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  1. #41
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Lady Pinkington - I spent years digging for my ISTJ dad's inner layers. It only occurred to me a little while ago that *gasp* perhaps they don't exist!! What you see is what you get. And that perhaps because some people don't have those layers, they don't know other people do either, so they aren't looking for them.

    People are a bit like candy. Rain-blo bubble gum and Gobstopper jaw breakers look about the same but one just has a little thin outer layer and then is all the same and the other has a whole bunch of interesting flavours and colours beneath the surface (some of which you like and some of which you don't). Until you have tested them out, you don't know which one you've got. I used to call the Gobstopper types "Get it people". I think their official MBTI name is N...

  2. #42
    lurking.... Wyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    Almost everything is visible.
    I don't agree with this. How I am on the exterior does not manifest 'everything'. If the metaphor is taking the tact of, "What you see is what you get", then yeah, I would agree with that. But again, I have to give the disclaimer that you should make no assumptions either.


    1) How much do you guys agree with this?
    For the most part, I agree with it - except the exterior bit.

    2) When it comes to meaningful relationships, how important is it that someone is able to understand OR appreciate the deeper layers?
    That depends entirely on who the person in question is.

    If it's someone I know well and desire to be vulnerable on the same level with them, then it matters to me a lot. Only a handful of people outside of my family fall into this category.

    Outside of those special people, generally all you're gonna get is the crust. Maybe the mantle. Some people I will not open up to. Ever.

  3. #43
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Just to clarify on the nature of the onion... I have difficulties describing myself concisely. I'm consistent in my beliefs and behaviour... yet I see myself as paradoxical. Put me in the same situation and I'll behave in the same way. Put me in a slightly different situation and you may see a completely different set of responses. It's difficult to know me well when I don't even know myself completely. A difference between Fe and Fi perhaps. I wouldn't know how I'll respond until I'm in the situation or I imagine myself in that situation. How do you expect others to see all of me?

    Like what wyst said, "What you see is what you get"... my behaviour is consistent, I rarely play games. That is not the same as wearing my heart on my sleeves. Niceness/ social politeness is readily apparent to anybody but I only share something personal with a select handful of trusted individuals. I take that as what you mean by meaningful relationship Udog... For me to be close to somebody. I must be able to assured that they'll understand more or less the convoluted explanations of who I am and how I see things. The second aspect is trust. Trust in the lack of judgment no matter what I tell them.
    My stuff (design & other junk) lives here: http://nnbox.ca

  4. #44
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyst View Post
    I don't agree with this. How I am on the exterior does not manifest 'everything'. If the metaphor is taking the tact of, "What you see is what you get", then yeah, I would agree with that. But again, I have to give the disclaimer that you should make no assumptions either.
    What I was trying to say is that while you see much at the surface, you also miss most of everything. The INFJs I've known have been very expressive (the oceans, mountains, etc), but as I got to know them better I realized there are aspects of their personality I would not have easily predicted.

    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    Just to clarify on the nature of the onion... I have difficulties describing myself concisely. I'm consistent in my beliefs and behaviour... yet I see myself as paradoxical. Put me in the same situation and I'll behave in the same way. Put me in a slightly different situation and you may see a completely different set of responses. It's difficult to know me well when I don't even know myself completely. A difference between Fe and Fi perhaps. I wouldn't know how I'll respond until I'm in the situation or I imagine myself in that situation. How do you expect others to see all of me?
    That's why I liked the earth metaphor more than an onion metaphor. The deeper layers affect the surface in complicated and not entirely predictable ways. With an onion, each layer is just more onion. With the earth, each layer builds upon the other.

    Thank you both for your thoughts.

  5. #45
    Member Evi's Avatar
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    I like this, a lot. When I try to explain it it comes out as half gibberish and unfinished sentences. And I agree that an onion doesn't work as well as the earth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    2) When it comes to meaningful relationships, how important is it that someone is able to understand OR appreciate the deeper layers?
    Very important, but I don't think I could have one without the other, I've been trying to decide and I can't. Understanding without appreciation sounds dreadfully cold and appreciation without understanding is limiting and sad. I don't think that either relationship could ever really grow or progress.

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