[ENFP] ENFPs: The dark side of seeing potential

[BlueScreen]

The ENFP perfectionist streak was brought up in the ENFP sex thread, so I thought I'd start a thread about it.

It was also mentioned in the socionics profile thread.

Just as they see potential in others they see potential in themselves. They want desperately to actualize that potential to benefit not only them, but to set a good example for others to follow. They desire too much...

This is actually one of the darker sides of the ENFP personality. It can be the driving force for learning, but it can also kill all the joy in it. Make an ENFP a person who is never satisfied or fulfilled.

What perfectionism do other ENFPs exhibit? And how does it affect you? (as an ENFP or other type around them)

 

[sculpting]

Hey is this Si popping through? Cuase I am not really a perfectionist at all, but I recalled our convo about spelling the other day. Maybe my Si bucket is empty.

 

[BlueScreen]

I'm not sure, I know I am perfectionist in certain areas. And a few ENTPs mentioned a trend in guys they had dated who were ENFP. I certainly have a drive that I'd call perfectionist, or at least setting ridiculous standards for myself. Like I get annoyed with people imposing, but I've always been my harshest critic. I finished 3 months worth of work in 3 weeks at work before I went travelling, and was annoyed I didn't complete all of the 8 month project. My boss actually played on setting me it, because he knew I would try to get it done rather than settle for the fact it was obviously impossible. Maybe it's the pleasing people part too. Not sure.

My mother also pointed it out to me in a conversation the other week and said it can be stunting. You know we are more picky about what career we choose than any type in general also. There is this dream of moving everything toward what it can potentially be. And sometimes not really stopping and admiring what it is. Or accepting we are okay as we are. I actually searched a lot to see if I had any personality disorder or something at one stage, but it isn't driven by narcissism, paranoia, or anything. They would need a new one called progressionalist personality disorder or something. Like I compulsively want things to grow and improve. And most of the time when I cross lines it is in pursuit of this. I don't think it's healthy. Like I want to be able to do everything at the maximum possible level, and help anyone else. But I don't put the work in always to get there. I just beat around and chase a million different dreams.

Even when I'm solving something like this it is because it seems like it's stunting me. It's appealing to the same thing again, just in a personality sense. The problem is it doesn't end and have a time where I can use and make the most of it. It just continues. I kill a bit more of the present to raise the potential of the future.

 

[Amargith]

I'd say the ideal image that we strive so hard to accomplish is probably Fi and Si together.

 

[sculpting]

Hmm, pleasing people yes-that seems very Fi, Driving tasks to completion, overcoming extreme odds-pushing to accomplish goals-all feels very Te to me. I need to go learn more about Si.

 

[BlueScreen]

I think my question is, does it matter? What enjoyment or reward actually comes from progress? When you help someone see their dreams and strive for them, that is rewarding. But my dreams I'll never reach. I'll get further than a lot of others around me by trying, but I won't get the feeling of satisfaction they do. I called my university degree a piece of paper, and PhD three letters. If that isn't straight out arrogance, I don't know what. Like where is the appreciation of achievements? Where is the caring about all these other things people work for? I just use them as an enabler to get onto what I want to do next. I think I'm not in it for myself, but I'm not really doing much for anyone else.

I actually wouldn't mind an open all out analysis of my brain, because I know something isn't quite in place. Being impartial to applause is definitely a symptom of a few things. You could throw a party in my honour and stuff still wouldn't get through. I'd keep on thinking I needed to do better, even if not for them, for myself.

 

[Amargith]

Isn't Si what makes us nostalgic? I know that I have a thing for old traditions and folklore and my Fi loves incorporating that in who I am. Isn't that Si though?

 

[BlueScreen]

Maybe I'm not sure. I always test low on Si, but have a feeling we use it.

 

[Nonsensical]

The glory of doing something to my full capability-being and doing my absolute best- is such a great glory. It's not necessarily the outcome of it, but what it represents, IMO. Doing something your absolute best is perfection to me. And I know that when I take an edge and tackle something with all I've got, the outcome, whatever it may be, grants me a self of pride and respect for myself. I don't like doing anything half-assed. If I am going to do something, I am going to do it good, and right.

