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[NF] Should I cut my losses and move on?

sabastious

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Some backstory: I posted a post a few weeks back, here's the link:

http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/nf-idyllic/17856-first-post-doozy-religious-crisis.html

I have been starting to talk to my family and seeing where they are and have had some crazy experiences and I am fearful that I will lose them. Let me give you an example of an email to my cousin and her wife, dear friends and loved ones of mine:

I started out emailing them this (_names have been removed_):
I haven't talked to you guys in ages. What a long strange trip it's been for me. ;) But all the confusion and extreme hardship has seemed to come to fruition. I am now in a more peaceful state and actually have a handle on my issues, it's hard to believe really. In the past year I had been in the emergecy room 4 times and I put myself in a volentary checkin crisis center for 5 days. Time is running together I'm not sure if the last time I saw you I had already been in the center or not. There is a lot to tell. A crap load to stuff has happened to me and I have learned a lot about myself.

The main reason I have been able to remove myself from the bog that I was stuck in is that I have had to become a person, if that makes sense. I bet you know what I am talking about when I say that I hadn't become me yet, my own person.

It used to be when I heard things that reminded me of my past hardships that I would allow myself to go into a frenzy. Allow myself to enter that dark place that we all have in us. That place where nothing you can do is going to work out and you are always going crash, burn and ultimatly fail. I never knew how to control those feelings and they dont care if your down they will continue to beat you if you dont know how to fight back, hence the emergency room visits, I wanted to kill myself so bad, but I didn't want to do that to (_my wife_) so when it was REALLY bad I would call 911.

But after a LOT of therapy with a very cool therapist (that's not The Rapist) ;) I have been able to get control of myself so-to-speak and finally start figuring out who I am and what (_myname_) wants in his life. Before that wasn't present, I was allowing the past to control my actions, living in the past so-to-speak.

So basically I'm just saying that I am in such a happy and content place. Not saying that I still don't have depressive attacks and that they are formidable, but I feel more equip to stand against them now, it's a wonderous feeling after so many one-sided victories from the depression!

But enough about me! How is life on the coast? How is (_counsin's husband_)? I think about you guys and miss you a ton! Me and (_my wife_) were watching X-Men 1 the other day and Hugh Jackmen always reminds me of (_my cousin_). I was watching that scene where hes in the X-Men underground and hes trying to get out with his shirt off and he finds a sweater! LOL I remember (_my cousin_) freakin out about that scene. Good times.

Love you guys and keep in touch,

-(_my name_)

I got this email a few days later:
Hey (_ny name_),

We know your email was a way to test the ground and open a way for a conversation about Your Decision. We know enough already and we don't need to know any more. We don't want to hear your reasons or your theories, we are not interested in details.

We want you to know that this is not because we don't love you anymore. You know that we have been there for you and tried to help you, but your choice has removed you from Jehovah and anything he has to give. There is nothing we could say that has not been said to you before and there is nothing you could say to us that we haven't heard in the past.

Neither of us want a reply e-mail from you, we're not interested in continuing this conversation any further. We don't want to hear your reasons , we can't stress this enough, we don't want to hear it.

We feel sorry for you but feel worse for (_my wife_). She can contact us if she feels like it but we truly do not want to hear from you again.

(_my cousin's husband_) and (_my cousin_).

And here is my reply to that email:
My email was soley about getting in touch with you. I don't want to talk about my decision as much as you, for similar reasons. All I want is to retain some sort of communication with you guys because you mean a great deal to me. I assume you took my email as a kind of manipulation tactic to talk about our differences. But truely it was only to say hello.

I know there is an elephant in the room though I wont deny that. But like you said it can't be resolved if my beliefs were put against yours. But that's not what I am about. I really respect all witnesses and their fight for what they hold to be truth. I admire anyone who positions themselves in this world and stands up for what they believe in. I understand that my decision greatly alteres our relationship, but in no way should it disappear by default. I also assume you believe you have all the information you need about me, but I will point out that it is 100% here say at this point (besides what I just told you) I think it is important for us to talk about me, not what I believe, but what my attitude is. Please think about and give me a reply.

-(_my name_)

So they are pretty pissed it seems and hurt. My email was pretty much a shot in the dark. I'm not sure if I should put much effort into salvaging this relationship.
 

Athenian200

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Yes. In fact, I'd say it's the appropriate thing to do.

If someone says they don't want to hear from you anymore, then it's rude to continue bothering them. I know that if I sent an e-mail like that to someone (even a family member), I'd pretty much be telling them to move on, because I was completely tired of dealing with them.

They've ended the relationship. That's how I read the e-mail. They've already cut their losses and moved on. Don't read too much into the love, they've put something above their love that makes it irrelevant to them. If they've put their religious beliefs above love (which they have), you don't have much chance of getting through to them. Your choice is between remaining in denial and vainly seeking reconciliation, or moving on as well.

