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  1. #71
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    enfjs certainly can be extremely giving and generous and harmonizing when they feel good and want to contribute to others, make them feel better, etc. people get off-put bc they see how, tho like everyone else, this skill is contingent upon feeling like one's own needs are met, and that it seems like they are just trying to get something for their own gain/benefit. the fact that their welfare is connected to how others see them, and that they need positivity both around them and directed toward them, is what motivates their need to harmonize (and in a way that is more direct and far more directive). this is altered depending upon the specific enneagram defense strategy employed, ie 4w5 have different needs and different ways of relating and motivating their action/behaviour than 2w1s or 3w2s.

    infjs are far more hesitant than enfjs when it comes to harmonizing. they consider the implications of their actions far more and far more critically, tho depending on their needs they may be just as self-understanding-focused (4), perhaps more expertise-focused (5), or more out-of-touch with their own needs/desires (9). infjs are still directive but they often pick their battles more and are far more reserved creatures. they spend more time organizing their own perceptions rather than creating objectives in the environment. this makes them feel far less pushy than enfjs sometimes do, instead sometimes falling prey to the horrors of 100% rigidity.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tikka View Post
    As an ENFJ, I often see things about people - good things, mostly - and blurt out a compliment about it. Sometimes this has been seen as toady or bootlickery, while *I swear* I was just excited by what I saw and wanted to mention it.

    I believe many people are too sceptical to accept that ENFJs are like this, because a negative form of this behaviour is often used to 'buy' affection of someone. Hell, whenever I meet another ENFJ I don't trust him/her either, as he/she's just too much to be real. Until I realize I'm the same way.
    match.
    I swear this is what it felt like whenever I was around my male ENFJ teacher. It seemed like it was flirting but, no, we just really liked to compliment. At first, I was really skeptical of and intimidated by him because he seemed too good to be real and he thought I was kind of sucking up to him (which I really wasn't).

    @ bold, that's absolutely disgusting.

    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    enfjs certainly can be extremely giving and generous and harmonizing when they feel good and want to contribute to others, make them feel better, etc. people get off-put bc they see how, tho like everyone else, this skill is contingent upon feeling like one's own needs are met, and that it seems like they are just trying to get something for their own gain/benefit. the fact that their welfare is connected to how others see them, and that they need positivity both around them and directed toward them, is what motivates their need to harmonize (and in a way that is more direct and far more directive). this is altered depending upon the specific enneagram defense strategy employed, ie 4w5 have different needs and different ways of relating and motivating their action/behaviour than 2w1s or 3w2s.
    Fe-doms can get extremely selfish if their needs don't get met. I always chalked this up to relying too much on Fe and then trying to balance out by going to the extreme opposite end (Fi). For me, personally, I tend to go to the extremes if I don't watch out. This may be why some Fe-doms think Fi-doms are selfish.

  3. #73
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    I think ENFJs are definitely a lot more people-oriented. Being extroverts, of course, this is natural. They're faster-talking and have overall better skills with influencing people, both in good and bad ways. However, from my personal experience, it has been mostly in good ways, since they are teachers by nature.

    INFJs seem to often act like ENFJs when they're happy, but they can't maintain this all that well. ENFJs are able to be like this all the time, which is very valuable for them socially.

    One more left-brained way of looking at it is by saying, is this person relating to the world predominantly more through Ni or Fe? If they give any signs of living mainly in a world of intuition, they're probably an INFJ. If they seem to just put everything out there right off without thinking it through as much first, they're probably ENFJs.

    Lastly, I'd just like to say, I love ENFJs
    A hero is someone who does the right thing without expectation of reward, just because it's the right thing to do.

  4. #74
    Senior Member Tikka's Avatar
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    What you also often read in ENFJ descriptions, is the chameleon-effect. ENFJs are very apt in picking up vibes from the other person and adjusting their own wavelengths to accommodate the conversation or situation.

    Often I find myself very quickly in a deep conversation with a total stranger, just by asking the right questions in the right way. Note that I write 'asking', as I really don't like to talk about myself - another ENFJ trait.

    Anyhow, I just wanted to state that Fe does not work with all people. I must be on my guard with NT's and ST's, as they are least likely to appreciate the strong Fe that ENFJs emit. Harmonizing with these people does not work, and I need to deliberately unharmonize situations (read: not agreeing with them every time) to have a good relationship with them.

