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  1. #751
    Member Tem's Avatar
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    I feel really left out of this one.. *cries*.

    Is there a similar thingy for INTJs?

    I find I get along really well with Fi-doms, ISFPs or INFPs I think.

  2. #752
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tem View Post
    I feel really left out of this one.. *cries*.

    Is there a similar thingy for INTJs?

    I find I get along really well with Fi-doms, ISFPs or INFPs I think.
    Indeed. It gets ugly at some points through it according to some who have gone through it, but it's quite a popular thread. Though I have not participated myself.

    ( @Amargith, sorry for potentially necroing this he/she asked)
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
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  3. #753
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    Quote Originally Posted by iloveyou View Post
    Your experiences are your own. And no one can subtract them from you. No one else's opinions, views, beliefs, or experiences will erase your own. I certainly did not make any attempts to even tone down the posts you made that so flagrantly boasted the virtues of the INFJ, so I certainly will not denounce your current negative views of them. As I said, your experiences are your own. I will, however, voice my opinion, as I would advocate a more balanced view. Just as any other type has their pitfalls and shortcomings, so does the INFJ. Similarly, just as any other type has their gifts and talents, so does the INFJ. The angelic descriptions that some create of INFJ's (I read the beginning of another thread on another website similar to this thread) as well as the criticisms or words of caution that others give seem a tad bit overdone to me. We're people too with flaws and strengths just as anyone else. Having said this, however, I do realize that the people, events, circumstances, etc. that we all face-- each and every single one of us-- and come into contact with every day truly do also play wonders in molding us in to who we eventually turn out to be as​ well as in shaping our view of the world and the people around us.
    as an answer to "what to do", balance is a fine ideal to aspire too, in actions.
    but as the answer to "What is", as an assumption, in understanding? not so much.

    i can certainly see the perspective which views the benefits of the mental process in question:
    be able to view yourself as maintaining the highest ideals and get the benefits of breaking them too? that's just 100% net emotional profit, no tax or shipment delay.

    but from the the other perspective, it's someone who fucks you over when you trust them and kicks you for telling them when they fuck you over so that they'll stop fucking you over, someone who advertisement themselves on ideals that do not predict what you'll experience, but rather which ones of your experiences will be viewed as distorted. someone who'll claim they care for others but will push you push them away because actually giving a shit would distract from being able to look at the mirror and tell their reflection how caring it is.

    unfortunately, other people aren't candidates to the position from which you experience yourself, they are candidates to the positions from which others experience you.

  4. #754
    Member iloveyou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Society View Post
    as an answer to "what to do", balance is a fine ideal to aspire too, in actions.
    but as the answer to "What is", as an assumption, in understanding? not so much.

    i can certainly see the perspective which views the benefits of the mental process in question:
    be able to view yourself as maintaining the highest ideals and get the benefits of breaking them too? that's just 100% net emotional profit, no tax or shipment delay.

    but from the the other perspective, it's someone who fucks you over when you trust them and kicks you for telling them when they fuck you over so that they'll stop fucking you over, someone who advertisement themselves on ideals that do not predict what you'll experience, but rather which ones of your experiences will be viewed as distorted. someone who'll claim they care for others but will push you push them away because actually giving a shit would distract from being able to look at the mirror and tell their reflection how caring it is.

    unfortunately, other people aren't candidates to the position from which you experience yourself, they are candidates to the positions from which others experience you.
    ^ True. But I wasn't trying to present myself "as maintaining the highest ideals" when I spoke of a balanced view. Nor am I seeking "emotional profit". I was only saying that, as we all know, people have flaws. And that, when one experiences these flaws, it can indeed sometimes play a big role in shaping their view of the people around them. It happens to us all. It happens to me.

  5. #755
    I drink your milkshake. Thessaly's Avatar
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    I've really gotten into INFJs lately. I think it's because I had a crush on my INFJ therapist. Prior to that I don't know if I had the patience to get to know one. I don't see how they're a good match for ENTP though. ENTPs need to be with other Ps otherwise they're castrated for life.
    With dreamers, pure and simple, the imagination remains a vaguely sketched inner affair. It is not embodied in any aesthetic or practical invention. Reverie is the equivalent of weak desires. Dreamers are the aboulics of the creative imagination.

