[INFP] On INFPs

[Asterion]

"Well, it is quite a high standard, if you're not the best, then you're not good at all... it could be enneagram 3, I'll look into it, but it's probably idealism. I'm probably really an INFP, I have no solid way of knowing atm, so I'll be a closet INFP . "

---A slightly different take on this self-directed perfectionism: I'm not comfortable with my abilities until they reach a level of habit where I don't need to think through every step each time. ---Perhaps a level where my N can work nearly on it's own. IOW I might be able to teach a college level course on a subject before I'm satisfied that I have any idea what I'm talking about.

The quote button's on the right pup

@ Orangey: They share the same functions, is there a difference between socionics and MBTI's definitions of the functions, I thought it was all based on Jungs theory? So are INFPs messy or not? It seems like they can be either...

 

[WoodsWoman]

Thanks.

 

[Orangey]

@ Orangey: They share the same functions, is there a difference between socionics and MBTI's definitions of the functions, I thought it was all based on Jungs theory? So are INFPs messy or not? It seems like they can be either...

INFj (EII) = Fi, Ne, Ti, Se, Te, Si, Fe, Ni
INFP = Fi, Ne, Si, Te, Fe, Ni, Se, Ti

INFp (IEI) = Ni, Fe, Si, Te, Se, Ti, Ne, Fi
INFJ = Ni, Fe, Ti, Se, Ne, Fi, Te, Si

This is only a surface level examination of the differences between the theories, but I think it sufficiently demonstrates that the supposedly corresponding types do not, in fact, share the same functions. This, in addition to the different treatment that socionics gives to the last four functions (out of the eight), probably accounts for INFJs identifying as EIIs, and INFPs identifying as IEIs.

So INFPs that identify as IEIs probably see themselves as messy, whereas those who identify with EII don't (primarily, at least). Within MBTI, it is a common stereotype that INFPs are indeed messy. This means that while some may not be messy at all, many (perhaps the majority) are. So yes, I'd say that realistically they can be both, but that if we go by common MBTI type descriptions, it is more probable that INFPs are messy than neat.

 

[lost verses]

I think they can be both. I value organization to a degree...my room has everything put away in the closet and drawers...except when you open the closet or the drawers, then you see the chaos. I think it's a hidden mess. On the surface everything must look clean/organized so I don't have to deal with it. But I'm still not as organized as say an ESFJ, who would insist on keeping the closet and drawers organized too.

 

[OrangeAppled]

Well, it is quite a high standard, if you're not the best, then you're not good at all... it could be enneagram 3, I'll look into it, but it's probably idealism. I'm probably really an INFP, I have no solid way of knowing atm, so I'll be a closet INFP .

Are you considering ENFP still? It tends to be an NF thing, not just an INFP thing.

 

[Asterion]

Are you considering ENFP still? It tends to be an NF thing, not just an INFP thing.

I'm not working on it too much, I seem to be packed full of Ne at least. damn, so I can only be a closet NF? lol. INFPs... when they care for people, are they more likely to care for random strangers, people they know extremely well, or everybody? The last test I took (personalDNA) said that I'm a benevolent inventor, I care for people without sharing any sort of connection, is that INFP like?

haha, I need more info on INFPs dammit, dish it out!

 

[Asterion]

I think they can be both. I value organization to a degree...my room has everything put away in the closet and drawers...except when you open the closet or the drawers, then you see the chaos. I think it's a hidden mess. On the surface everything must look clean/organized so I don't have to deal with it. But I'm still not as organized as say an ESFJ, who would insist on keeping the closet and drawers organized too.

I just plain ignore everything (or don't see it, I'm not to sure if it's voluntary), I'm very messy 90% of the time. If I clean up (which happens every full moon or so), I feel the need to change everything around, and also make sure that everything looks spotless , and occasionally put things in logical order. I also note that most things are somewhat broken, when things break or die, I throw them away and start again/get a new one, never fixing or repairing... what does that mean?

 

[sleuthiness]

Reality will never hold precedence over our ideals/dreams/visions/insanity. Daily chores are learned to be a waste of energy because we take so long to do a perfect job, so we figure, "why get all that into it?" Let the esfjs wipe our butts while we ponder the future away.

I've also noticed that infps are really good at overusing emoticons! HA HA HA

 

[sleuthiness]

Also, I don't know how common this is with infps, but I find it difficult to repeat myself for fear of coming off unauthentic.