I don't know if other ENFPs are like this.

 

[BlueScreen]

Yep, if you do it, do it well.

My view of what my full capacity is, rose to be impossible though. That might be the problem here. I proof of concept, and it doesn't say I can't. But I try to do it and I'm scared I'll never get there. Like my dreams are on such grand scales that I'd trump most narcissists.

There's two things now for my list also: Grand, unrealistic dreams (though I don't believe the unrealistic part). Impartial to praise.

My friend who is a doctor (INTJ), calls me someone who would score perfect on any psyche test, but also jokes about me having Napoleonic dreams of taking over the world.

 

[Nonsensical]

I agree. I also think that operating to your full capacity, something we are always striving to, isn't a destination, but a challenge. We're never really there, always trying to get there. And for ENFPs, the harder we work, the farther we go along in this process, but it works both ways.

 

[BlueScreen]

Maybe I just haven't felt any reward or real satisfaction for a long time. It is probably nothing, but I want to understand it, because I know it stunts me. I'm nothing like the motivated free person I was 5 years ago. I know more, I'm more aware of things, I'm even more relaxed about things, but the passion is gone. I think of ENFPs with wild eyes, these days it isn't my normal state. It's a mask for how far I am from the external view of me. And my personal view isn't as inflated as I think, because I measure it (or try to without bias), just the external world never got to see much of me. And I grew most in this time, then dropped friends who did know the real me, but I didn't trust, or didn't accept me as it. Like I always want safety from who I am, being out in the world. I'd prefer to play out there with part of the picture, it may have even been a liability because they knew me, therefore I had to put up with being me and having opinions, rather than being unconfronting and accepted.

 

[Wonkavision]

I'm not sure, I know I am perfectionist in certain areas. And a few ENTPs mentioned a trend in guys they had dated who were ENFP. I certainly have a drive that I'd call perfectionist, or at least setting ridiculous standards for myself. Like I get annoyed with people imposing, but I've always been my harshest critic. I finished 3 months worth of work in 3 weeks at work before I went travelling, and was annoyed I didn't complete all of the 8 month project. My boss actually played on setting me it, because he knew I would try to get it done rather than settle for the fact it was obviously impossible. Maybe it's the pleasing people part too. Not sure.

My mother also pointed it out to me in a conversation the other week and said it can be stunting. You know we are more picky about what career we choose than any type in general also. There is this dream of moving everything toward what it can potentially be. And sometimes not really stopping and admiring what it is. Or accepting we are okay as we are. I actually searched a lot to see if I had any personality disorder or something at one stage, but it isn't driven by narcissism, paranoia, or anything. They would need a new one called progressionalist personality disorder or something. Like I compulsively want things to grow and improve. And most of the time when I cross lines it is in pursuit of this. I don't think it's healthy. Like I want to be able to do everything at the maximum possible level, and help anyone else. But I don't put the work in always to get there. I just beat around and chase a million different dreams.

Even when I'm solving something like this it is because it seems like it's stunting me. It's appealing to the same thing again, just in a personality sense. The problem is it doesn't end and have a time where I can use and make the most of it. It just continues. I kill a bit more of the present to raise the potential of the future.

Yeah, I relate to all of this.

This sounds like an Enneagram 7 personality.

I have a couple of books on Enneagram which offer some great insights and suggestions for 7's. (The Enneagram: Understanding Yourself and the Others in Your Life by Helen Palmer, and The Wisdom of The Enneagram by Don Richard Riso and Russ Hudson.)

In a nutshell, 7's are encouraged to slow down, be more in the present, appreciate the duller moments in life, meditate, etc.---all the things the 7 generally avoids doing on their idealistic quest for self-actualization.

Avoiding those things actually prevents 7's from achieving self-actualization, so the sooner they embrace them, the more satisfied and effective they will be.

 

[BlueScreen]

Yeah, I relate to all of this.

This sounds like an Enneagram 7 personality.

I have a couple of books on Enneagram which offer some great insights and suggestions for 7's. (The Enneagram: Understanding Yourself and the Others in Your Life by Helen Palmer, and The Wisdom of The Enneagram by Don Richard Riso and Russ Hudson.)