In other words, I think the choice has been made for you. All you have to do is accept it.
 

fill

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I haven't the slightest clue how your (sect) of (sort of) Christianity works, but I'm glad you got out of it because Jehovah's witnesses are... well, to put it bluntly, fucking nuts. I commend you for questioning what simply is, and being a martyr of intuition.

Now to your situation: I don't think your family has stopped loving you; that's ridiculous, and cousins aren't as close as, say, a mother or father, so they have no room to speak for the other members. It surprises me how they're so volatile they are to simply approaching what they see as a "sinner" with open arms (wait, that's something Christ might do!). If they refuse to even communicate with you, give it time and try again, and be as friendly as possible about the situation as you've already done in your e-mails.

I feel for you and good luck.
 

sabastious

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I know that if I sent an e-mail like that to someone (even a family member), I'd pretty much be telling them to move on, because I was completely tired of dealing with them.

Indeed. But the crazy thing is I havn't talked with them in over a year. This tone in this email is based soley on what they have heard from others and of course the email they were replying to. :(

I'm pretty crushed. Just really sad that they are taking this stand against me, especially in the dark, without really any communication.
 

Skyward

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Indeed. But the crazy thing is I havn't talked with them in over a year. This tone in this email is based soley on what they have heard from others and of course the email they were replying to. :(

I'm pretty crushed. Just really sad that they are taking this stand against me, especially in the dark, without really any communication.

That sort of thing is very irritating, but, agreeing with the above posters, they have slammed the door and locked it. No use in knocking or rattling the knob.

It's good to know that you've pulled out of a rough past, though!
 

Fidelia

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Give it some time. As I understand it Jehovah's Witnesses are not encouraged to spend time with non-believers, which contributes to why they would respond so strongly. I can imagine that this vastly changes your family relationships and social network and that must be really hard right now. Let them see how you are living your life now and evaluate what kind of person you are compared to the one they were acquainted with. Things may change, but probably this is not the time for anything other than pleasantness and space towards them.
 

Scott N Denver

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Yes. In fact, I'd say it's the appropriate thing to do.

If someone says they don't want to hear from you anymore, then it's rude to continue bothering them. I know that if I sent an e-mail like that to someone (even a family member), I'd pretty much be telling them to move on, because I was completely tired of dealing with them.

They've ended the relationship. That's how I read the e-mail. They've already cut their losses and moved on. Don't read too much into the love, they've put something above their love that makes it irrelevant to them. If they've put their religious beliefs above love (which they have), you don't have much chance of getting through to them. Your choice is between remaining in denial and vainly seeking reconciliation, or moving on as well.

In other words, I think the choice has been made for you. All you have to do is accept it.

I concur with the above. THEY made a decision, there is truly not much you can do about it. Realize that the decision that was made was of their doing, and further that its almost entirely beyond your ability to do anything about. Regardless of any efforts you may make, they would have to decide themselves to make a change to their decision, you can't force that hand.
Just remember, you didn't make the decision to write them off, they made the decision to write you off. Put differently, you didn't slam any doors, they did. Don't potentially punish yourself for other people's decisions that are beyond your control.
 

Jaded Idealist

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Jehovah's Witnesses are theologically Christian, but they have certain beliefs found in no other sect, and some are quite quirky. If I admire anything about them, it is their devotion. They are right in a way: most people in the first world are narcissistic, worldly lemmings with cell phones and car keys.
 

Ozz

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Just curious, does the tone of the email sound like it was composed by your cousin and your cousin's husband? I am wondering if it is some pre-written form letter since the wording is polite but the content itself is rude.
 

sabastious

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Just curious, does the tone of the email sound like it was composed by your cousin and your cousin's husband? I am wondering if it is some pre-written form letter since the wording is polite but the content itself is rude.

It's defintely my cousin's husband. But I'm sure my cousin read it and approved of it before he sent it.
 

sabastious

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So I am pretty much deciding to cut my losses here. It's so sad :( :( :( I really love them.

So saying that, I'm not very good at this type of thing. I don't have a lot of experience. Are there any tips for NF's getting over long relationships in this manner?
 

BlueScreen

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Good friends and a support group outside JW could help a lot. ie. people you can talk to and hang out with who aren't involved.
 

Athenian200

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So saying that, I'm not very good at this type of thing. I don't have a lot of experience. Are there any tips for NF's getting over long relationships in this manner?

Well, there is an NF I know who got through such a situation by playing World of Warcraft for a few months. Heard it was really cathartic for them. If you do that, you might really enjoy playing as a Forsaken and fighting the Scarlet Crusaders, considering how miserable religious zealots have been making your life. ;)

Personally, my usually solution is to just stay away from them and let time pass, maybe giving myself a few things like favorite foods when it's hitting particularly hard. Most importantly, time heals all wounds.
 

Scott N Denver

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So I am pretty much deciding to cut my losses here. It's so sad :( :( :( I really love them.

So saying that, I'm not very good at this type of thing. I don't have a lot of experience. Are there any tips for NF's getting over long relationships in this manner?

