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  1. #331
    See Right Through Me Bubbles's Avatar
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    Weeell, ENFPs are just nice people. For example: a girl is cold? The ENFP gives her his coat. Does he like her? Who knows? He was being nice. What about needing a ride home? "Hey, I haz car! Come with me!" Are you sick? The ENFP will call you to see if you're okay. Can't find something to do on Saturday? "Come with me and my buddies!"

    ...Basically, ENFPs seem like flirts because they treat most people wonderfully. In my pleasant experience.
    4w3, IEI, so/sx/sp, female, and Cancer sign.

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    DISCLAIMER: If I offend you, I'm 99.9% sure it's unintentional. So be sure to let me know, m'kay? (And yes, an INFP would stick this in their signature, lol.)

  2. #332
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    Yeah, he did, and I did take that into account--I had just noticed that, since he had become rather hard-line about NOT flirting, and making sure the ENFPs were always aware of how they could be perceived or misconstrued, that he could actually be accused of the same thing (perhaps without even realizing). It's that line between perception and intent.

    I do think some personalities need more interaction and feedback than others do. And some people, to me, anyway, would have to completely change their personalities in order to satisfy the "can't-even-remotely-be-construed-as-flirting" criteria.
    So, a tiger may not change his stripes? I just want to stay on the high road if possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Gah! Now it all makes sense! The irrational posturing! The high-handed moralizing! The judgmental condemnation!

    Just like those "born again" street preachers!

    Gah!
    Guilty as charged. I am a person of extremes.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  3. #333
    Senior Member bluebell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluemonday View Post
    Ah. That's interesting, thanks. I guess we just perceive these things differently. I'm inclined to think the person is a horrible fake, or confusing, at best. Which creates, rather than breaks down boundaries for me. That's probably why INTPs suck at flirting.
    Oh snap.
    ...so much smoke pouring out of each chromosome.

  4. #334
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    That's so funny because online, I am much sterner and colder and detached. This computer is a wall for me. In person, I am much more gregarious and outgoing. It's hard for me to go 10 minutes without laughter. Is that flirting? I don't think so, but others might.
    Stay on topic. We have provided the definition of flirting several times throughout. It must have sexual or romantic content.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  5. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Stay on topic. We have provided the definition of flirting several times throughout. It must have sexual or romantic content.
    It is.

    The perception of her laughter being sexual or, more likely in such cases, meant to be romantically insinuated is in the eye of the beholder. She may not view it that way but that doesn't mean another person won't. It's not always the case that one deterimines to flirt but that someone else does it for them.


    This thread has given me much laugther. But, no worries, I'm not flirting.

  6. #336
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zarc View Post
    It is.

    The perception of her laughter being sexual or, more likely in such cases, meant to be romantically insinuated is in the eye of the beholder. She may not view it that way but that doesn't mean another person won't.


    This thread has given me much laugther. But, no worries, I'm not flirting.
    That's a good point, but let us keep flirtation to mean something that has obvious sexual or romantic content.

    Otherwise, everything could be flirting... everything could be sexual. But, we know that this is not the case.

    Open the window and a breeze blew in and I... jizzed..in my pants.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  7. #337
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    So, a tiger may not change his stripes? I just want to stay on the high road if possible.
    I think staying on the high road is admirable. I just think there's a fundamental difference between expressing your personality and having someone accuse you of being flirtatious, and being actively flirtatious with intent to cheat or make your partner jealous. And I don't think it's as cut-and-dried as you want to make it in this thread.

    If you think that you have been flirtatious in the past and that you've inadvertently hurt some people or led them on, then I think it's cool for you to realize that about yourself and make an effort to change your stripes. But I think you have to keep in mind that not everyone will see things the same way--even people that you CAN trust, and who ARE reasonable and moral. It seems strange to me that you're determined to make everyone come to the same conclusion, when there are so many variables. One being that sometimes, no matter what you do to avoid it, some people will misread your signals, because they are not familiar with what your flirting mode looks like. You can avoid all possible ambiguity by completely toning down your personality and changing your style of interaction, going out of your way to avoid women altogether, etc., but how enjoyable is that going to be for you, in the long run?

    Obviously, I'm not saying to not be considerate of your SO--to me, as long as you're thinking about those ramifications, and how she might feel, you're on the right track. You could probably even cut yourself some slack.
    Something Witty

  8. #338
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I think staying on the high road is admirable. I just think there's a fundamental difference between expressing your personality and having someone accuse you of being flirtatious, and being actively flirtatious with intent to cheat or make your partner jealous. And I don't think it's as cut-and-dried as you want to make it in this thread.

    If you think that you have been flirtatious in the past and that you've inadvertently hurt some people or led them on, then I think it's cool for you to realize that about yourself and make an effort to change your stripes. But I think you have to keep in mind that not everyone will see things the same way--even people that you CAN trust, and who ARE reasonable and moral. It seems strange to me that you're determined to make everyone come to the same conclusion, when there are so many variables.
    A lot of my strident attitude comes from a desire to get people to acknowledge that it can be dangerous or unkind and to stop justifying everything they do as harmless or meaningless. Without consequence.

    In reality, I could give a shit what people do as long as their partner is truly, honestly cool with it. But, you know, it's not even about whether it's wrong or hurtful to your SO. It's also about what does it mean to sexualize interpersonal encounters? Is it fair to engage people romantically or sexually without real intent to follow through? Does no one truly get hurt? And, if we treat romantic or sexual connection as something casual or as a tool for "intensifying personal interactions", what does this mean about who we are or how we value romance and sex?

    I don't believe flirting is necessarily always hurtful or always serious or always dangerous or always leads to something. I just get frustrated by the attitude of "anything goes" and that no one should question things we accept just because people want to have their fun.

    I'm not always so black and white. But, I feel I must be black and white to reveal the nuance. If that makes sense. If we all start in the middle, if I go soft and fail to cut at your argument, then there is no synthesis of views. You do not defend what you believe or think to be true. I want to see your defense because then I know what your attitudes are based on. If it is principles, you will show me. If it is selfishness, you will show me.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  9. #339
    Senior Member Uytuun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    Be honest. You want your cake and eat it, too. That's all I want to hear. It's not about depriving the world of your "beneficial influence" to not flirt. Give me a break.

    I don't really hear you ever talking about things from the point of view of what is best for your partner. Only what serves your own interests and inclination.
    Time to stand back and discover the irony in accusing someone of only seeing their own perspective when you write stuff like this.

  10. #340
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synarch View Post
    It's also about what does it mean to sexualize interpersonal encounters? Is it fair to engage people romantically or sexually without real intent to follow through? Does no one truly get hurt? And, if we treat romantic or sexual connection as something casual or as a tool for "intensifying personal interactions", what does this mean about who we are or how we value romance and sex?

    .
    to take this further, is it fair to use Fi or Fe during our interactions with others even if there is no sexual context, or romantic flirtiness at all.

    Both promise some sense of personal closeness and connectivity. Is it fair to use that emotional connectivity to achive an aim, a goal, a consesnsus? Most of the time we do this instinctually-probably just like the flirting, actually-but once we are aware we are doing it is it still ethical? It is the same argument as above just made more global.

    Is it okay to "promise" emotional connectivity through a feeling function when we understand the recepient will never realize the true depth of that connectivity/function?

    Should we all become automons or ultra thinkers who only interact with others via pure logic?

    I dont know the answers, as this has been bothering me as of late, but I think the take home message is that the message is often instincually derived-we dont realize what we are doing.

    Once we are aware the sender has to become responsible for modulating the bahavior somewhat, as they have to take responsibility for the potential for mixed communications and message they just conveyed.

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