In a nutshell, 7's are encouraged to slow down, be more in the present, appreciate the duller moments in life, meditate, etc.---all the things the 7 generally avoids doing on their idealistic quest for self-actualization.

Avoiding those things actually prevents 7's from achieving self-actualization, so the sooner they embrace them, the more satisfied and effective they will be.

Thanks! That's actually really helpful. Probably a cause of lots of it.

I'm still worried about how high I aim though.

 

[sculpting]

Hmmm...

I guess I push and constantly force improvement. I also am not satisfied by the things I have acheived and it actually bugs me to get recognition for them. My ESTJ boss was baffled when I marked myself low on things accomplished last year. I told her "but I could have done so much more..." Are your dreams driven by Fi or they pulled forward via Ne?

I could totally see taking over the world, and I would love all the people so much, and be such a good dictator.... I have had a lot of ideas lately about how NeTe interact together to show us possibilities and then show us how we are inconsistant with the perfection inherent in those possibilities. (okay that sentance just popped into my head given the thread, but the NeTe thing has been cooking)

As we age and Te grows stronger, maybe we see our own faults and inconsistancies, our lack of follow through to Te and judge ourseleves on it? I just dont know...

EDIT: sorry Te senses logical inconsistancies. It sees areas where things are not smooth and evenand are flawed. NeTe is the ultimate lump detector, and a great problem solver i think. Although an odd combination...

 

[Chloe]

Oh, I thought about this yesterday... I fall easily in a loop of seeing potential in relationships ... etc... i see what could be. but it could be - where? when? in paralel universe perhaps.
ex. my sister is ISTJ and we are really too different for that to be true friendship, ..I mean for enyoy each other company for real. But we do spend much time together so when I see bits of her Ne.. or something... some intellectual stuff comes out for few minutes (..though she is PhD so she is very well educated and smart, but it's not the same intellectual hunger and all that as Ns have. ) - so when I see parts of that I instantly think "oh, ... sure, she will develop more.. I'll talk her into reading this stuff so she will like it.. blahblah" - but its simply over-seeing potential - it aint gonna happen.
And million of situations like this. I could see this possible -and it's been my case - in romantic relationships as well.. .like "yeah, we have great potential as couple, he has great potential. this is only beginning of our development" - mostly bullshit.
I hope it's clear what i tried to say.

i think it's common loop for young ENFPs who don't have enough expirience, and are not sure what do they think bout some stuff etc -(Fi)... so there is not enough expirience and Fi to make things more realistic.

 

[Clonester]

I also think that operating to your full capacity, something we are always striving to, isn't a destination, but a challenge. We're never really there, always trying to get there.

Very true.

Some of my greatest moments in life have come as a result of a perfectionist streak. I love challenges and challenging myself. Sometimes I'm not as satisfied as I should be, but I'd rather it that than be stagnant and not improve/do my best.

 

[Wonkavision]

I could totally see taking over the world, and I would love all the people so much, and be such a good dictator....

Was that a joke?

 

[lamp]

I find that the perfectionist streak can cripple me, as I think that I do not have enough time or the proper equipment to attempt/complete projects, even little harmless things like washing a car or generating a post. I 'cope' by trying to make sound plans and also by limiting what I allow myself to get into. If something appears to be more overwhelming than it is worth, I try and push it away.

Sometimes I'm not as satisfied as I should be, but I'd rather it that than be stagnant and not improve/do my best.

I am not often satisfied for more than a moment. Not sure if that is a bad thing though.

 

[Nonsensical]

I'm never satisfied with myself. And that's not a bad thing, even though it sounds like an emotional/psychological warning flag. But it isn't. It pushes me to go harder, to be more intense. I'm always chasing stars. My dog is always chasing birds but never catches any. It makes her stronger and more will-powered. I am constantly expecting more out of myself, and coming down on myself for not being perfect. Though that's a bit of a paradox, as I will never be perfect, it gives me the strength to chase it, knowing that I will never actually attain it. If that makes sense.