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  1. #11
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by phoenix13 View Post
    I think it has to do with the confusion between extroversion and being social. ENFPs tend to be far less social than other Es. This is due to (1) depression/ being unhappy which causes us to withdraw, and more broadly: (2) extroverted intuition is not a readily understood language, and that makes social interaction less satisfying.

    Enjoying social contact isn't always easy. Having to explain the million loose associations that spring up in a single sentence gets old fast. People tend to not understand us, and/or dismiss us as eccentric, or some sort of entertaining prop to be enjoyed but not considered.

    Anyway, that's probably why many of us feel nonsocial and so mistaken ourselves for introverts.
    Great answer. Thanks.

    I think I kind of knew this, but it wasn't really coming up when I gave this topic some thought.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I think people get confused with what extroversion really is. I think it was Wonka that made an awesome post about extroversion being simply drawing things from outside of yourself for energy.. Be it nature, people, etc. Isolation from the outside world in general, not just people and socializing. People see extroversion and read people.
    I've always understood Introversion and Extroversion that way, too. Maybe because that's how my parents always separated the two, using that definition.

    I guess I am truly an Extrovert. I have a lot of tendencies that are common in introverts.

    I can be anti social.
    I am sort of a loner sometimes.
    I go through my 'emo' phases sometimes.
    I spend a great deal of time alone.
    I think I have a tiny bit of a problem with being socially awkward.

    But, nonetheless! I see extrovert. I do draw energy from external reaches, and I do really feel better after I have talked to someone about something, and introspection doesn't do a lot for me when trying to solve problems.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  2. #12
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Sorry I'm turning this into a 'me' topic. I've been wondering about it, about myself, but had no intentions of this turning into a self-centered discussion.

    proceed.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  3. #13
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    I didn't realize so many ENFPs wonder whether they are INFPs, I thought it was only the reverse.

    I think the stereotypes are more distracting when Ne is involved. Ne is an outside-the-box function that celebrates complexity so being pigeon-holed or picking sides will always feel uncomfortable.

    Also, (adding to the wonderful insight of BlackCat) Ne requires being out there, engaged in the world but also taking the time to step back, regroup and interpret what you've learnt before putting it out there again. It requires ENFPs to bridge the gap between introversion and extroversion more than other types, because Ne requires broader active involvement. Being both actively engaged and actively reflective.

  4. #14
    Senior Member SciVo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    Also, (adding to the wonderful insight of BlackCat) Ne requires being out there, engaged in the world but also taking the time to step back, regroup and interpret what you've learnt before putting it out there again. It requires ENFPs to bridge the gap between introversion and extroversion more than other types, because Ne requires broader active involvement. Being both actively engaged and actively reflective.
    Hmm... I was about to object since INFP also have strong Ne, so we could have the same problem in the opposite direction; but then I realized, we can get our active engagement from books. So never mind. ENTP might have the same problem though!
    INFP ~ Fi/Ne/Ni/Te ~ 9-2-4 sp/so

  5. #15
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SciVo View Post
    Hmm... I was about to object since INFP also have strong Ne, so we could have the same problem in the opposite direction; but then I realized, we can get our active engagement from books. So never mind. ENTP might have the same problem though!
    We can get our active engagement from within us. Or if we get something that piques our interest in the real world that's fine too, but unlike ENFPs we can be totally fine going off into Lala land in our own heads. ENFPs need to constantly feed their curiosity, their Ne is hardly insatiable at any one time. I think it's safe to say that INFPs aren't really like this...

    Our Fi is insatiable. We want to know the personal details so that we can understand people. I literally have a hard time understanding where someone is coming from fully unless they tell me their personal attachments to it and/or their opinions on a given thing. My curiosity is in the personal realm, not in the possibilities realm. I just really want to get to know people better, by gathering more and more personal details. I have been told that I have incredible insights into things dealing with people and situations, and this is just because I know these random personal details and I can put together a picture in my head. Sometimes I don't even know how I do it, it's like from knowing more and more about a situation and people I can literally make myself BE in that situation, knowing exactly the feelings and how people's feelings interconnect to create the situation. These things are like separate consciousnesses almost, I have my own mood that I am constantly aware of and monitoring, then in my psyche I have separate moods that are those of other people, I just generally have mini-big pictures in my head of individual people and this is added to by gaining more personal details.

    INFPs I think have all of these feelings in separate areas, but the feelings of others and those of a situation seem to spill over into their main mood, making them super emotional and very adaptive at the same time. I think I've learned to prevent this "spilling over" thing, but sometimes it still happens... It's like I feel the person/situation enough to where I am very in tune with it, but it doesn't directly affect my mood or state of mind unless it's some intense stuff.

