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Thread: NFP Idealism

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ne-Monster View Post
    Ah, but he bundles it up with Fe. If he would Te propose a solution I could logically explain my preference, identify an alternative, then explain logically why I chose that alternative.

    However instead he uses Fe. He sort of layers emo, unspoken "I care for you and want you to do this, so you should do it if you care for me" vibes. But I dont want to do it....

    So then I "feel" he is unhappy with Fi, get bits of Fi-guilt-pain, then I get angry and resentful as I dont see a clear way to resolve the issue, except taking a salt bath which i dont want to do.

    An even more hysterical example are road bumps-we have these giant ones in my neighborhood. So he comes one day to pick up the kids and is like "yeah the shocks on my car are getting all messed up....It's the road bumps in your neighborhood. They are huge...." but all said with this sad emo tone. WTF can I do about the road bumps??? Yet I still feel guilty as he seems to be emo-sad and it makes my Fi all sad.

    It is weird and I dont understand it at all. But his emo, not his ISTP callousness is what I cant take.
    I am sorry, I didnt mean to take it down this road, that example was what I thought about because I saw you wrote it so my mind was on what you could possibly relate to, sorry things pop in my head and since it was you this popped in my head. I stick by my example as an example of unfocused Te, but my example doesnt match up with how things happened IRL. It sounds like he seriously has some depression or anger issues to work out.

    edit: on a side note, not related to MBTI, but something I notice about alot of men, atleast the ones I am around, is that they have a huge desire to be right. My dad gets upset/hurt the times I back my mom up when she says something about the way he does things. Its a pride thing and his is probably shot. Not saying from you, but his life, he seems like from you write he always needs to prove something.

  2. #32
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    The problem seems to come from the fact that NF's care too much and the other types don't care enough..
    MBTI Type: iNTj
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  3. #33
    Senior Member Scott N Denver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I've often felt out of touch with this world because of what you just stated.

    Over the years, I've found that my ideals themselves weren't the problem. It was more of a...finetuning them and the methods used to bring them into the world and apply them to reality. The more you understand reality, the world and people around you, and the more you understand yourself and why you adhere to a certain value, the more you can make a synthesis from both, find common ground and a way to have them positively influence each other
    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    NFPs, do you ever feel like you are just too idealistic? That your standards and values are too hard on other people? How do you turn off the idealistic switch in your head, and do you come to terms with the reality that the way the world/life works is rarely comparable to your own ideals of how it should be?

    Feel free to give concrete examples to illustrate your points/experiences.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Outsider View Post
    I don't think my ideals are really too hard on other people, as I generally keep other people out of them.

    At times it definitely can be a source of frustration though. Don't know how to turn it off.


    I strongly relate to all of the above

  4. #34
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    NFPs, do you ever feel like you are just too idealistic? That your standards and values are too hard on other people? How do you turn off the idealistic switch in your head, and do you come to terms with the reality that the way the world/life works is rarely comparable to your own ideals of how it should be?

    Feel free to give concrete examples to illustrate your points/experiences.
    Along with Lady X and others, I would agree that I am hardest on myself. Everyone else gets quite a bit more leeway. With everyone else, I find a natural generosity just bubbles through. It arises from a genuine love for other human beings, a recognition of their humanity (flaws and all) and a strong belief in basic human virtue. This is the foundation of who I am so I don't think I can change it without losing an important piece of my self.

    Of course this leads to all sorts of problems in everyday life. I wonder if I come across as naive/childlike in these views. I've had enough life experience to be faced with dishonesty in all sorts of ways and in all kinds of interactions (charity, romance, friendships, work). Yet, I find it difficult to globalize these experiences to the world. I'll always put it off to individuals.

    I am more gullible than most people I know and I am okay with it. I would find it more difficult to give up my idealism than conform to a more skeptical view of the world.

    To counter the practical problems of living like this, I am working on honing my 'street smart' skills. Those are getting better all the time. Better awareness of situations, opening up more slowly and still giving people the benefit of doubt is closer to where I want to be.

