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  1. #11
    Senior Member Kyrielle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Grand Chameleon View Post
    This all makes sense. I now know the cause, but is there a cure? A healthy lifestyle definitely helps normal modes of functioning, but what is the aid for extreme modes (in this case, physical exhaustion)? Sleep is a proven remedy, but the negative thoughts fester between post-"workout" and la-la land. What can be done within this time frame?
    Try to work through getting over those memories when you are not exhausted. Maybe that's why you think about them when your defences are down. Because somewhere in your head, you haven't gotten over them and that's why they keep popping up when there's nothing to push them away.

    Maybe write down what you're thinking about and how you feel, then address the matter once you've had some rest. Maybe talk to a friend about your memories.
    "I took the one less traveled by,
    And that has made all the difference."

    Robert Frost

  2. #12
    Senior Member MonkeyGrass's Avatar
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    Are you currently on meds for depression? (sorry, can't remember if you mentioned it) Sometimes they help take the "edge" off temporarily, so you can work through standing issues, like kyrielle mentioned. If it's the issues and beliefs that accompany them that are triggering depression, you might be able to come of the meds eventually without a hitch after gaining some coping tools.
    I think I think more than you think I think.

  3. #13
    Senior Member The Grand Chameleon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Call a friend and chat until the "danger" time has passed?
    Egad! I've honestly never considered this. The painfully obvious has recently begun to be somewhat evasive. It's not natural for me to express negativity to friends, for I feel people have enough to deal with less my own meandering experiences (although this somewhat contradicts the thread). Is that typical to our type, you think? But I'll heed your advice and equate "calling a friend" with browsing TypoC. On a side note, prepare your inbox for an influx of insidious inferences regarding the inner self.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyrielle View Post
    Try to work through getting over those memories when you are not exhausted. Maybe that's why you think about them when your defences are down. Because somewhere in your head, you haven't gotten over them and that's why they keep popping up when there's nothing to push them away.

    Maybe write down what you're thinking about and how you feel, then address the matter once you've had some rest. Maybe talk to a friend about your memories.
    Mistakes made in life, people that have gotten hurt by my actions, people that have hurt me...are always constantly nagging, which results in an endless drive for self-improvement. When a problem occurs, it is the first priority to resolve the matter in a way beneficial to all the parties involved. Perhaps this is a false sense of harmony, as everyone won but the arbitrator? That is an unsettling epiphany.

    Writing does help, as it is now...as is the benefit of another's perspective

    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeyGrass View Post
    Are you currently on meds for depression? (sorry, can't remember if you mentioned it) Sometimes they help take the "edge" off temporarily, so you can work through standing issues, like kyrielle mentioned. If it's the issues and beliefs that accompany them that are triggering depression, you might be able to come of the meds eventually without a hitch after gaining some coping tools.
    I don't take medications for depression, since I don't suffer chronic depression. This is more of an extreme acute case, of which prescription strength drugs would probably only serve to create another addict. But I wouldn't mind getting my hands on some of those coping tools you speak of. Care to share some from your own toolbox?
    Last edited by The Grand Chameleon; 06-23-2009 at 08:12 AM. Reason: "pervasive" is not "evasive."
    "In the game of chess, you can never let your opponent see your pieces."

  4. #14
    Member Shaggy's Avatar
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    I usually get exhausted when my intuition fails to keep up with everything going on in my life. I tend to shutdown from lacking the ability to connect how I feel with the situations going on around me. When I get to that point, I demand an evening to myself to sit down with my acoustic and write a tune to make sense of things. My loved ones around me understand my need for space to prevent my shadow from surfacing.

  5. #15
    Member Saffronsocks's Avatar
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    This is random, but in emergency situations where I need a bit of a boost, I find standing on my head incredibly helpful. I think it has something to do with the rush of blood to the pinneal gland, which stimulates feelings of euphoria and calmness. After re-inverting myself I feel... more like myself, only tinglier. And I know that's short term and doesn't really help with emotional problems, but it's something...

    Being kind to yourself is good, too.

  6. #16
    Senior Member amelie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Grand Chameleon View Post
    Mistakes made in life, people that have gotten hurt by my actions, people that have hurt me...are always constantly nagging, which results in an endless drive for self-improvement. (cut)

    I don't take medications for depression, since I don't suffer chronic depression. This is more of an extreme acute case, of which prescription strength drugs would probably only serve to create another addict. But I wouldn't mind getting my hands on some of those coping tools you speak of. Care to share some from your own toolbox?
    Your rumination on things that you feel guilty about is a symptom of a major depressive episode, as is difficulty sleeping (falling asleep, staying asleep, waking up too early) - which leads to exhaustion, and lack of sleep is often a precursor for depression. In guys, depression can be more agitated than sad - check out "symptoms of Major Depressive Disorder" online and see if they fit - you have to have 5 of the 7 (or less for "Baby Depression" - Dysthmia). If it's been going on for more than 2 weeks, it becomes a medical issue. Would you feel like an addict if you needed insulin for diabetes? Needing anti-depressants for a chemical imbalance in your brain isn't any different.

