[INFJ] INFJ weaknesses are character defects(?)

[jenocyde]

Ahh well that explains it. ENFPs are often like that too with us, well one I know at least (yeah you know who you are. ).

You think I'm an ENFP?

I find that the INFJ way of hitting on you is by trying to analyze you...

 

[Sniffles]

You think I'm an ENFP?

No, this is one is actually ENFP, or so she claims.

I find that the INFJ way of hitting on you is by trying to analyze you...

That and strike up a discussion about an eccentric topic.

 

[Wyst]

I don't do this. I go for the throat, when I have to. But I prefer not to, because in the long run friends are better then enemies.

I don't really see this as a weakness. You can still have few friends with a large social network of acquiescences. I think we expect much more from our friends then most people.

I am sure I have no idea what your talking about... I find that living in a fantasy world is about the only way to take on problems (and then finish them) that other people won't take on because they are too difficult. This is a strength.

I rather like talking on the phone, as long as I'm not talking to someone who is really depressed, because then I tend to feel depressed.

Well I do think that INFJ's tend to be more vulnerable to unhealthy states of mind then most people because of the way that they think. Most people don't have ideals, so they can't be disappointed when the world doesn't live up to them. But ideals also can be the most powerful motivators in the world if you can deal with the fact that most of the world hates you for having them

Wow... an INFJ that doesn't sound ANYTHING like an INFJ. You're either lying about your type (since you only have one post) OR you're an extremely highly developed INFJ, which is a little odd because you'd at least be able to relate to how you used to be BEFORE you reached 'god status'

 

[IEE623]

Wow... an INFJ that doesn't sound ANYTHING like an INFJ. You're either lying about your type (since you only have one post) OR you're an extremely highly developed INFJ, which is a little odd because you'd at least be able to relate to how you used to be BEFORE you reached 'god status'

I still think he is an INFJ, sounds just like my annoying INFJ brother. lol.

 

[LadyJaye]

I can REALLY identify with you're saying, Scortia. You're actually hitting at the heart of what what I'm trying to get people to talk about.

INFJs are so introspective that it often leads to a high level of self-awareness. I'm REALLY self-aware, so much so that I feel naked/vulnerable/easy to read. So when we discover an 'uh-oh'. I think it's really easy to rationalize it by saying, 'That's just the way I am, I don't really need to address this".

My father is an INFJ, and I think he's self aware to the point of finding it crippling. Well, more like this sequence of events - he is unaware of a personal behavior, he has it pointed out to him, he suddenly looks as if he's had his pants pulled down in the village square, he retreats and reconnoiters. No matter how the news is presented to him, he seems to have a great deal of embarrassment that he "didn't see it", regardless of how gently it's put to him. My NFJ twin sister also tells me she finds the "cluelessness" ( as she puts it ) very embarrassing.

 

[JohnDoe]

Wow... an INFJ that doesn't sound ANYTHING like an INFJ. You're either lying about your type (since you only have one post) OR you're an extremely highly developed INFJ, which is a little odd because you'd at least be able to relate to how you used to be BEFORE you reached 'god status'

Well I'm quite glad that you think I'm a god, it really feels good

Well, I used to go for the throat all of the time. Learning not to do that took some time.
I've always viewed having a few close friends as acceptable as long while recognizing the value of networking (I'm one of the few INFJ's who tests as 8w7, the "CEO" type, and actually desires to be one).
I do like talking on the phone more then texting because you lose so much when you don't have the other person's voice to listen to. I prefer in face conversations more. This has always been the case.
And I've always been an idealist. Just the way it is.
If you still don't believe that I'm an INFJ, there are plenty of people on the board I used to post on that will vouch for my INFJness.

I still think he is an INFJ, sounds just like my annoying INFJ brother. lol.

How did you get this from the little I wrote? I didn't present anywhere enough information for you to figure me out. Projecting much?

 

[jenocyde]

Well, I used to go for the throat all of the time. Learning not to do that took some time.

How did you learn not to do that?

 

[JohnDoe]

How did you learn not to do that?

I decided to keep an eye on what I was doing when I went for the throat then tried to detect in real time when I was doing it, and when I noticed it I tried to calm myself down, take a step back, and think about what the other person was feeling.

Edit: For instance, if I feel my fight or flight responses kicking in while discussing something, I take that as a sign to step back and think about what I'm saying more.

 

[jenocyde]

I decided to keep an eye on what I was doing when I went for the throat then tried to detect in real time when I was doing it, and when I noticed it I tried to calm myself down, take a step back, and think about what the other person was feeling.

Edit: For instance, if I feel my fight or flight responses kicking in while discussing something, I take that as a sign to step back and think about what I'm saying more.

Interesting. I know it's weird to say say this, but I tend to think out loud (as an extraverted function). Not always so easy to put the pause on in a conversation...