  6. #756
    Buddhist Misanthrope Samvega's Avatar
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    Arrrrg, this is an exhausting topic and conversation. Really, INFJs or the ones I've met anyway, are incapable of being authentic, I have no interest or energy to attempt fixing them, they seem to be content in their own little worlds and are only willing to "deeply connect" with others on their terms. I like alpha females and that INFJs are not, INFJs make really amazing casual friends but they're too worried about the feelings of others, not hurting people and so on to be seen as trustworthy to me simply because of their inability to be honest at their own discomfort. I have a few INFJs I like very much and have bonded well with, my therapist is an INFJ, one of my closest guy friends is an INFJ, they (INFJs not the two I just mentioned although they do also) have a lot of potential but this is 2-3 of them out of 100 or more that I've met or known.

    In terms of dating, as I mentioned, I really love alpha females, my girlfriend is an ENFP and it's the realest, healthiest, most transparent relationship I've even known or seen. She can handle herself, situations, and people better than anybody I've ever met, she's exceedingly confident and attentive. Granted, it's a Dom/sub dynamic which at the core requires a level of transparency and honesty well outside of what most would desire. All the same, I don't think what her and I share would even be conceivable with an INFJ, they just aren't capable of connecting that way, at least in the ways I need.

    I started this with saying the INFJ would save the ENTPs soul and the ENTP would save the INFJs spirit and I still stand behind that I just don't think they're meant to spend their lives together, simply to teach each other lessons. I'm older and more mature now, I don't require the same balance I once did as I'm more autonomous and self aware.

    INFJs make the perfect martyrs and it seems to be something they love to embrace. They're a good fit for somebody but I think best left dating types less aware of their partner, INFP, INTJ, ISTJ, ESTP, they all seem to be common and good fits for the INFJs. Reality is, I've never met an INFJ that was actually happy in their relationship (though many portend and project that) so I think an INFJ and an ENTP together is just a waste of a perfectly good ENTP somebody else could be fully appreciating.

    I dislike superlatives and don't mean to speak in them. This however it my way of putting an end to this chapter in my life. I will always feel a pull to INFJs but for me, it's a desire to fix them and bring out their potential, I've had to learn that isn't a healthy choice for me. I've had to explore and fix myself and in doing so I no longer have any desire to be in the type of relationship that is the ENTP/INFJ. This isn't me saying INFJs are "broken" but that I had to understand why I viewed them that way and address that and in doing so they lost their appeal to me and have very little to offer me as a life partner.

  7. #757
    Junior Member EvVieNiamhNyx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    You are in a mass of confusion because you dont fit the type system ? Let me rephrase that to make it more clear: you are in a mass of confusion because your face does not exactly look like the faces of the group of people you belong to ?!
    ??? No.. I am confused because I feel as if I fit traits of both. As well as even though I like INJF description more, but I'm not sure how orderly I am.

    The only thing with faces is the gag "INFJ" face, staring of into space. Which I do stare of into space, but it's more of spacing off into my head thing rather than being an INFJ thing. I have brought this up in a stereo type forum I think, so maybe you saw that?? (But that was not mentioned the quote.)
    But the physical features don't confuse me at all, I would like to know where you got that idea, or were you being super metaphorical? As in the 'face' being the traits of a type? Then yes, that is why I am confused. I know people may not fit somewhere perfectly, but I want to discover as much as I can before I 'settle' if I ever do.

    Also your name is neat, I had to look it up. I knew I had seen/heard it before but it would not come to mind. It is a very interesting word/name.
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  8. #758
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    Quote Originally Posted by iloveyou View Post
    ^ True. But I wasn't trying to present myself "as maintaining the highest ideals" when I spoke of a balanced view. Nor am I seeking "emotional profit". I was only saying that, as we all know, people have flaws. And that, when one experiences these flaws, it can indeed sometimes play a big role in shaping their view of the people around them. It happens to us all. It happens to me.
    i wasn't saying that you did, i was explaining the flaw in your interpretation of the perceived imbalance.