 

[Asterion]

Reality will never hold precedence over our ideals/dreams/visions/insanity. Daily chores are learned to be a waste of energy because we take so long to do a perfect job, so we figure, "why get all that into it?" Let the esfjs wipe our butts while we ponder the future away.

I've also noticed that infps are really good at overusing emoticons! HA HA HA

I'd swear that I'd already replied to this post, but anyway...
none of the INFPs here seemed to be using any emotes, and I have 1 per post . I know of one INFP that loves them, she once sent hundreds of them for no apparent reason!
it was like:
^_^ ^_~ =) :O ...

 

[Nijntje]

I just plain ignore everything (or don't see it, I'm not to sure if it's voluntary), I'm very messy 90% of the time. If I clean up (which happens every full moon or so), I feel the need to change everything around, and also make sure that everything looks spotless , and occasionally put things in logical order. I also note that most things are somewhat broken, when things break or die, I throw them away and start again/get a new one, never fixing or repairing... what does that mean?

I have a propensity for ignoring mess and clutter, as long as it's MY mess and clutter i'm fine, other peoples things bug me.... i know where everything is in my organised chaos. I don't like dirt though and my bathroom/kitchen is always spotless, however i am a drop-my-clothes-where-i-walk/stand kinda gal so inevitably the living areas end up covered in clothing (the joys of living alone).

I also like to make piles of things in order to clean up, it's never really actually putting things away just ordering them into neat little piles, thus everything LOOKS like it's been cleaned when in reality i've spent 5 minutes madly dashing about piling stuff up - or shoving things into draws. I've never been good at filing things unless i have time to go through an agonise about the BEST logical way to put things in order (by colour, alphabetised, date etc etc etc.).

I also replace when things are broken rather than fix, but that's because i have no aptitude for fixing things, and most of the time it will cost just as much to fix as it will to replace. That help at all?

 

[OrangeAppled]

I have a propensity for ignoring mess and clutter, as long as it's MY mess and clutter i'm fine, other peoples things bug me.... i know where everything is in my organised chaos. I don't like dirt though and my bathroom/kitchen is always spotless, however i am a drop-my-clothes-where-i-walk/stand kinda gal so inevitably the living areas end up covered in clothing (the joys of living alone).

I also like to make piles of things in order to clean up, it's never really actually putting things away just ordering them into neat little piles, thus everything LOOKS like it's been cleaned when in reality i've spent 5 minutes madly dashing about piling stuff up - or shoving things into draws. I've never been good at filing things unless i have time to go through an agonise about the BEST logical way to put things in order (by colour, alphabetised, date etc etc etc.).

I also replace when things are broken rather than fix, but that's because i have no aptitude for fixing things, and most of the time it will cost just as much to fix as it will to replace. That help at all?

That sounds just like me .

Except I like the challenge of trying to fix something before I replace it, but I suspect that has to do with an emotional connection to things, as well as moral outrage that it broke 1 day after the warranty expired.

 

[Chloe]

I'd swear that I'd already replied to this post, but anyway...
none of the INFPs here seemed to be using any emotes, and I have 1 per post . I know of one INFP that loves them, she once sent hundreds of them for no apparent reason!
it was like:
^_^ ^_~ =) :O ...

you are focusing on some many details.... That's why I suspect you might be an S.

 

[antireconciler]

It seems to be difficult to describe INFPs perhaps because their functions allow them to relate to such a variety of life situations, but since the functions certainly require development over time, you find that INFPs can initially find each other working opposite sides of any given spectrum and learning how to relate to the other end. The mobility in their type is implicit in their initial wide diversity in attitudes and opinions and such, but only later explicit as they develop into the communicators, system-bridgers, and integrators their functions are well tuned for. It is the characteristic of this forward, inter-penetrating development which is so often claimed as the type's signature.

There is a degree of this mobility in every type, of course, which is manifest first as the brute otherness of others, then later, there is the rising above/sinking into all division itself which sees self in other and vice versa. This drive for networking and communication belongs to all types if any type.

The question becomes, what is different about the INFP's approach to the issue of otherness? In the face of non-recognition, what does an INFP do differently? Optimism and pessimism naturally belong to no type, but to individuals, depending on their confidence in the face of the unknown. However, each type's optimism and pessimism may manifest itself differently, since functions allow for the popularity or utility of varied coping mechanisms and susceptibility to varied forms of self-deceit.