Your not responsible for other people's choices or decisions. As much as our Fi would like to think that if everyone just got together and opened their hearts and listened to each other and cared, that everything could work out, the simple reality is that's just not how things tend to go. People's hearts aren't necessarily open, now do people have to care, or want to listen, or anything else. We live in a free society, they made their decision, you can't change their decision, now decide to move on with your life. Find new things, find new people, engage in your favorite activities. Know that there is nothing more you can do wrt to them, and then do your best to let it go.
 

BlueScreen

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I'd say you have to leave it, because you'll have a lot of trouble changing their outlook. But I wouldn't protect them, they are straight out manipulating you. That is pretty much the purpose of discommunication. To make you come back because you have nothing outside it to turn to. And to make sure you don't throw any spanners in the faith of others who are still within it. Any anger they have toward you is totally unjustified. So don't even question that it isn't. It will never be a crime to think and have your own outlook.
 

BerberElla

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I'd say you have to leave it, because you'll have a lot of trouble changing their outlook. But I wouldn't protect them, they are straight out manipulating you. That is pretty much the purpose of discommunication. To make you come back because you have nothing outside it to turn to. And to make sure you don't throw any spanners in the faith of others who are still within it. Any anger they have toward you is totally unjustified. So don't even question that it isn't. It will never be a crime to think and have your own outlook.

+1

It's very important now that you begin to fill your life with people who care about you, for you, and not for some religious badge you wear.

One of the things that has helped me most in letting go of my family, is by making the choice mine.

As far as I see it, real love supercedes religious love, I have seen other religious families learn to cope with the apostate within their midst, without disowning them, and that IS love, not what you are experiencing, nor what I did.

Therefore make this choice yours, you may love them but aren't you angry to be so devalued by them?

It's that anger at their stupidity that gets me through each day tbh. I'm still not at that "not feeling" stage.

A support group as someone else mentioned is also a must, there was nowhere online really that fit what I needed for suuport, so I started a forum up with 3 other like minded people, and now it's full of people in the same boat as me, and we help each other by forming our own type of family.

So keep busy, get mad, and believe me, one day this won't bother you as much.

I only feel sad a couple of times a month these days, there was a time where I went to sleep with a heavy heart each night.
 

Owl

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Tonight, you and your cousins are in my prayers. (So are you Miss BerberElla).

They have rejected love, but I hope you don't do the same. They have separated themselves from you, but forgive them, and hopefully they will be restored to you.

I read this today and it greatly encouraged me, and it seems appropriate to share. I hope you too might draw some strength from it (1 Peter 3:8, ESV):

Finally, all of you, have unity of mind, sympathy, brotherly love, a tender heart, and a humble mind. Do not repay evil for evil or reviling for reviling, but on the contrary, bless, for to this you were called, that you may obtain a blessing.

Wherever you are, may you find the strength to endure this trial, to forgive, to hold onto love, and may you find comfort and unity.
 

TopherRed

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+1

It's very important now that you begin to fill your life with people who care about you, for you, and not for some religious badge you wear.

One of the things that has helped me most in letting go of my family, is by making the choice mine.

As far as I see it, real love supercedes religious love, I have seen other religious families learn to cope with the apostate within their midst, without disowning them, and that IS love, not what you are experiencing, nor what I did.

Therefore make this choice yours, you may love them but aren't you angry to be so devalued by them?

It's that anger at their stupidity that gets me through each day tbh. I'm still not at that "not feeling" stage.

A support group as someone else mentioned is also a must, there was nowhere online really that fit what I needed for suuport, so I started a forum up with 3 other like minded people, and now it's full of people in the same boat as me, and we help each other by forming our own type of family.

So keep busy, get mad, and believe me, one day this won't bother you as much.

I only feel sad a couple of times a month these days, there was a time where I went to sleep with a heavy heart each night.

Not to turn hijack this for a religous discussion, but I will say, that Jesus is true love. That's what he preached and that's what he did. I agree with Ms. B that "Religious Love"--i.e. love dependant on belonging to a certain group or whatever--is completely and utterly false. God is probably disgusted by the whole thing.

When Christ said "Love one another." He did not add conditions.
 

lillyofthevalley

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Your cousins have closed the door for now. These people have a strong faith and a certain lifestyle they live by. I think they do love you but it seems to me that they find it very hard to let you in right now, that in the past there was something about you (we don't know what it was) that presented challenges to their peace of mind. They've decided that, in their own best interest they need to be separated from you. I think you should concentrate on getting your life, and the life with your wife back into a healthy balance. When everything is more in harmony with you, the word will get to them through others in your family. Give it some time then send your cousins a nice card, don't mention anything about yourself, just wish them love and happiness. You can fix this but it will take time.
 

statuesquechica

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I'm sorry for your loss. You have to do what is best for you, and it sounds as though you have. I see nothing wrong with leaving the door open for possible change in the future, but you have to take care of yourself first.
 
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