    the thought structures being critiqued are real, too many people who've known INFJs attest to that, too many people who are INFJs excuse and demonstrate it and it's various elements, the only INFJs who are seemingly able to neither excuse it nor demonstrate it are those seemingly aware of overcoming the tendencies in their past, and even that is rather rare. while it might conflict in the angelic view of the type in itself, it doesn't conflict with the portraits existence - rather the opposite - it's what allows INFJs to read the most angelic of type portraits and think "yes, that's totally me" in the first place.

    in that light, what can be understood the balance is not in acknowledging it's existence, it's in ascribing to it a negative, so a more "fair and balanced" view can look at both it's advantages and disadvantages, it's total affect. and as i said, it has them both. the problem here is that there's a clear side - if you are the person doing it, you gain a 100% of the advantages, if you are someone in their life, you gain a 100% of the disadvantages. but the outside perspective doesn't get to be the first, they can only get to be the second.

    you'd essentially be asking to balance "these people will fuck you over in X ways" with "but at least they'll enjoy it!"

  9. #759
    Buddhist Misanthrope Samvega's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Society View Post
    i wasn't saying that you did, i was explaining the flaw in your interpretation of the perceived imbalance.

    the thought structures being critiqued are real, too many people who've known INFJs attest to that, too many people who are INFJs excuse and demonstrate it and it's various elements, the only INFJs who are seemingly able to neither excuse it nor demonstrate it are those seemingly aware of overcoming the tendencies in their past, and even that is rather rare. while it might conflict in the angelic view of the type in itself, it doesn't conflict with the portraits existence - rather the opposite - it's what allows INFJs to read the most angelic of type portraits and think "yes, that's totally me" in the first place.

    in that light, what can be understood the balance is not in acknowledging it's existence, it's in ascribing to it a negative, so a more "fair and balanced" view can look at both it's advantages and disadvantages, it's total affect. and as i said, it has them both. the problem here is that there's a clear side - if you are the person doing it, you gain a 100% of the advantages, if you are someone in their life, you gain a 100% of the disadvantages. but the outside perspective doesn't get to be the first, they can only get to be the second.

    you'd essentially be asking to balance "these people will fuck you over in X ways" with "but at least they'll enjoy it!"
    This is the salient point in why I just gave up on the entire INFJ thing, they cheat but refuse to see it as cheating even if their partner does, they withhold information, sugar coat, and avoid but say it's to "protect" or avoid hurting others. They call it nobel instead of acknowledging they're maintaining their comfort at the expense of others growth or well being. They take away your choice to assess the relationship by being transparent and call it "processing" which often time can take years while their partner is thinking things are fine. If you point any of this out, in even the smallest of ways, they scream and shout, deny, reinvent reality and as they often seem to proudly point out their ability to do, "door slam" you. INFJs that "door slam" are unhealthy and avoidance prone INFJs unable to set boundaries. INFJs that you feel a "push/pull" with are also unhealthy INFJs, they will exclaim otherwise but they're in denial.

    My experience is that this is the rule, there are exceptions but sadly, every INFJ thinks they are that exception which means finding the exceptions is your responsibility not theirs. The INFJs that have reached this place, they're amazing, amazing people but not in a relationship context, in a humanity, the world needs more of context.

    The INFJs taking offense to my words or swearing I'm wrong or it couldn't be true, well, you are the rule, the exceptions, they know what it took to become who they are and I am thankful you were willing to put that effort in as you offer much healing, love, compassion, and affirmation to a world seriously lacking it.

  10. #760
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvVieNiamhNyx View Post
    ??? No.. I am confused because I feel as if I fit traits of both. As well as even though I like INJF description more, but I'm not sure how orderly I am.
    You are a NF you believe in the spirit of body and soul. What do you think how big of chance there are only 16 types to describe all mankind.
    I fit all types, I am big at Te and Fe and big at Ti, but the biggest I am at crazy and thats why people call me entp. For people with small brain capacity, 16 types are necessary to explain the world, but the real wolrd is far more complex than that. One day you may be more infp and one you maybe more infj that shows already that type charactericstics are heavily mood dependant. Dont break your head about this question, it just has no clear answer
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

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