 

[JohnDoe]

Interesting. I know it's weird to say say this, but I tend to think out loud (as an extraverted function). Not always so easy to put the pause on in a conversation...

I also tend to think out loud if I have someone I trust to sit on the end of the conversation

 

[jenocyde]

If you still don't believe that I'm an INFJ, there are plenty of people on the board I used to post on that will vouch for my INFJness.

Which forum did you post on and why did you stop?

 

[JohnDoe]

Which forum did you post on and why did you stop?

INTJf... I don't really want to get into a public discussion about it. If your really curious, feel free to PM me, but I don't want it to look like I'm carrying over a disagreement to this board. But this site was recommended to me as being a bit more laid back.

 

[jenocyde]

INTJf... I don't really want to get into a public discussion about it. If your really curious, feel free to PM me, but I don't want it to look like I'm carrying over a disagreement to this board. But this site was recommended to me as being a bit more laid back.

I was just curious - as I always am - but I am not one to poke and prod. I tend to ask questions until someone tells me to stop. I won't PM you about that.

Yes, it's laid back here to a point, like everywhere. At least you'll find diversity here... and some humor? I don't know. Well, welcome aboard. You should start an introduction thread if you haven't already.

 

[violaine]

Other types - feel free to hang out, but my purpose in this thread is to get INFJs' input on this topic.

So, INFJs - these things which make us uniquely 'INFJ', I'm curious how you look at them.

For example: (and granted, these are generalizations - not blanket statements)
• We tend to shun direct confrontation

I used to when I was younger until I was catalyzed by certain events in life. I don't seek out confrontation but I will not avoid it. That feels like betraying myself. Though, I will try to carefully express my thoughts if I am dating someone less empathetic or with lesser capacity for ethical reasoning/emotional sensibilities.

• We usually don’t have tons of friends – rather we have a few chosen comrades

True, I have a lot of acquaintances but only a few people with whom I consistently want to spend my time. I'm interested in depth of contact, not breadth. It's also that I find prolonged contact with people to be draining.

• We often live in a fantasy world – the fantasy world allows us to explore possibilities but often, we’re disappointed with reality, leaving us troubled in relationships

The way I conceptualize and conceive of things is how I chart my way through life. I prefer to impose on the outside world what I want for myself. I rarely contemplate without a goal in mind. (The goal may just be to understand something.)

I have always had an idea of how I want my relationships to be and am not easily satisfied with less than a very strong connection and the capacity for growing together. It can lead to dissatisfaction but I can't settle. Somewhat solved by only dating people I am intensely attracted to and then taking our time.

• We hate talking on the phone and would rather text

Most definitely with certain people. I like the expediency of texting. I enjoy speaking on the phone with certain people when I have the time.

I could list off more but I guess what I’m getting it as that the typical poorly-developed INFJ really seems to be a hider. Not a hermit, because a hermit has chosen his lifestyle because he’s often a crotchety old grump.

I'm too scared of letting life pass me by to hide from it. I am more of a hermit than a hider in the sense that I get overloaded by other people and need down time to process/contemplate.

INFJs, I think, deep down want to get out, but our ‘weaknesses’ trip us up along the way and we grow content with the status quo, content with our books and music, content with ‘this is just the way I am, and why the hell should I have to change? I’m an INFJ dammit!’.

So do you think our tendency to hold back is what makes us who we are or do you think it’s just one area in our INFJ-ness that needs to be developed, a character defect, if you will…

I’ve got my opinions but I’ll pull them out later.

I don't think holding back makes an INFJ that type. Rather it places one on a continuum of behavior resulting in variance in people of the same type. I think there are deeper processes/unconscious preferences at work but they can be expressed differently according to how we filter or push ourselves or the strength of our natural preferences. I may be stating the obvious but having something like Avoidant PD or the like will greatly influence how a person appears too.

A general aside: My concern about MBTI is the rigid-mindedness of some devotees, e.g. justifying one's behavior because of a type description; becoming locked into behaviors that are limiting because of strongly identifying with a type; being automatically dismissive of others of another type. If we were to substitute almost any other variable and do the same it would likely be roundly criticized. (Not talking about lighthearted references to type.)

Hmm, for me at least, I do find that hanging out with extreme extroverts tend to make me feel exhausted. For instance, my extroverted mother came to see me this weekend and from the minute she came in till she went out, she was talking non-stop about her life, jumping from one topic to another and hardly a minute of silence in between. It was a rambling monologue that left my ears feeling like they've had too much to process...I admit that I enjoyed the company, the funny stories about the toddlers in the family. But then she will go off at a tangent about this and that and it was hard to follow, even with a shared NF.

