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  1. #721
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    So many rewards, so little work, in my opinion (biased, a tad).

  2. #722
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ergophobe View Post
    So many rewards, so little work, in my opinion (biased, a tad).
    totally right??

    no one is more tolerant than us.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  3. #723
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Or more fabulous! Most things/relationships worth having involve some work.

  4. #724
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ergophobe View Post
    Or more fabulous! Most things/relationships worth having involve some work.
    yeah!! and all we really want is the same acceptance we dole out...right? SO...not too much to ask.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  5. #725
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    yeah that's kinda what I meant - that whether you say 'I feel' or give concrete examples, or however you put it, essentially what you're doing is bringing up a problem you have with another person which, obviously, at least initially, you would consider to be at least partly their fault. So I'm just wondering how you could consider it possible that someone could feel hurt by something you've done or said, and yet still somehow raise the issue with you without in any way suggesting any fault on your part.

    That's the first part, and secondly, that even if that IS achieved, verbally at least, it's of little consequence if the other person still just interprets you wrongly anyway because of a tendency towards taking things personally and being overly defensive.

    I just don't get how you're supposed to say to someone "I'm upset because when X happened you said Y" - giving concrete example there and talking in terms of "I feel", WITHOUT it implicitly being a criticism, and implying blame on the other person's part.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

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  6. #726
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    well obviously it totally depends on the situation...but...if someone says...hey...i know you didn't know and didn't do it on purpose but when such and such happens it makes me feel this...it would help if you did this instead...i know you had no way of knowing that and i'm totally not upset...

    removing blame like that...takes away that need to be defensive...i think...obviously sometimes it IS their fault and you should just approach it however you want but...if it's about something they truly did not do on purpose and you just want the behavior changed...take away blame when discussing it.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  7. #727
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    yeah that's kinda what I meant - that whether you say 'I feel' or give concrete examples, or however you put it, essentially what you're doing is bringing up a problem you have with another person which, obviously, at least initially, you would consider to be at least partly their fault. So I'm just wondering how you could consider it possible that someone could feel hurt by something you've done or said, and yet still somehow raise the issue with you without in any way suggesting any fault on your part.

    That's the first part, and secondly, that even if that IS achieved, verbally at least, it's of little consequence if the other person still just interprets you wrongly anyway because of a tendency towards taking things personally and being overly defensive.

    I just don't get how you're supposed to say to someone "I'm upset because when X happened you said Y" - giving concrete example there and talking in terms of "I feel", WITHOUT it implicitly being a criticism, and implying blame on the other person's part.


    Okay I failed to keep up with this thread and wanted to address a couple of posts (yours, Jenocyde's and Lauren's in particular) but now it's just too much and I'm kinda lazy to read through all of that (oh no! I'm such the ENFP :P).

    Still, I just urge you to keep an open mind. I mean, I don't know the ENFPs you know but you are painting such a bleak picture...I've admitted to having messed up numerous times and also said I was sorry, and it seems you view ENFPs as the ultimate dismissive type or something...I mean that doesn't even add up when considering the other traits we are supposed to have.

    And I'm having a really hard time relating to the people you guys are describing. Any of my friends can approach me and speak their mind about what I just did or have done... I don't go apeshit or something lol



    I would like to, again, urge you people to not take MBTI without a grain of salt and specially to be mindful of "cognition does not equate behavior".

  8. #728
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Well obviously I'm talking about when they behave badly, as everyone is capable of behaving badly sometimes - yes, even ENFx's!!

    I'm not saying that all ENFP's or even the ones I know, behave this way all the time or make a habit of it. It's just how I've observed things going when they don't go well. And it's not just me either, there are other people on this thread remarking on just the same kind of behaviour and as jeno said, we don't know each other and haven't conferred and are all around the world, so it's not like we could, all of us, just happen to know ONLY the most dysfunctional ENFP's!
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

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  9. #729
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Well obviously I'm talking about when they behave badly, as everyone is capable of behaving badly sometimes - yes, even ENFx's!!

    I'm not saying that all ENFP's or even the ones I know, behave this way all the time or make a habit of it. It's just how I've observed things going when they don't go well. And it's not just me either, there are other people on this thread remarking on just the same kind of behaviour and as jeno said, we don't know each other and haven't conferred and are all around the world, so it's not like we could, all of us, just happen to know ONLY the most dysfunctional ENFP's!
    Yeah they also say ENFPs are giddy and drama queens. Is that supposed to mean something as far as my person is concerned?

    Stereotypes my friend... that's the whole point. And unresolved issues fuel the confirmation bias. You'll never see me say "type X are this or that" unless I'm joking.


    Of course, you can use this very post against me and say I'm beeing dismissive in ENFP fashion or some such thing...but that's what I'm saying...there seems to be no escaping the confirmation bias :P



    Like that ENFX comment...lol...what is that supposed to mean man? Is that even supposed to be a common stereotype?

  10. #730
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    Still, I just urge you to keep an open mind. I mean, I don't know the ENFPs you know but you are painting such a bleak picture...I've admitted to having messed up numerous times and also said I was sorry, and it seems you view ENFPs as the ultimate dismissive type or something...I mean that doesn't even add up when considering the other traits we are supposed to have.
    If I had to pick a favorite type as a whole, it would probably be a tie between ENFP and ENTP. My ENFP brother is one of the people I love most in the world. However, there is no denying in my mind that they have tendencies to dismiss criticism in any way they can and they get stuck in their own feelings to the exclusion of others' feelings. I know more than enough ENFPs to see this trend, and you can even witness it in this very thread. Every type has faults. I take the bad with the good.

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