Spiritual forwardness and typology are too often and too easily blended together where one cannot distinguish one from the other. Spiritual APPROACH and typology, on the other hand, is precisely one and the same thing.

Still ... INFP's and related types were only able to commit to that confusion in the FIRST place because their functions are well suited for turning back upon themselves, which exposes inner tension, since anything turning back on itself undermines itself. Necessity is the mother of all invention, so the types negotiate with the construct ... but the tension only reinforces itself because DEALING with the tension encourages the development of the functions which provided the self-reflective (turning back on itself) awareness in the first place. This has to proceed until all of conceptual diversity returns back upon itself, not by eliminating diversity, but through the extension of diversity into every form. It is this which burns away every dogma. The mind burns itself into perfect vision and knowingness, into everything.

 

[Nijntje]

That sounds just like me .

Except I like the challenge of trying to fix something before I replace it, but I suspect that has to do with an emotional connection to things, as well as moral outrage that it broke 1 day after the warranty expired.

Hahaha! Oh if it's something i might even have a chance of fixing i'll give it a go (like gluing stuff back together or trying to force something back into the spot from whence it came...) but most of the time i fail dismally, so there's no professional fixing, although i did have one cell phone i love, love, loved because of the emotional connection to it and even though it was a POS i kept on having it serviced and fixed and refused to replace it, even though my repairs were costing me more than what a replacement would have been...

There is generally a LOT of swearing when i try and fix things, sometimes stuff gets thrown around the house as well... Apparently i am not as calm as i thought i was when fixing stuff (Woo! go the rambling tangent reply!)

 

[Asterion]

you are focusing on some many details.... That's why I suspect you might be an S.

intuitive can focus on details. (refer to rep point ), I think it's ENFPs that have trouble with this though, they just skim the cream off the top. I tend to do that a fair bit too though . I just semi-skim-read and pick up on anything I find interesting.

That sounds just like me .

Except I like the challenge of trying to fix something before I replace it, but I suspect that has to do with an emotional connection to things, as well as moral outrage that it broke 1 day after the warranty expired.

Hahahaha, well, I tend to not fix anything, although I have tried before (and got bored of it halfway through, so it never got done) Usually I'll enlist someone to 'help' me fix it... and let them take over

It seems to be difficult to describe INFPs perhaps because their functions allow them to relate to such a variety of life situations, but since the functions certainly require development over time, you find that INFPs can initially find each other working opposite sides of any given spectrum and learning how to relate to the other end. The mobility in their type is implicit in their initial wide diversity in attitudes and opinions and such, but only later explicit as they develop into the communicators, system-bridgers, and integrators their functions are well tuned for. It is the characteristic of this forward, inter-penetrating development which is so often claimed as the type's signature.

There is a degree of this mobility in every type, of course, which is manifest first as the brute otherness of others, then later, there is the rising above/sinking into all division itself which sees self in other and vice versa. This drive for networking and communication belongs to all types if any type.

The question becomes, what is different about the INFP's approach to the issue of otherness? In the face of non-recognition, what does an INFP do differently? Optimism and pessimism naturally belong to no type, but to individuals, depending on their confidence in the face of the unknown. However, each type's optimism and pessimism may manifest itself differently, since functions allow for the popularity or utility of varied coping mechanisms and susceptibility to varied forms of self-deceit.

Spiritual forwardness and typology are too often and too easily blended together where one cannot distinguish one from the other. Spiritual APPROACH and typology, on the other hand, is precisely one and the same thing.

Still ... INFP's and related types were only able to commit to that confusion in the FIRST place because their functions are well suited for turning back upon themselves, which exposes inner tension, since anything turning back on itself undermines itself. Necessity is the mother of all invention, so the types negotiate with the construct ... but the tension only reinforces itself because DEALING with the tension encourages the development of the functions which provided the self-reflective (turning back on itself) awareness in the first place. This has to proceed until all of conceptual diversity returns back upon itself, not by eliminating diversity, but through the extension of diversity into every form. It is this which burns away every dogma. The mind burns itself into perfect vision and knowingness, into everything.

I have no idea what this means...