    As far as non-medical coping skills, exercise has been shown to help w/ mild to moderate depression and anxiety. Weight lifting has specifically been shown to help w/ anxiety - I forget the dose that was studied - maybe 3x week for 20 minutes or something. The point is that physical activity helps. Also, if you're a reader, Feeling Good by David Burns is a good self-help resource for people w/ depression. Social support is important - talking to a trusted friend, & making yourself not withdraw further from the social world. Therapy works, too.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Jonathanthegreat's Avatar
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    Chameleon, I go through the same thing. I noticed that when I am alone I can turn on myself! It's weird and un healthy but the same way we encourage others and are optimistic about them, we must be the same way about ourselves. I noticed too that if I don't monitor my nutrition with care that I can indeed fall into a pit of emotional despair. But you just gotta hold on and talk yourself outta it. Being alone as an enfj is both good and bad. you just have to find a balance. wehn you feel negativity coming along just rationalize it to yourself that its not true. for instance, you think you are a jerk, then realize that jerks don't have any friends, and you have friends therefore you are not a jerk. its small things like that can help an enfj a lot. I recently got over negative thinking and i was dealing with it for YEARS. it was also because i was smoking weed and everytime i got high it was like i became my own worst enemy! i started to pick myself apart with negativity! you just have to realize that those thoughts are not true and value yourself. I hope this helped, please let me know in greater detail how you feel about yourself negatively, so I can give you some help.

  8. #18
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Grand Chameleon View Post
    Egad! I've honestly never considered this. The painfully obvious has recently begun to be somewhat evasive.
    Believe me, I'm Captain Oblivious myself. I learned this trick from my sister, I think. *laughs*

    It's not natural for me to express negativity to friends, for I feel people have enough to deal with less my own meandering experiences (although this somewhat contradicts the thread). Is that typical to our type, you think?
    My male ENFJ friend, Taco, doesn't like to talk about the negative things affecting him either. I can tell when he's just bottling it up. He's gotten better about talking it through, but I can see it's still a problem. It has to be much harder for the guys in general. His INFP wife is good to him though.

    I don't like talking about the really bad stuff because ultimately I feel as if I'm going to exiled from the group.

    But I'll heed your advice and equate "calling a friend" with browsing TypoC. On a side note, prepare your inbox for an influx of insidious inferences regarding the inner self.
    Bring your A-game, boy! I have sharks wearing laser hats!


    Mistakes made in life, people that have gotten hurt by my actions, people that have hurt me...are always constantly nagging, which results in an endless drive for self-improvement. When a problem occurs, it is the first priority to resolve the matter in a way beneficial to all the parties involved. Perhaps this is a false sense of harmony, as everyone won but the arbitrator? That is an unsettling epiphany.
    I still find I'm beating myself up over things I didn't get right that happened years ago that no one else remembers. No way is anyone getting at *those*. They'll stay in the back of my own mind where no one can see them. They'll go out in silence with me.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  9. #19
    Senior Member The Grand Chameleon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaggy View Post
    I usually get exhausted when my intuition fails to keep up with everything going on in my life. I tend to shutdown from lacking the ability to connect how I feel with the situations going on around me.
    That's an interesting perspective. I never considered the notion of a malfunctioning N.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saffronsocks View Post
    This is random, but in emergency situations where I need a bit of a boost, I find standing on my head incredibly helpful. I think it has something to do with the rush of blood to the pinneal gland, which stimulates feelings of euphoria and calmness. After re-inverting myself I feel... more like myself, only tinglier. And I know that's short term and doesn't really help with emotional problems, but it's something...
    That's awesome. You just randomly get up and do a headstand? The ironic thing is, though, that I reach exhaustion because I'm inverted so often. Not that inversion causes exhaustion per se, but it does contribute in my case.
    "In the game of chess, you can never let your opponent see your pieces."

  10. #20
    Senior Member MonkeyGrass's Avatar
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MonkeyGrass View Post
    Are you currently on meds for depression? (sorry, can't remember if you mentioned it) Sometimes they help take the "edge" off temporarily, so you can work through standing issues, like kyrielle mentioned. If it's the issues and beliefs that accompany them that are triggering depression, you might be able to come of the meds eventually without a hitch after gaining some coping tools.
    I don't take medications for depression, since I don't suffer chronic depression. This is more of an extreme acute case, of which prescription strength drugs would probably only serve to create another addict. But I wouldn't mind getting my hands on some of those coping tools you speak of. Care to share some from your own toolbox?
    Mine would probably look a little different than yours, since our issues are likely different. I'll share anyway, in case you see something that sparks your interest!

    One of my major triggers is the convergence of several failings/criticisms at once, and it causes a loop of "old" thoughts to play in my head..without self-disclosing too much, here, it basically sounds like, "You suck! You're not worthy of anyone's effort". Forming another opinion of yourself and inserting that into the repeated negative thought loop helps sometimes. Not power of positive thinking script, but something you actually believe to be true about yourself when in your right mind, such as: "I"m not perfect, but I am capable of XYZ".

    Exercise. Even if I'm exhausted, sometimes, it helps.

    Stopping myself and re-evaluating my expectations for that moment. If I'm attempting too much, of course I'm going to fail.

    Mental imagery helps. I do a lot of envisioning myself capturing problems in a bubble and then popping them away. Or smashing negative thoughts with a hammer. Pushing refrigerators off of cliffs. Whatever floats your boat. Word to the wise: don't tell ppl your imagery. After it's been thoroughly laughed at with tears streaming down your listener's face, it tends to lose it's potency.

    I give myself a healthy dumbo's feather. For me, it's the smell of lavender (I know, totally girly), this herbal stuff that's basically a few drops of vodka and something else, or acting like a complete loon. (In the past, unfortunately, it was less healthy: burning myself with hot metal. Not really so much a long-term solution there. :P) I tell myself that whatever it is will provide instant emotional release, and sometimes, it actually works. Sometimes, fooling one's self can be pretty clever.
    I think I think more than you think I think.

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