    In relationships (of all kinds), I do fall prey to Kiersey's description pretty closely of ENFPS -- heaping coals on ourselves for not being our complete authentic selves. The idealism in this realm is usually in the form of setting the goal of being as honest as possible and also kind in most human dealings. I'm human, I fall short regularly but the disappointment I feel with myself when I am faced with this, is really devastating.

  5. #35
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clonester View Post
    Wait, taking over the world is my ideal. Can I possibly trade my idealism for the thing I idealize? Then I wouldn't idealize it anymore. How do I wrap my brain around this one...
    "What do you want to do tonight Brain?"

    "Same thing we do every night Pinky - try to take over the world!"

    (Couldn't resist! )

  6. #36
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    yep, totally agree with that. people think i'm naive too but i just trust myself to know when to remove trust...if that makes sense...like ms bs detector ya know? and...i can't function the other way. it's way too draining.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  7. #37
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    yep, totally agree with that. people think i'm naive too but i just trust myself to know when to remove trust...if that makes sense...like ms bs detector ya know? and...i can't function the other way. it's way too draining.
    Yes, I have that top-of-the-line BS detector too. Yet, it seems, my manual override button is permanently depressed. Must get that fixed.


  8. #38
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    i don't know if i just haven't had enough coffee...but i don't know what the hell we're talking about anymore.

    oh right..yeah that happens haha
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  9. #39
    Senior Member Coeur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    NFPs, do you ever feel like you are just too idealistic? That your standards and values are too hard on other people? How do you turn off the idealistic switch in your head, and do you come to terms with the reality that the way the world/life works is rarely comparable to your own ideals of how it should be?

    Feel free to give concrete examples to illustrate your points/experiences.
    Mainly, my values tend to make me too hard on myself.
    Towards other people, I'm extremely leniant. Even if they mess up, I flip it back to some negative reflection on myself. I see what I could have done differently, but fault them not.
    If I do see areas in others that need to be changed, it's more from the standpoint of helping the person become even better. I still don't register those points as true flaws, but merely areas where it is my responsibility as a friend to help them grow.
    If someone wrongs me, I justify their behavior and drop the subject. Now, I see that all of these traits are NOT out of a forgiving nature, but from a desire to avoid conflict.

    As you can see, I'm a big codependent disaster waiting to happen. My last relationship knocked some sense into me. Pair a deeply troubled, accusatory person with a person with a guilt-complex, and it really does not turn out well. After months of berating myself, and finally realizing that he was the problem, I've learned something. I'm human. People are human. We're ALL screwed up to some degree. I am not an ideal and never will be. I've always looked at myself from two extreme sides: completely good, or completely terrible. However, realistically I am a combination of yin and yang. Other people aren't perfect either, and they AREN'T going to change. Ever. If they're toxic today, they'll be toxic tomorrow, and it is not my job to 'fix' anyone.

    I think it's easiest to find the ideal in the reality, rahter than to try to fit reality into the ideal.
    Everybody needs love.

  10. #40
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    My ideals are not the problem, the world is the problem!

    Seriously though, I think that I refine my ideals, as someone else mentioned. Instead of giving up on them and caving to "reality" (which just sort of leads to depression), I shape my ideals into something that makes more sense.

    I also think my Ne-aux allows me to see soooo many possibilities, and many of them "ideal", so that my ideals can be fluid and flexible. This keeps me from having impossibly high standards and being endlessly disappointed.

    There's also the NFP ability to have good foresight: "This situation may not be ideal, but it could lead to something better, that's closer to the ideal." If we ever reached the ideal, we might have no motivation anyway .

    I think another saving grace of the NFP idealism is our compassion. We might be easier on others than ourselves if they fall short of our ideal and may not even apply all of our ideals to them. On the other hand, our high standards sort of regulate the environment around us, and it can be good to expect a lot of people if it means encouraging them (and the world) to improve. My ideals are based on my values, which are principles that I rarely compromise, but the ideal can change forms without compromising the basic principle. So in that sense, my ideals are never given up, just adjusted to more realistically stay in line with my principles.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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