Perhaps the defect, if defect there is, is the INFJ's inability to filter all this information, turn DOWN the attention when the talk is all fluff and turn UP the attention when the talk is more interesting??? I know some people who can do that. I find it impossible to do that. I will listen to a loved one with ears FULLY open. I admit I also extend the same courtesy to strangers. So if the world is predominantly extroverted, is it any wonder the INFJ chooses to limit going out and limit interacting with people?

Yes, and that is exhausting. For me it is down to that I extend the same basic respect to all people in personal interactions unless/until given a reason not to. People in general are fascinating, I have had very satisfying conversations with strangers.

My friends react with surprise when I can quote verbatim what it is they said in some conversation years back. They find it scary. They also find it scary how I can remember word for word how they felt at a particular period of their life and what they had shared back then. In fact, that is what helps me see how they develop as persons. And sometimes the self-defeating patterns in their lives long before they themselves realize it. I've learned to keep that trait somewhat under wraps now...LOL.

The downside of that trait is that once someone is doorslammed, the doorslam is pretty permanent because there is a whole archive of conversations, happenings, etc that has been processed, the good as well as the bad. Think of it as chapters and annotations! You might call that the dark side of the extensive recall abiity of the INFJ.

Lol, I have this kind of recall and the ability to pick up on patterns of behavior too. I would be disoriented without it. My b/f often reacts with surprise and sometimes alarm at my recall. Heh.

Flattered, but you clearly speak too highly of us. I often notice this with people.

Hmm, yes, and that is unnerving. Sooner or later there will be a backlash too.

 

[Udog]

Hmm, yes, and that is unnerving. Sooner or later there will be a backlash too.

Hopefully it won't go so far as to cause a backlash. You guys don't deserve that, even if INFJs are being a bit idolized at the moment.

Honestly, I think it's the rarity combined with the fact that you guys are theoretically best matched for Ne dominant types (ENxP). Ne dominant types can become rather intense and obsessive when they get an idea in their head and can't test it out properly. Ne needs to be fed!

 

[the state i am in]

My father is an INFJ, and I think he's self aware to the point of finding it crippling. Well, more like this sequence of events - he is unaware of a personal behavior, he has it pointed out to him, he suddenly looks as if he's had his pants pulled down in the village square, he retreats and reconnoiters. No matter how the news is presented to him, he seems to have a great deal of embarrassment that he "didn't see it", regardless of how gently it's put to him. My NFJ twin sister also tells me she finds the "cluelessness" ( as she puts it ) very embarrassing.

this is a terrible feeling for nfjs. Ni and Fe make it so that we feel like we should ALWAYS see it before anyone else does, always recognize possibilities for other interpretation. it is one of the ways in which we create our feeling of security, planning ahead, preparing something relational indefensible, perfect, etc. it is why we seem so tight at times. one of the most freeing feelings is being so comfortable and secure wiht someone else that you feel spontaneous. that you do not have to be indefensible, etc. this is the differnece between healhty and unhealhty infjs, and, somewhat annoyingly, infjs usually require more resources and nurturing than others to get to this point. really, you REALLY love me, really really? wait, are you sure, mmm, maybe you could prove it, well that was allllrigth but it doesn't really prove anything, theoretically you didn't prove anything, etc. (sorry! )

Hopefully it won't go so far as to cause a backlash. You guys don't deserve that, even if INFJs are being a bit idolized at the moment.

Honestly, I think it's the rarity combined with the fact that you guys are theoretically best matched for Ne dominant types (ENxP). Ne dominant types can become rather intense and obsessive when they get an idea in their head and can't test it out properly. Ne needs to be fed!

definitely, you couldn't have explained the situation on these boards better. also, whereas enp types often feel unrecognized and unappreciated but still get out there and get a lot of shit done, are liked but not liked for the right reasons, infjs tend to withdraw more if it is not going their way. so when it is infjs loooove the limelight as much as any other type. it makes both types feel like the 92 dream team runnin' N circles round these european fools (or maybe the harlem globetrotters).

 

[Lauren Ashley]

this is a terrible feeling for nfjs. Ni and Fe make it so that we feel like we should ALWAYS see it before anyone else does, always recognize possibilities for other interpretation. it is one of the ways in which we create our feeling of security, planning ahead, preparing something relational indefensible, perfect, etc. it is why we seem so tight at times. one of the most freeing feelings is being so comfortable and secure wiht someone else that you feel spontaneous that you do not have to be indefensible, etc.

Very true. Very.

this is the differnece between healhty and unhealhty infjs

Wait, what's the difference?

really, you REALLY love me, really really? wait, are you sure, mmm, maybe you could prove it, well that was allllrigth but it doesn't really prove anything, theoretically you didn't prove anything, etc.

My personal favorite: Why don't you love me?

