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  1. #61
    Senior Member Synapse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BerberElla View Post
    Only if it's forced in the first place, I'm guessing certain types would find "romance" more natural and long lasting than others.

    I'm hoping anyway.
    But see men learn to do that, its not something that would normally be done out of instinct, that its a totally natural response, its more out of necessity that that is what works in courtship. its a smokescreen isn't it?

    yes some find romance more natural than others, but then, men wouldn't normally go out of their way to romance a women for the sake of romance would they? they do it out of wanting to get laid, because romance works as part of the attraction process. its like dress ups, would a guy be comfortable going to to a fancy dress party or hit the bar next door.

  2. #62
    12 and a half weeks BerberElla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synapse View Post
    But see men learn to do that, its not something that would normally be done out of instinct, that its a totally natural response, its more out of necessity that that is what works in courtship. its a smokescreen isn't it?

    yes some find romance more natural than others, but then, men wouldn't normally go out of their way to romance a women for the sake of romance would they? they do it out of wanting to get laid, because romance works as part of the attraction process. its like dress ups, would a guy be comfortable going to to a fancy dress party or hit the bar next door.
    Really, that's a bit too gender biased, when in actual fact people are often different than their stereotypical gender descriptions would have you believe.

    The ISTj I was married to had to force romance, the xNFP I dated for a year was romantic as if it was a natural part of him.

    The NFP was already getting laid by me, but the romance remained an integral part of him, more so than me.

    I just can't say that all men would find romance or chivalry unnatural.
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  3. #63
    Senior Member Synapse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BerberElla View Post
    Really, that's a bit too gender biased, when in actual fact people are often different than their stereotypical gender descriptions would have you believe.

    The ISTj I was married to had to force romance, the xNFP I dated for a year was romantic as if it was a natural part of him.

    The NFP was already getting laid by me, but the romance remained an integral part of him, more so than me.

    I just can't say that all men would find romance or chivalry unnatural.
    Yeah your right, its biased, this idea got me thinking after seeing The Hangover. My experiences are less than more. But then again a person can still have pretense about them for years, the illusions can stay as long as a person wants them to. Buy yeah I do think that SF/NF have a stronger romance drive or at least more mushy and sentimental in that way. ah okay I'm talking out of my ass now so meh.

  4. #64
    Senior Member Synapse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathanthegreat View Post
    Is it persistence in pursuing? Basically just showing her that you'll care for her FOREVER, and won't stop. unless she's married of course.I read everywhere that persistence is key to success to a lot of things. Any mature women who would like to comment on this subject matter, that would be awesome. Give me your insight!!!
    the op says it...care but stop unless your married.
    the language, the action, the precipitation that happens. then the person changes to the authentic state, the state that stops keeping up appearances. i think romance clouds judgment too, its what works so its done but for the most part its done as a learned response because it creates the imagrey necessary to associate with what might be considered sexy right.

    its like what is the most romantic thing to think about, wouldn't that be a wedding, i hear its like the coupe the resistance. yet would a guy really get that exited by the whole idea or just as easily dispense with the whole idea and go do something else like fishing.

    its the action over the romance. romance books are written that way to elicit the sensuality needed to create the image, to build on the existing ideas. while the actions for that romance are inherently created out of a need for that romance to happen.

    its like what is persistence of itself seen as, an initiation of intention when its wanted, as an action of interest, an action of romantic interest that appeals to a woman's idea that she is desired enough for her knight in shining armour in romancing her.

  5. #65
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BerberElla View Post
    But what's unnatural about chivalry?

    Isn't it very natural for some people to be that way anyway?
    Obeying a set of rules will always make your behavior a bit contrived, in a sense. But this is coming from an ENFP so...I mean people just approach it differently I guess. I'm all about being natural at all times, and "winning someone's heart" ... I know it's just an expression but it kinda hints at that whole "game-y" spin on dating/relationships/whatever...which I'm not particularly a fan of to say the least.

  6. #66
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BerberElla View Post
    I know what you mean, I find it much much easier to list the things I don't want, than the things I do.

    Perhaps because I have more experience in what hasn't worked, than what has?

    I have a sort of rough idea, ie he needs to be nice.......lol how broad and undefined is that?
    Most people don't really have any idea what they want or why they want it.

    But they do have an idea of what people will think! if they don't keep parroting the same bullshit about "LOL WELL ALL I NEED IS A GUY WHO'S CARING LOYAL AND HONEST TEE-HEE!"

    stfu. Caring, loyalty and honesty are prerequisites for most women, yes, but they don't do a god damn thing without 74 other abstract, frequently negative (hence the denial of liking them/embarrassment at admitting it) and totally arbitrary characteristics that few women will ever even understand enough to articulate what they are or why they like them.

    In other words, avoid women who use the above all-caps phrase like the plague--just like meeting someone new who claims to listen to "all music" on the first date.

