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  1. #21
    lurking.... Wyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    I’m inclined to think it’s more a matter of being secure/insecure. To me, the term ‘maturity’ denotes growth that doesn’t easily retrograde.
    Hmm, not sure I agree. Like we've been saying there are many types of INFJs - maybe some are on different scales (a maturity scale/a security scale).

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyst View Post
    You've also got immature and mature INFJs - those who haven't grown up a lot in their MBTI and those who have - this also adds a new level of diversity within the INFJ type.

    I think most of the disparity between INFJs can be summed up by a combination of 1) is the INFJ comfortable in their own skin 2) is the INFJ continually holding people at arm's length.
    I'd say that some of the people I'm most guarded with are actually in situations where I am comfortable. It is precisely because I'm comfortable that I let people in close - yet when they're close is when they can hurt me the most.

    If I were insecure, I wouldn't have let them in to begin with. Once I've let them in, suddenly shutting them out because of my fears (which everyone has), despite wanting to be close to them, is silly, selfish, and self-centered - immature.

  2. #22
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyst View Post
    I'd say that some of the people I'm most guarded with are actually in situations where I am comfortable. It is precisely because I'm comfortable that I let people in close - yet when they're close is when they can hurt me the most.

    If I were insecure, I wouldn't have let them in to begin with. Once I've let them in, suddenly shutting them out because of my fears (which everyone has), despite wanting to be close to them, is silly, selfish, and self-centered - immature.
    I think the term 'insecure' has a negative stigma which is kind of interfering with the point I was trying to make.

    On a whole, I feel a lot more 'secure' than most of the people I know. I was trying to get at that 'comfortable in one's own skin' feeling. It just seems to me that it has a little bit less to do with maturity than it has to do with specific situation/immediate circumstance. (Though maturity is definitely a component.)
    Last edited by Z Buck McFate; 09-15-2009 at 03:01 PM. Reason: grammar
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

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  3. #23
    lurking.... Wyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    I think the term 'insecure' has a negative stigma which is kind of interfering with the point I was trying to make.
    lol - I think the same thing about stigmas can be said for 'immature' as well.

  4. #24
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyst View Post
    lol - I think the same thing about stigmas can be said for 'immature' as well.

    It's possible I was splitting hairs on the 'maturity/immaturity' thing. It just seems like I don't fly in and out of 'maturity' nearly as often as I fly in and out of feeling 'comfortable in my own skin'.

    Edit: In short, Wyst, I agree with you- I was just kind of experimenting with saying it in a different way?
    Last edited by Z Buck McFate; 09-15-2009 at 03:21 PM. Reason: add
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

    5w4 sx/sp Johari / Nohari

  5. #25
    lurking.... Wyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    It's possible I was splitting hairs on the 'maturity/immaturity' thing. It just seems like I don't fly in and out of 'maturity' nearly as often as I fly in and out of feeling 'comfortable in my own skin'.

    Edit: In short, Wyst, I agree with you- I was just kind of experimenting with saying it in a different way?
    I see what you're saying now. Word.

    Agreed - I don't fly in and out of maturity either. When I was talking about immature INFJs, I meant those who have yet to reach 'maturity' as an INFJ. I'd suspect once an INFJ hit it, wherever/whatever it is, they'd be reticent/unable to go back to the old ways.

  6. #26
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I agree with Sarcasticus that there seem to be a fairly diverse range of INFJs. However, in my personal experience: I am not highly J, I am fairly extroverted as long as I am in a comfortable setting, although I am definitely balanced in favour of F rather than being even with T. I like what Z Buck had to say about being comfortable in your own skin. I've found that as I've gotten older I've probably exhibited characteristics that were in me before but my inner editor was too strong at that time and I felt too uncomfortable to express them.