 

[iwakar]

Hopefully it won't go so far as to cause a backlash. You guys don't deserve that, even if INFJs are being a bit idolized at the moment.

Honestly, I think it's the rarity combined with the fact that you guys are theoretically best matched for Ne dominant types (ENxP). Ne dominant types can become rather intense and obsessive when they get an idea in their head and can't test it out properly. Ne needs to be fed!

We iz Ni-flavored biscuits with Fe-frosting for Ne-monsters?

omnomnom

 

[Winds of Thor]

So do you think our tendency to hold back is what makes us who we are or do you think it’s just one area in our INFJ-ness that needs to be developed, a character defect, if you will…

I’ve got my opinions but I’ll pull them out later.

Wyst...Are you Ne testing with this^...

*Wyst makes an attempt to add trustworthy people to his close friends. (Count me in!, OK!)

We gotta talk.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

So, INFJs - these things which make us uniquely 'INFJ', I'm curious how you look at them.

For example: (and granted, these are generalizations - not blanket statements)
• We tend to shun direct confrontation
• We usually don’t have tons of friends – rather we have a few chosen comrades
• We often live in a fantasy world – the fantasy world allows us to explore possibilities
• We hate talking on the phone and would rather text

check, check, CHECK, check

INFJs, I think, deep down want to get out, but our ‘weaknesses’ trip us up along the way and we grow content with the status quo, content with our books and music, content with ‘this is just the way I am, and why the hell should I have to change? I’m an INFJ dammit!’.

hmm. i don't see my infj characteristics as weaknesses. deep down i don't really want to get out all that much. okay, sometimes i DO, and i do, but, you know, it's never as much fun as i might have built up in my mind, and i've learned it's just ok to WANT to stay home and be happy in that. others would go crazy--my friends love to go to hear live music (and i do too after i'm there), or to a fun town nearby, or to a random movie; and for them to stay home would be torture. they're constantly running around doing 'fun' things.

So do you think our tendency to hold back is what makes us who we are or do you think it’s just one area in our INFJ-ness that needs to be developed, a character defect, if you will…

my tendency to hold back IS who i am, and i am okay with that. i embrace that.

because

i am here and my friends know it. i am at my maximum potential when i am taking care of my family, yes, but i have many close friendships i nurture on a regular (every few weeks) basis, and they are almost as important to me. in fact, before i even knew about mbti or my personality, i would tell my close friends that what i invisioned at this point in my life was just being a good wife, mother, and friend. most of the time that means i go to my friends' home or (usually) my friends come here, and they treasure that, and call me when they need to work through a problem or whatever--need a listener.

Here's another example:

Male INFJ. Wants to join conversation at the party. Decides not to partially because he can't feel the flow of the conversation and find a spot to jump in and thinks even if he did jump in, what he had to say wouldn't be received as he hopes. So he writes it off saying, "Meh... I'm in INFJ.. this isn't my cup of tea anyway" and so he ends up staying quiet, not joining in the conversation, despite that being the VERY thing he wants to do.

Is this an example of a true INFJ, or an INFJ that's blaming his weakness on being an INFJ?

if i go to a party, i find that i do latch on to one or two people i feel comfortable with or click with, and try to have a meaningful conversation with them of some sort. i CAN mingle well, but i prefer not too as it's draining for me. i am not an extrovert so i know i will not be the life of the party, but i do not expect myself to be, beyond making a bold entrance, which i kinda like to do. i like the excitement of hanging back and wondering who will give me the vibe, or who's energy i'll pick up on, and if that will be a surprising find, as in someone i wouldn't ordinarily talk to.

i totally understand what you're saying in the above paragraph. i think we feel the urge to jump in because we are picking up on the flow and reading the people, and sincerely enjoying the moment, and have immense thoughts and feelings flying all about our heads and bodies. but i do believe being a true infj keeps us from jumping in there. what is the big deal anyway? if we don't jump in there, we are still part of the conversation. the listening part, which can be more fascinating. if we do jump in there, it usually falls flat, right? it just does. okay, maybe we'll get lucky and our moment will be amazing, but then it will pass and we won't be able to sustain it for the most part, and we'll skulk back into the crowd hopefully unnoticed......haha. you know what i mean?

i think you are an awesome infj trying to make yourself into an enfj, estp, estj, ? or something like that.

are you finding it hard to be patient and to be a true infj because you feel like you can't meet women that way? that the women flock to the 'life of the party,' or more extroverted men, and that your normal activities aren't condusive to meeting interesting women?

be wary of becoming someone you are not. i think it is healthy to stretch oneself in an acitivities-oriented way, like, learning how to scuba dive even if you've always been afraid of water, for example. but forcing yourself to act in a way that goes against your intuition --our specialty function--is just driving you further from who you really are.

any excuse to use the smokin smilie!