    Sounds stupid, but I had my share of clashes with NTs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pitseleh View Post
    I swear this is what it felt like whenever I was around my male ENFJ teacher. It seemed like it was flirting but, no, we just really liked to compliment. At first, I was really skeptical of and intimidated by him because he seemed too good to be real and he thought I was kind of sucking up to him (which I really wasn't).
    I can understand that.

    As a male, I think being a non-Latino ENFJ male puts you in a disadvantage when flirting for real, because overloading a girl with compliments is a gut feeling for us to do, but as you all know it never works in the field. Unless you're a suave Latino, holmes.

    Fe-doms can get extremely selfish if their needs don't get met.
    Quite! This is such a recognise-fest.

  5. #75
    Senior Member Winds of Thor's Avatar
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    ENFJs try to manipulate by emoting good feelings, in an attempt of getting you to align with their views using these feel-good attempts to walk you down their garden path of whatever it is they want you to do or agree with.

    The only close comparison of these two types is their letters being one-off.

    Otherwise, INFJs motivate others on a deep level using signals and understanding the other's direction.

    Both flip out if they are pressured. Ironically, tho, the INFJ will cut to honestly describe what they perceive is goin on.

    An ENFJ if pressured, will just throw useless crap at others out of feeling in an attempt at sounding rational. IOW nothing based in logic. The INFJ will see the logic once they calm down and have had time to think about personal interactions.

    The ENFJs will generally still hold stubbornly to their same emotional beliefs-still nothing based in logic.
    "..And the eight and final rule: If this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight."
    'Men are meant to be with women. The rest is perversion and mental illness.'

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avatar7 View Post
    ENFJs try to manipulate by emoting good feelings, in an attempt of getting you to align with their views using these feel-good attempts to walk you down their garden path of whatever it is they want you to do or agree with.

    The only close comparison of these two types is their letters being one-off.

    Otherwise, INFJs motivate others on a deep level using signals and understanding the other's direction.

    Both flip out if they are pressured. Ironically, tho, the INFJ will cut to honestly describe what they perceive is goin on.

    An ENFJ if pressured, will just throw useless crap at others out of feeling. IOW nothing based in logic. The INFJ will see the logic once they calm down and have had time to think about personal interactions.

    The ENFJs will generally still hold stubbornly to their same emotional beliefs-still nothing based in logic.
    huh? This is the type of thing that makes me think I'm not an ENFJ. I have been known to be fairly critical and blunt if someone pushes me enough.

    What do you mean about the bold? What emotional beliefs? We aren't the only ones that get stuck in their own paradigm. Everyone does.

  7. #77
    Senior Member Tikka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avatar7 View Post
    The ENFJs will generally still hold stubbornly to their same emotional beliefs-still nothing based in logic.
    You're awesome. I love you!

    Are you one of those NTs who confuse rationality with logic and/or intelligence?

  8. #78
    Senior Member Winds of Thor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pitseleh View Post
    huh? This is the type of thing that makes me think I'm not an ENFJ. I have been known to be fairly critical and blunt if someone pushes me enough.

    What do you mean about the bold? What emotional beliefs? We aren't the only ones that get stuck in their own paradigm. Everyone does.
    See Post #76.
    "..And the eight and final rule: If this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight."
    'Men are meant to be with women. The rest is perversion and mental illness.'

  9. #79
    Senior Member Winds of Thor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tikka View Post
    You're awesome. I love you!

    Are you one of those NTs who confuse rationality with logic and/or intelligence?
    See Post #76, Last complete sentence.
    "..And the eight and final rule: If this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight."
    'Men are meant to be with women. The rest is perversion and mental illness.'

  10. #80
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    I'm in between, just like Pitseleh. I'm normally an ENFJ, but once I lose my energy, I become an INFJ. I might just be an Extroverted INFJ.

    The difference, by the way, is the importance of other people. ENFJs care so much about other people, they sometimes forget to care for themselves. INFJs like other people, but they feel like other people should respect them. They don't let others get in the way of what they want to do, at least not to the same degree as ENFJs. I could be wrong.

    In social situations or things that require working in a group, I'm ENFJ. If it's just work that I need to do alone, I'm INFJ. I have an INFJ's work ethic with an ENFJ's social skills and abililty to motivate people.

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