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  1. #241
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    Good luck with that! I've been trying to do the same thing for 3 years... and I've made no progress. It's so intimidating, isn't it? It's just not easy to associate with people or build a network of friends when you don't trust people. There's also the concerns about things getting harder to control if you begin relying on people for things. It's so messy.
    Well, I am trying for a month and I can say that I have a observable progress in these matters. But I don't want to go too fast since that would look quite unnatural and it would not be that good as a strategy.

    I am sorry but I am too TJ to fail.

  2. #242
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Well, I am trying for a month and I can say that I have a observable progress in these matters. But I don't want to go too fast since that would look quite unnatural and it would not be that good as a strategy.

    I am sorry but I am too TJ to fail.
    I've always been jealous of that TJ confidence. Ironically, they usually end up effectively being more social than me, because they're more able to make dealing with people in certain contexts a practical issue rather than a personal one. They don't let things about other people get to them or repulse them quite as easily.

    And there's no need to apologize. I want you to succeed.

  3. #243
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I've always been jealous of that TJ confidence. Ironically, they usually end up effectively being more social than me, because they're more able to make dealing with people in certain contexts a practical issue rather than a personal one. They don't let things about other people get to them or repulse them quite as easily.

    And there's no need to apologize. I want you to succeed.

    I am curious.

    Why do you have so many problems in achiving this goal ?
    I mean 3 years is a lot of time.

  4. #244
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I am curious.

    Why do you have so many problems in achiving this goal ?
    I mean 3 years is a lot of time.
    I'm really paranoid, and every time I start to do something, I get faced with lots of unfamiliar details and complications that feel so messy, along with external pressure to plan it out in more detail than I like, and worry about worst case scenarios (which I'm already paranoid about) pretty much kills the spark and makes me decide to do something easier.

  5. #245
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    AO, I think that one of the reasons there was so much drama in this thread is because... well, you may find that we intuit your emotions and therefore think we understand you. But in essence, NTs do the same, and there's also proof in this thread for that. They just use 'logic'. I mean, how often haven't I had to clarify what I meant, because they drew a conclusion from what I said before that was..well...not correct. But they went with it anyways, as to them, it was logical that that's what I meant. And, indeed, afterwards, it was met with paranoia when I said that that was not what I meant (coz I must be trying to keep the peace or something now that I saw what kind of reaction I got). Isn't that what we do with your emotions? Isn't that NTs 'assuming' they understand what NFs are thinking?

    And for that matter, those moments, are the moments that you feel most annoyed and frustrated, even attacked as an NF, as they're putting words and conclusions in your mouth that you didn't even say. To them it might just be a way of 'fleshing out the truth'. To me, it feels like you don't give me the benefit of the doubt and won't even ask a question to verify if your conclusion could possibly be way off base?

    So the question becomes..is there something we can do about this? Do we both stop being sensitive to each other? Do we both take into account how the other one is likely to perceive our methods? Or is there some other option available?
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  6. #246
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    AO, I think that one of the reasons there was so much drama in this thread is because... well, you may find that we intuit your emotions and therefore think we understand you. But in essence, NTs do the same, and there's also proof in this thread for that. They just use 'logic'. I mean, how often haven't I had to clarify what I meant, because they drew a conclusion from what I said before that was..well...not correct. But they went with it anyways, as to them, it was logical that that's what I meant. And, indeed, afterwards, it was met with paranoia when I said that that was not what I meant (coz I must be trying to keep the peace or something now that I saw what kind of reaction I got). Isn't that what we do with your emotions? Isn't that NTs 'assuming' they understand what NFs are thinking?

    And for that matter, those moments, are the moments that you feel most annoyed and frustrated, even attacked as an NF, as they're putting words and conclusions in your mouth that you didn't even say. To them it might just be a way of 'fleshing out the truth'. To me, it feels like you don't give me the benefit of the doubt and won't even ask a question to verify if your conclusion could possibly be way off base?

    So the question becomes..is there something we can do about this? Do we both stop being sensitive to each other? Do we both take into account how the other one is likely to perceive our methods? Or is there some other option available?

    You see, this is the main problem
    I am sorry Amargith but about which drama you are talking about ?
    For me this is just a chit chat.



    If some other NTs got "excited" over this you will have to solve that with them.


    Here is a classical problem.
    I will use my mother for an example again.

    Something happens and she get emotional in a negative way what means that you can't avoid her and she is clearly overdramatic.
    But I don't see the point in this. So I just use my Te on her to kill the communication or to cause emotional cascade so that she can calm down.

    So she ends up hurt even more. But the worst thing is that she can see how I can go quietly about my business like nothing happened. Which is because I didn't use any emotions.


    You never seem to learn not to do this. You are repeating this over and over again even if we explain you not to do this. You will only be hurting yourself not me. This is why I/we think that this is simply stupid.


    I am probably not a typical NT when it comes to this but this is my position.
    Every time I see tears I roll my eyes and I can't help it.
    I am willing to talk about it but I can't do this if you are crying, screaming or something like that. What matters to me are facts, projections, ideas and outcomes. Which is exactly why problem can happen in the first place.
    I am sorry but I don't cry at all.


    My mother is emotionally stablie person it is just that sometimes shit happen.
    But over the years things got better since people learn over time after all.
    Plus I try to look more emotional what has proven to be a good strategy.

  7. #247
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Sigh, I was referring to all the back and forth that was going on in this thread, AO. Dunno what you're on about. I thought you wanted to understand how communication worked between an NT and an NF. I thought this might be of some help. Nvm
    The fact however that you chose to trip over the meaning of the word 'drama' in my post and not see the rest of the post, is kinda disappointing though.
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  8. #248
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    Sigh, I was referring to all the back and forth that was going on in this thread, AO. Dunno what you're on about. I thought you wanted to understand how communication worked between an NT and an NF. I thought this might be of some help. Nvm
    I know exactly on what you were referring to it is just that I don't see it that dramatic.

    Just because I gave you that reply that does not mean that I am not willing to learn. I am simply trying to show my background.
    I can't be clear if I don't show that. back then I was unintersted but that is no longer the case.


    The whole point of that story was that you shouldn't start to freak out that easily, since some NFs have that tendencies.

  9. #249
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    So wait, now you're intuiting my emotions? Did I say I freaked out? I used the word 'drama' to describe some of the responses that were given here. Maybe you guys would prefer using chit chat, fine. To me it was a lot of unnecessary drama. That doesn't mean I'm freaked out or hurt. Seriously. I wouldn't be in this thread if that were the case. As for my post, I was trying to get this thread to a constructive build-up, move passed all the 'drama', and maybe get some answers, find a solution, as this topic also interests me greatly. I'd love to finally get to that phase.
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  10. #250
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    So wait, now you're intuiting my emotions? Did I say I freaked out? I used the word 'drama' to describe some of the responses that were given here. Maybe you guys would prefer using chit chat, fine. To me it was a lot of unnecessary drama. That doesn't mean I'm freaked out or hurt. Seriously. I wouldn't be in this thread if that were the case. As for my post, I was trying to get this thread to a constructive build-up, move passed all the 'drama', and maybe get some answers, find a solution, as this topic also interests me greatly. I'd love to finally get to that phase.
    Ok, you have my attention.


    But I used that "freaked out" in general. It wasn't about you or even about this thread.

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