  7. #27
    Senior Member hokie912's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    I don't think anyone would confuse me for an extravert in real life; I can talk a lot when I'm interested in a topic and I can be somewhat outgoing, but I'm fundamentally a very reserved person. I'm confused for a thinking type online and irl because I keep the vast majority of my emotions inside and I try to approach discussions from an Ni-Ti standpoint. As for Perceiving, only if you think that P=disorganized, scatterbrained, and indecisive. Otherwise, I don't resemble a P.
    Very much the same for me. I'm reserved in my emotional expression and approach most discussions from a logical, often detached, Ni-driven standpoint. Depending on whether they've seen the more expressive side of me, some people might think I'm a T. And, unfortunately, a lot of people do think that P means scatterbrained and disorganized while J means organized and always on top of things. I frequently have to defend my J-ness to MBTI-interested friends. I've considered that I might be INFP, but ultimately I find that I have much more in common with other NJs.

  8. #28
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    I’m inclined to think it’s more a matter of being secure/insecure. To me, the term ‘maturity’ denotes growth that doesn’t easily retrograde. Feelings of security (or insecurity) are more transient and fluctuate differently according to different environments.

    In insecure situations, I am far less in touch with my cognitive process and/or my own personal strengths (where functions are concerned). In such scenarios I find myself trying to be as invisible as possible- if only in attempt to ‘observe’ without my thought process being interrupted. Whenever I’m not feeling particularly secure, yet it isn’t quite available to be ‘invisible’- my behavior is kind of ‘all over the place’ because I’m basically just blindly ‘mirroring’ whoever I’m interacting with (until the first moment I can get away).

    In environments where I feel more secure my behavior is much more grounded and consistent.

    It is related to maturity, however, in this sense: the more mature I get, the less I generally experience insecurity.

    Edit: another way to define 'insecure environment' is to call it 'foreign environment'. I don't feel (like Wyst said) 'comfortable in my own skin' in a foreign environment.
    perfect writing.

    what i get better at is partly maturity (which to me signifies smoothly shifting between functions, balancing, getting better information to deactivate bombs and to slow down runaway trains and stop the vicious cycles), partly maintenance (journaling, taking care of my body, finding constructive outlets, learning how to work), and most of all, constructing a positive social network that can help even me out at times, make me feel appreciated, connect with others positively, and help them in return. where you can use your best skills in a way that is appreciated and valued. which has a lot to do with finding other Ns.

    but yeah, you said it. security slips thru greasy fingers the moment you get fat and complacent. finding ways to expand at your own rate, adapt to new situations, ask of yourself the right questions that can help keep you on track and come closer to realistic expectations for yourself than previously, help you deal with the fluxiness of the unknown and the contentious.

  9. #29
    Kraken down on piracy Lux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    I don't think anyone would confuse me for an extravert in real life; I can talk a lot when I'm interested in a topic and I can be somewhat outgoing, but I'm fundamentally a very reserved person. I'm confused for a thinking type online and irl because I keep the vast majority of my emotions inside and I try to approach discussions from an Ni-Ti standpoint.
    ^ It's the same for me. When I first took the test I got INTJ, but I didn't really think it was an overall fit with me. Then after a while I took the test as I honestly felt as opposed to what I try to do and I got INFJ. The profile fit me much more. While I do use feeling I try to not let it overwhelm me. It's the same with me because I can actually be very outgoing, but I'm definitely not an extrovert.

  10. #30
    Member Goodewitch's Avatar
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    I think its evident that INFJ's are a mixed bag to some extent,.. as are all types.
    Wyst commented on mature/immature INFJ's.. but keeping people at arms length doesnt always constitute immaturity. One may WANT closeness with others, but as an extremely introverted and N person, I find it difficult to see past my own judgements and hunches about people,.. they're usually right, by the way. Ultimately, an INFJ I think, more than any other type, can forsee problems with people before they happen.
    I also have no interest in forcing myself to not hold people back, when i'm supremely uninterested in them, their ways, or their social merry go round, and I dont think thats immature.. that IS being comfortable in my own skin.
    My own conclusion from reading posts on here, from other INFJ's.. is that the bellcurve of E and I is quite wide in INFJ's. Myself being at the extreme I part of that curve, more than any others I've read posts from.
    Does that make me imature? hopefully not.
    G. x

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