    Just some food for thought... That is my emphasis on Fi for INFPs.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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  6. #16
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SciVo View Post
    Hmm... I was about to object since INFP also have strong Ne, so we could have the same problem in the opposite direction; but then I realized, we can get our active engagement from books. So never mind. ENTP might have the same problem though!
    It is likely to be the Ne that causes type confusion in an INFP (more for the first reason I mentioned) but we don't tend to actively engage in the world all that much. We do in passive ways, more from the position of the observer: listening, watching behaviours etc. But the overwhelming majority of our energy is directed at thinking and reflecting.

    I always see myself as being someone on the outside, looking through the window on the party going on inside. Its not necessarily a bad thing, as it allows me insights into the world that people in the mix seem to miss. ENFPs seem to manage to be part of the party and still have the insights.

    ENTPs might have the same problem as ENFPs but in my experience ENTPs are more sure of themselves in general.

  7. #17
    Senior Member SciVo's Avatar
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    Interesting! Taking a second look at the keys2cognition definition, it appears that Ti wouldn't require as deep reflection as Fi, because it deals with impersonal principles. So, on further consideration, I agree that ENFP have to bridge that I/E gap more than others.
    INFP ~ Fi/Ne/Ni/Te ~ 9-2-4 sp/so

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    ENTPs might have the same problem as ENFPs but in my experience ENTPs are more sure of themselves in general.
    I'd never want their confidence. Uncertainty is what makes us learn and search deeper. There is a big difference between learning something intelligent out of interest, and understanding something out of need.
    Freude, schöner Götterfunken Tochter aus Elysium, Wir betreten feuertrunken, Himmlische, dein Heiligtum! Deine Zauber binden wieder Was die Mode streng geteilt; Alle Menschen werden Brüder, Wo dein sanfter Flügel weilt.

  9. #19
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    We can get our active engagement from within us. Or if we get something that piques our interest in the real world that's fine too, but unlike ENFPs we can be totally fine going off into Lala land in our own heads. ENFPs need to constantly feed their curiosity, their Ne is hardly insatiable at any one time. I think it's safe to say that INFPs aren't really like this...

    Our Fi is insatiable. We want to know the personal details so that we can understand people. I literally have a hard time understanding where someone is coming from fully unless they tell me their personal attachments to it and/or their opinions on a given thing. My curiosity is in the personal realm, not in the possibilities realm. I just really want to get to know people better, by gathering more and more personal details. I have been told that I have incredible insights into things dealing with people and situations, and this is just because I know these random personal details and I can put together a picture in my head. Sometimes I don't even know how I do it, it's like from knowing more and more about a situation and people I can literally make myself BE in that situation, knowing exactly the feelings and how people's feelings interconnect to create the situation. These things are like separate consciousnesses almost, I have my own mood that I am constantly aware of and monitoring, then in my psyche I have separate moods that are those of other people, I just generally have mini-big pictures in my head of individual people and this is added to by gaining more personal details.

    INFPs I think have all of these feelings in separate areas, but the feelings of others and those of a situation seem to spill over into their main mood, making them super emotional and very adaptive at the same time. I think I've learned to prevent this "spilling over" thing, but sometimes it still happens... It's like I feel the person/situation enough to where I am very in tune with it, but it doesn't directly affect my mood or state of mind unless it's some intense stuff.

    Just some food for thought... That is my emphasis on Fi for INFPs.
    I relate to the bolded parts. I do go and look for people, but I do so to get to know them the way you just described. And I withdraw after I've had my fill. I do love hunting down possibilities, and learning new things, it's addictive, but it goes in cycles as I cannot keep it up constantly. Understanding people drives me so much that I'll leave sleep, food and other primal stuff for it, till I burn out or collapse.

    Give me an object/topic worthy of study to me, and I'll go all out, but not for as long as I'll go if you give me a person to get to know who I find highly intriguing, or has asked for my help on a feeling matter.

    I'll do the same with La-la-land. I'll happily reside there for a week or longer, after getting inspired by Ne for a new version of it. Can be around an idea, or a person. On the other hand, I have no problem building a crazy world out of the blue or tossing out a crazy idea while involving people...aka the dreaded silly switch

    Ne and Fi are just dual swords that I wield, I find. I'll happily settle for being an NFP-hybrid though
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





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  10. #20

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    Do INFPs have the same attack mode when it comes to problem solving and systems? I get this drive to solve and simplify, understand. Are INFPs normally more people directed, or are they as people and idea directed in their search as we are?
    Freude, schöner Götterfunken Tochter aus Elysium, Wir betreten feuertrunken, Himmlische, dein Heiligtum! Deine Zauber binden wieder Was die Mode streng geteilt; Alle Menschen werden Brüder, Wo dein sanfter Flügel weilt.

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