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  1. #51
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Well that sucks!

    I for one would rather ENTPs piss me off than avoid engaging with me. I'm pretty sure most INFPs would feel the same way.
    I know this one INFP guy and he's really talented and creative. But, it seems to be in a way that I don't have much to offer him. I think of myself as creative artistically, but he is way more talented. The only thing I have been able to provide him is with a refining of his ideas if he needs to narrow down choices. Plus, since he designs websites I will often talk about the marketing side of things to help narrow down options as well. I think this is helpful, but unlike with other less talented people, I don't feel as confident about my contribution since he seems on top of it.

    Also, strangely, I find myself just agreeing with him a lot because he is so touchy and I don't want to say something wrong or betray myself as Machiavellian since he has a strong aversion to anything he views as... cynical or something. Very idealistic in a very personalized hard to argue way.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  2. #52
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Sometimes the apparent lack of caring can be a defence mechanism as matilda suggested, but I agree that I dont care "quite as much" about other people's reactions to my thoughts/feeling/opinions/wishes because my values and sense of self are very independent. Which isn't to say they are exempt from persuasion and revision - they are just pretty immune to external pressures. Compared to most people anyway, I think.
    I'd edit this in but I think you'd miss it. Jennifer edits her posts all the time and I only find out about it by accident when I do find out about it at all. Annoying!

    I wanted to add that in cases where other people's reactions to my thoughts/feelings/opinions/wishes are negative, if I judge their reaction to be baseless given my action (or even just my intention sometimes) I'll let it slide without making much effort to correct any misunderstanding or offence. I do so because I've judged myself innocent of the charges and don't feel a need to take it any further. Sometimes I don't engage with their reaction because I'm busy examining it for validity, which can take some time. Even in those cases though if I feel they have a point I'm just as likely to castigate myself privately, feel awful, and take it no further as I am to apologize. This is a flaw in me which needs some work, though I'm far more likely to deal with these cases if I'm close to the person. The problem and strength of Fi is that, in its purist form, it's ultimately accountable only to itself. Fe is accountable to group standards, Te to what works, Ti to logic. That lack of accountablity is why INFPs are prone to going off the rails, but some rails are bad rails.

  3. #53
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    In that sense, it is one of the things that I think makes people mistake you for NTs sometimes.

    I should warn you, I'm the worst offender for going back and editing without noting it at the bottom.

    If you've got anything else, please continue. You are doing an excellent job.

  4. #54
    Senior Member Scott N Denver's Avatar
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    We're so cuddly that you want to make babies with us? All of us.

    Has any of this conversation dealt with SFP's? They are Fi users too, and ISFP's are Fi doms.

  5. #55
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia
    Would they want someone to come around if they were sick or feeling down or would they prefer their own space at that time?
    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Excellent. Would a note or phone call be better than an actual visit when you are feeling unhappy or under the weather? Small gifts? Food items? Music to listen to? Comic books to while away your time with?
    Like JJJ said this is tricky. Knowing that someone cares about my negative state is usually enough for me, because all I really care about is knowing that the other cares and not really material things or support (unless of course I need it and it's obvious that I do). I guess it just depends. If I'm obviously in need of support, do it. If I'm not really in need of support then I'd like to maintain my independence (this might be a male thing though).

    A phone call would be cool for when I'm unhappy, or just any way to talk to you (the friend). When I'm feeling down I usually have my own way of dealing with things, which usually boils down to forgetting about my troubles and doing something with my friends, or preoccupying myself by myself with something that will distract me from the mood. This almost always works. I'll usually talk to a close friend about it too if it's something really bothering me that isn't something just negligible (I think that this means if they can relate to it... lol).

    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia
    However, I have the sneaking suspicion of late that I may be monopolizing conversations here and don't wish to wear out my welcome even though I have lots of questions.
    Eh we have nothing better to do. Plus I like for my mind to be probed.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  6. #56
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Excellent. Would a note or phone call be better than an actual visit when you are feeling unhappy or under the weather? Small gifts? Food items? Music to listen to? Comic books to while away your time with?
    Personally I'd prefer a visit, even if at the time it might seem intrusive. At least one visit, with notes/phone-calls and further visits depending on the duration of the convalescence and/or the seriousness of the condition. Everyone's different though. I'd really only appreciate visits from close friends. Acquaintances coming to visit is the worst. If I were visiting an INFP I'd phone them first to ask if they wanted any specific books or something. Food is always welcome I guess, especially given the quality of hospital food. Music/comic books would depend on the person, but I think they'd appreciate the gesture even if it wasn't something that interested them especially. In all these cases it's the thought behind the gesture which is important, cliched though that sounds.

  7. #57
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Personally I'd prefer a visit, even if at the time it might seem intrusive. At least one visit, with notes/phone-calls and further visits depending on the duration of the convalescence and/or the seriousness of the condition. Everyone's different though. I'd really only appreciate visits from close friends. Acquaintances coming to visit is the worst. If I were visiting an INFP I'd phone them first to ask if they wanted any specific books or something. Food is always welcome I guess, especially given the quality of hospital food. Music/comic books would depend on the person, but I think they'd appreciate the gesture even if it wasn't something that interested them especially. In all these cases it's the thought behind the gesture which is important, cliched though that sounds.
    Whoa whoa we're talking about hospital bound?

    Well that changes everything...

    But otherwise definitely agree with this post if it's in a hospital or I'm very sick.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  8. #58
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Scott N Denver - First I don't know if I'm up for having that many babies...

    Good point about the SFPs. Unfortunately I don't know any well...or maybe any, so I don't know what I can contribute but I'd like to hear anything that you folks could add about that.

    JJJ - I'm thinking only of you being a delicate shade of medium-deep turquoise in your spirits, not navy blue. Or maybe you have that achy flu, but aren't in the hospital. My normal reaction would be quickly dropping off lemons to make good getting well stuff with, or getting something they had run out of to save them having to leave the house, like gingerale for sick stomach or something and then leaving right away. But I'd only do that for someone I was close to. I'm not sure how much imposing you people would want and I'm naturally hyper-sensitive against any imposing myself in any way on any one if they show even the faintest signs of non-appreciation for it. See this is why we pussyfoot around you. We just aren't sure what you all want!

  9. #59
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    I know this one INFP guy and he's really talented and creative. But, it seems to be in a way that I don't have much to offer him. I think of myself as creative artistically, but he is way more talented. The only thing I have been able to provide him is with a refining of his ideas if he needs to narrow down choices. Plus, since he designs websites I will often talk about the marketing side of things to help narrow down options as well. I think this is helpful, but unlike with other less talented people, I don't feel as confident about my contribution since he seems on top of it.

    Also, strangely, I find myself just agreeing with him a lot because he is so touchy and I don't want to say something wrong or betray myself as Machiavellian since he has a strong aversion to anything he views as... cynical or something. Very idealistic in a very personalized hard to argue way.
    Ha, sounds like an awkward friendship. You'd probably find that he likes you just as much as you like him, and is probably just as intimidated by you as you are by him. I'm only guessing, of course. And projecting a bit in all likelihood.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    Whoa whoa we're talking about hospital bound?
    I thought she said something about that earlier. Probably my mistake.

  10. #60
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Ha, sounds like an awkward friendship. You'd probably find that he likes you just as much as you like him, and is probably just as intimidated by you as you are by him. I'm only guessing, of course. And projecting a bit in all likelihood.
    That is EXACTLY how it is with ENTPs for me. We are both pretty damn intimidated by the other.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

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