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  1. #341
    Senior Member bluebell's Avatar
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    OK, I have a question for the ENFPs. Do you guys adap the flirting or intense interactions or whatever you call it depending on who you're talking to or are you the same with everyone? The reason why I'm asking is I'm wondering if you take into account how the other person may interpret your behaviour or how well they may be able to handle it?
    ...so much smoke pouring out of each chromosome.

  2. #342
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    haven't read the whole thread but I think we just end up naturally connecting with those we talk to, and such a deep initial connection can be perceived by others as flirtatious.

  3. #343
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluebell View Post
    OK, I have a question for the ENFPs. Do you guys adap the flirting or intense interactions or whatever you call it depending on who you're talking to or are you the same with everyone? The reason why I'm asking is I'm wondering if you take into account how the other person may interpret your behaviour or how well they may be able to handle it?
    I personally adapt it as I go along. I tend to start very innocently and gradually build it up as well, unless there's a clear indication that the other person is up for a challenge or I'm trying to shock/mess with them (usually this is a one time remark then). You can of course gauge it wrongly, and that's why I tend to back off and see how they react before I continue. To me, it totally depends on the other person as to how far I take it. Much like a good game of tennis, or tag. It's no fun to continue if the other person doesn't wanna play imo, and I'm not the kind of person that likes to push people into something they don't enjoy doing. And I do stop, when asked to.

    I tend to bring up the fact that I have a boyfriend, I'm just joking and they can stop me at any given time casually in the conversation as the game continues.

    It's true that not everyone finds this fun, or knows how to handle this, so adjusting to the other person is very important, imo. I learned over the years that if you don't watch your step, things can get very ugly.
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  4. #344
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    A lot of my strident attitude comes from a desire to get people to acknowledge that it can be dangerous or unkind and to stop justifying everything they do as harmless or meaningless. Without consequence.

    In reality, I could give a shit what people do as long as their partner is truly, honestly cool with it. But, you know, it's not even about whether it's wrong or hurtful to your SO. It's also about what does it mean to sexualize interpersonal encounters? Is it fair to engage people romantically or sexually without real intent to follow through? Does no one truly get hurt? And, if we treat romantic or sexual connection as something casual or as a tool for "intensifying personal interactions", what does this mean about who we are or how we value romance and sex?

    I don't believe flirting is necessarily always hurtful or always serious or always dangerous or always leads to something. I just get frustrated by the attitude of "anything goes" and that no one should question things we accept just because people want to have their fun.

    I'm not always so black and white. But, I feel I must be black and white to reveal the nuance. If that makes sense. If we all start in the middle, if I go soft and fail to cut at your argument, then there is no synthesis of views. You do not defend what you believe or think to be true. I want to see your defense because then I know what your attitudes are based on. If it is principles, you will show me. If it is selfishness, you will show me.
    Excellent post!
    Quote Originally Posted by happy puppy View Post
    to take this further, is it fair to use Fi or Fe during our interactions with others even if there is no sexual context, or romantic flirtiness at all.

    Both promise some sense of personal closeness and connectivity. Is it fair to use that emotional connectivity to achive an aim, a goal, a consesnsus? Most of the time we do this instinctually-probably just like the flirting, actually-but once we are aware we are doing it is it still ethical? It is the same argument as above just made more global.

    Is it okay to "promise" emotional connectivity through a feeling function when we understand the recepient will never realize the true depth of that connectivity/function?

    Should we all become automons or ultra thinkers who only interact with others via pure logic?

    I dont know the answers, as this has been bothering me as of late, but I think the take home message is that the message is often instincually derived-we dont realize what we are doing.

    Once we are aware the sender has to become responsible for modulating the bahavior somewhat, as they have to take responsibility for the potential for mixed communications and message they just conveyed.
    This is interesting. I've taken issue with this in the past too. ENFPs can hurt people frequently by showing more interest than they can sustain. Either because of their own shattered illusions or their brief attention-span.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    "This ENFP did this to me", "That ENFP did that to him", that kind of thing. As if a couple of examples sufficed or brought with them anything relevant to the the "ENFPs flirting with no sense of boundaries" claim.
    ...
    This smeels like ENFPs on trial.
    You're drawing your own conclusions based on an unfounded feeling of persecution. People have merely shared their experiences.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith
    How do you justify it when you insult someone as a joke, coz that's your type of bantering, and they take it seriously? And why do you feel the need to insult them in the first place? It's pretty much the same thing imo.
    I was dismissive of this point yesterday. It's valid. If someone points out that your manner of interaction is hurtful, it's not a valid justification to say "that's just who I am, deal with it". This is something I have had to work on as an NT. But two wrongs don't make a right. And it's not really relevant to the topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by bluebell View Post
    OK, I have a question for the ENFPs. Do you guys adapr the flirting or intense interactions or whatever you call it depending on who you're talking to or are you the same with everyone? The reason why I'm asking is I'm wondering if you take into account how the other person may interpret your behaviour or how well they may be able to handle it?
    My sis is an ENFP and there have been countless times I've been in situations where it's obvious to me that a mutual friend or acquaintance is misreading her interest and is going to end up getting hurt. She always responds with wide-eyed innocence and I find this difficult to fathom, since ENFPs are usually so good at reading other people. But they are also really good at not seeing what's right in front of them when they don't want to, or of justifying their behaviour as above reproach and "other-centred". Does my head in, because I'm almost always right about how it is going to go down, but we all have our blind spots.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  5. #345
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I learned over the years that if you don't watch your step, things can get very ugly.
    How so?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  6. #346
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    I was dismissive of this point yesterday. It's valid. If someone points out that your manner of interaction is hurtful, it's not a valid justification to say "that's just who I am, deal with it". This is something I have had to work on as an NT. But two wrongs don't make a right. And it's not really relevant to the topic.
    So what will you do? Carve out that piece of your personality? Give up the thing you enjoy so? Or adjust it so it won't hurt the people you accidently hurt and keep doing it to others who can take it? Coz if you read my previous post...I chose the latter option
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  7. #347
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    How so?
    Not sure what you're asking. Like anything in life, this is something you just learn, practice makes you appreciate it more and refine it, I guess.
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  8. #348
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    So what will you do? Carve out that piece of your personality? Give up the thing you enjoy so? Or adjust it so it won't hurt the people you accidently hurt and keep doing it to others who can take it? Coz if you read me previous post...I chose the latter option
    bluemonday called me a bitch the other day

    She can't stop, because her heart was blackened and made numb by extended frostbite as a child.

  9. #349
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    So what will you do? Carve out that piece of your personality? Give up the thing you enjoy so? Or adjust it so it won't hurt the people you accidently hurt and keep doing it to others who can take it? Coz if you read me previous post...I chose the latter option
    None of the above. Mostly just not engage people who don't understand or appreciate me on anything other than a superficial basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    Not sure what you're asking. Like anything in life, this is something you just learn, practice makes you appreciate it more and refine it, I guess.
    How does it get ugly?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  10. #350
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Ajblaise

    Poor baby....
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