    Avoid like the fucking plague. People like this either don't have any idea what they like or want, or are too embarrassed about it to tell anyone, in which case the lack of confidence makes them even less worth bothering with.

    /rant
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  7. #67
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    If you are trying to win a woman's heart, I think most of the work happens before you even meet her.

    Become an interesting, happy, self-sufficient person who is going somewhere with or without a partner. The destination in life is not finding a partner, it's pursuing what matters. Whether you stay single or find someone is like travelling in one of two different types of vehicles to get to your destination. There are pros and cons to both: If you travel alone in the Corolla, you have the freedom to choose your route, excellent fuel efficiency, lots of space when you want to pull into a parking lot etc. If you pick the SUV, you've got company in the car, you can travel rougher terrain, you can pack more stuff etc. Once you are fine on your own, you become interesting to other people.

    Learn to genuinely think of others. You can practice this with anyone from the guy who cuts you off in traffic to the person who needs a door held to someone who needs to talk to you. Then when you meet the girl you like it is not an act. She'll notice that you treat other people consistently and when you get comfortable enough not to be on your best behaviour, there will be no drastic change of behaviour.

    Finally, you need to realize that you won't be everyone's cup of tea. It's sort of like you selling red. It's no insult to you if someone else is looking to buy green. Red is still a great color, but it makes them look jaundiced. They might even love how red looks on other people, but they just don't wear it well. Someone else will come along who has been looking for your precise shade of red their whole lives. Or you will find someone who was looking for orange, but have just discovered thanks to you that red becomes them be-yew-tifly.

  8. #68
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathanthegreat View Post
    Is it persistence in pursuing? Basically just showing her that you'll care for her FOREVER, and won't stop. unless she's married of course.I read everywhere that persistence is key to success to a lot of things. Any mature women who would like to comment on this subject matter, that would be awesome. Give me your insight!!!
    1. They have to be attracted to you.
    2. Make your interest known.
    3. Be yourself.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  9. #69
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    If you are trying to win a woman's heart, I think most of the work happens before you even meet her.

    Become an interesting, happy, self-sufficient person who is going somewhere with or without a partner. The destination in life is not finding a partner, it's pursuing what matters. Whether you stay single or find someone is like travelling in one of two different types of vehicles to get to your destination. There are pros and cons to both: If you travel alone in the Corolla, you have the freedom to choose your route, excellent fuel efficiency, lots of space when you want to pull into a parking lot etc. If you pick the SUV, you've got company in the car, you can travel rougher terrain, you can pack more stuff etc. Once you are fine on your own, you become interesting to other people.

    Learn to genuinely think of others. You can practice this with anyone from the guy who cuts you off in traffic to the person who needs a door held to someone who needs to talk to you. Then when you meet the girl you like it is not an act. She'll notice that you treat other people consistently and when you get comfortable enough not to be on your best behaviour, there will be no drastic change of behaviour.

    Finally, you need to realize that you won't be everyone's cup of tea. It's sort of like you selling red. It's no insult to you if someone else is looking to buy green. Red is still a great color, but it makes them look jaundiced. They might even love how red looks on other people, but they just don't wear it well. Someone else will come along who has been looking for your precise shade of red their whole lives. Or you will find someone who was looking for orange, but have just discovered thanks to you that red becomes them be-yew-tifly.
    This is pretty good advice. Sometimes I think people who are obsessed with finding a partner are looking for a way to compensate for their depressing/unfulfilling lives. Unfortunately, making one's life fulfilling is something that has to be done before you can really expect a successful relationship of any kind...otherwise it's just a temporary drug that's bound to run out sooner or later.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  10. #70
    Allergic to Mornings ergophobe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    If you are trying to win a woman's heart, I think most of the work happens before you even meet her.

    Become an interesting, happy, self-sufficient person who is going somewhere with or without a partner. The destination in life is not finding a partner, it's pursuing what matters. Whether you stay single or find someone is like travelling in one of two different types of vehicles to get to your destination. There are pros and cons to both: If you travel alone in the Corolla, you have the freedom to choose your route, excellent fuel efficiency, lots of space when you want to pull into a parking lot etc. If you pick the SUV, you've got company in the car, you can travel rougher terrain, you can pack more stuff etc. Once you are fine on your own, you become interesting to other people.

    Learn to genuinely think of others. You can practice this with anyone from the guy who cuts you off in traffic to the person who needs a door held to someone who needs to talk to you. Then when you meet the girl you like it is not an act. She'll notice that you treat other people consistently and when you get comfortable enough not to be on your best behaviour, there will be no drastic change of behaviour.

    Finally, you need to realize that you won't be everyone's cup of tea. It's sort of like you selling red. It's no insult to you if someone else is looking to buy green. Red is still a great color, but it makes them look jaundiced. They might even love how red looks on other people, but they just don't wear it well. Someone else will come along who has been looking for your precise shade of red their whole lives. Or you will find someone who was looking for orange, but have just discovered thanks to you that red becomes them be-yew-tifly.

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