Hahaha! Oh if it's something i might even have a chance of fixing i'll give it a go (like gluing stuff back together or trying to force something back into the spot from whence it came...) but most of the time i fail dismally, so there's no professional fixing, although i did have one cell phone i love, love, loved because of the emotional connection to it and even though it was a POS i kept on having it serviced and fixed and refused to replace it, even though my repairs were costing me more than what a replacement would have been...

There is generally a LOT of swearing when i try and fix things, sometimes stuff gets thrown around the house as well... Apparently i am not as calm as i thought i was when fixing stuff (Woo! go the rambling tangent reply!)

I love rambling tangents, although they don't make much sense (edit: I mean, mathematically)... btw, I thought you were saying that you had an emotional connection to the professional you were talking to on the phone , I went back and realized what you meant though

 

[Nijntje]

Hahahaha! No, just to the phone... it was possibly the girliest phone I've ever had (it was a gold nokia swivel phone with lots of pretty embossing, sooo pretty) and unfortunately i pretty much cannot have a conversation without tangenting.. I'm pretty proud with being able to bring it back to the original topic though

 

[Asterion]

Hahahaha! No, just to the phone... it was possibly the girliest phone I've ever had (it was a gold nokia swivel phone with lots of pretty embossing, sooo pretty) and unfortunately i pretty much cannot have a conversation without tangenting.. I'm pretty proud with being able to bring it back to the original topic though

It's pretty awesome when you encompass a million different topics and then suddenly find yourself linking them together like some gigantic ball of spiderweb, both connected and globed together in one it's kind of boring when you don't do that... I've been wondering how well NFPs actually understand emotions, is it just that they understand what others are feeling, by knowing how they feel really well? When they do something (good or bad), do they focus on how it affects them, so they can understand the feeling? I was thinking that the understanding feelings might be one of those myths. From my understanding, any type can be emotional, it's just that Fs are more atuned to it and can control it (or at least try). I'm not so sure about the controlling emotions thing, an ESFP I know gets angry at everything, he just goes berserk sometimes and can't help it.

 

[Nijntje]

I've been wondering how well NFPs actually understand emotions, is it just that they understand what others are feeling, by knowing how they feel really well? When they do something (good or bad), do they focus on how it affects them, so they can understand the feeling?.

I LOVE tangents! My friends have had to learn to live with them as i cant tell a story without tangenting... some might say it's that i'm easily distracted, but i say it's because i have so much going on in my brain at any one time...

But yeah, the way i relate to people emotionally is through relating to my own experience which i always see as something to learn from. I guess it's a level of narcissistic empathy because although i try and see what it would be like for the other person, to truly do so i draw from my own experience, which fortunately (or unfortunately depending on how you look at it) is rather broad...

 

[Asterion]

I LOVE tangents! My friends have had to learn to live with them as i cant tell a story without tangenting... some might say it's that i'm easily distracted, but i say it's because i have so much going on in my brain at any one time...

But yeah, the way i relate to people emotionally is through relating to my own experience which i always see as something to learn from. I guess it's a level of narcissistic empathy because although i try and see what it would be like for the other person, to truly do so i draw from my own experience, which fortunately (or unfortunately depending on how you look at it) is rather broad...

I probably have a fair bit less experience to share than some people, I have found that some people naturally out-talk me because of this :steam:, you know, I have an odd red coloured S shape on my hand atm... it's really strange, it's like harry potter's scar ... lol, ya see, I just talk about nothing at all , and it just keeps going and going and going and going until nobody responds back, and then I try to come up with a new topic, and if that's rejected, I'll keep coming up with them, it's like I'm almost talking to myself half the time :rolli:, wait, I need more questions for INFPs, I've come up with a few lately, but I keep forgetting them... I'd like to know about the emotions thing, I might make a new thread for it and address all NFs. Alright, how many INFPs have high F scores? Going by theory, you'd expect F to be quite considerably dominant, and the tertiary Si, does it lead to INFP sensotardism? What ways would their sensotardism show? For example, I have a tendency to just drop everything where I am and walk away... which means bye bye keys! bye bye wallet! it's quite annoying really. And generally walking past destinations frequently, and loosing myself in whatever it is I'm doing at the time (which can result in missing a bus or two, or even getting on the wrong one), also, are any of you good at sports at all? I would assume sports practically require Se... but you never know.