you relate in this respect.)
    I can relate to this also. So many people do dump their issues on me that I can feel like I am carrying the emotional burden of many people, but I cannot even express it in words much of the time, or I am not given a chance to. I just feel it, and it builds for awhile, and on the rare occasion when I can express it, it probably seems a bit dramatic. Since I rarely have anyone who would listen anyway, I just write something or draw or play a song.

    In a larger sense, I do feel like the weight of the world's problems are on top of me. I'm always visualizing ways to solve large problems in society. It's super cheesy to say that, but it's what leads INFPs to take up causes and fight for what they believe.

    I guess if it gives a martyr attitude, it's because we do sacrifice a part of ourselves, our mental peace, to ease the minds of other people. Sure, we could walk away, but sometimes my empathy becomes engaged against my logical will. My sense of what is right would be violated to turn someone away when I am equipped to help them. The person is really just a symbol to me of something greater.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  9. #69
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I can relate to this also. So many people do dump their issues on me that I can feel like I am carrying the emotional burden of many people, but I cannot even express it in words much of the time, or I am not given a chance to. I just feel it, and it builds for awhile, and on the rare occasion when I can express it, it probably seems a bit dramatic. Since I rarely have anyone who would listen anyway, I just write something or draw or play a song.
    I've often felt like an emotional sponge, soaking up the negative emotions of others. If I'm not allowed to wring that out, it becomes saturated and drips all over the floor as I walk around and go about my life.

    I sort of consider INFPs to be to the emotional what ESTPs are to the physical. Think about it.

  10. #70
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies, you all. It's similar to what I've heard from other INFPs, and I can definitely relate to some of what you've said. I'll be watching this thread if you have anything else to add. It's been a very successful thread thus far.

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