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  1. #21
    Senior Member SpottingTrains's Avatar
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    I think in order for us to parse new emotions and actually handle them in a positive manner we need to deal with the ones from the past first I find. If we don't allow ourselves to take the time to deal with we just end of getting more and more resentful to everyone we interact with.

  2. #22
    Senior Member tibby's Avatar
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    You ENFJs just can't do it all.
    You're the ones most people take for granted.

    It's okay sometimes to be the one who has it hard, who has to rely on someone. My mom is always the one who is the shoulder to everybody, and has been that all her life.
    She's who I respect in this world (there aren't that many at that level, quite frankly). The things she's put up with, all that has been loaded on her shoulders, and has persevered, her outlook on life has been an inspiration for me.
    I know many people feel their "mom" is their inspiration but I don't see it like that. It's honestly about her.
    But as she is this stoic rock to everybody, and I believe ENFJs usually are the "contact person" in whatever network they are in, she's never had anyone's shoulder. And she actually said that she doesn't know if there's anyone strong enough to carry her through as she has done to others.

    I can't really make it any easier on you guys, but some people do know about the baggage. I know a few ENFJs and they all seem to have that.

    It's wrong to take, take, take and give nothing in return, to use others.

    ENFJ needs a loving and caring partner.

  3. #23
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Interesting.

    The less evolved ENFJs I know are actually the ones I would say use people ceaselessly towards their own ends.

  4. #24
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tibby View Post

    It's wrong to take, take, take and give nothing in return, to use others.

    ENFJ needs a loving and caring partner.
    Yes. But never to go INTJ on them and want to protect them from every perceived threat, making contingency plans for that threat and blah, blah, blah. That's what I did with my ENTJ for awhile. I couldn't bear the idea of someone taking advantage of his kindness. Fortunately he knew I was doing it. He asked me if I had ever actually seen anyone taking advantage if him. I hadn't but I was planning ahead, just in case. He laughed and told me that all he wanted me to do was what I was already doing. Making him feel loved and cared for. Giving him an open environment to express his needs and have them met.

    While I was happy he felt satisfied in these areas, I still felt I needed to be a protector to him. What I realized over time was that he didn't need me to protect him from the kindness suckers. He needed me to sort of refuel his kindness tank by showing my love for him. The ENFJ's want and have to have so much concern for others in their lives and I was trying to change that. They don't need to be changed. The problem arises when people take from them and no one has real concern for them in return. That's all my ENTJ needs. Instead of being his emotional policeman, I just kept being the loving partner he wants the best ways I can be.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Desperado44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    Yes. But never to go INTJ on them and want to protect them from every perceived threat, making contingency plans for that threat and blah, blah, blah. That's what I did with my ENTJ for awhile. I couldn't bear the idea of someone taking advantage of his kindness. Fortunately he knew I was doing it. He asked me if I had ever actually seen anyone taking advantage if him. I hadn't but I was planning ahead, just in case. He laughed and told me that all he wanted me to do was what I was already doing. Making him feel loved and cared for. Giving him an open environment to express his needs and have them met.

    While I was happy he felt satisfied in these areas, I still felt I needed to be a protector to him. What I realized over time was that he didn't need me to protect him from the kindness suckers. He needed me to sort of refuel his kindness tank by showing my love for him. The ENFJ's want and have to have so much concern for others in their lives and I was trying to change that. They don't need to be changed. The problem arises when people take from them and no one has real concern for them in return. That's all my ENTJ needs. Instead of being his emotional policeman, I just kept being the loving partner he wants the best ways I can be.
    Wow...ceecee...that was a great read. If I had to describe what I would like to have in my life in terms of a relationship....you just summed it up.

    People really take advantage of our personalities. Its left me feeling 'down' lately....not sure why....I think I'm just tired.

    As for romantic relationships....I could sum mine up with a few words: never feel appreciated. I feel like I'm being bled dry.....
    I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel. --- Maya Angelou

  6. #26
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I don't know, people take as much advantage of you as you allow them to.

    This is something I really don't identify with when Fe is discussed. I have a pretty good sense of when I'm overextending myself with no reciprocity. I don't feel like I am used and abused.

    But I do understand the feeling that you're not going to get back as good as you give. I know I tend to have this feeling with other FJs. I have two really good IxFJ friends that are so superb with being supportive, available, ride or die friends that I wonder if I'm outputting to the level they are. It's a high standard to live up to, especially when the people are good, solid people.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
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  7. #27
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desperado44 View Post
    Wow...ceecee...that was a great read. If I had to describe what I would like to have in my life in terms of a relationship....you just summed it up.

    People really take advantage of our personalities. Its left me feeling 'down' lately....not sure why....I think I'm just tired.

    As for romantic relationships....I could sum mine up with a few words: never feel appreciated. I feel like I'm being bled dry.....
    Thank you. I think people underestimate things like regular use of please and thank you. Asking how your day went. Telling them you appreciate the small things they do. As you point out, these things are so very important. I'm missing the man as he has been in NJ all week teaching at his home office. But I have a nice weekend planned.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  8. #28
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I don't know, people take as much advantage of you as you allow them to.
    I think this is true.

    I think it's possible to reach a balance, Desperado and all of you ENFJ's!! Part of it may be learning to stand your ground and when you feel any anxiety/overextension rising within you, then just allow yourself to take a step back and give yourself some 'Me' time. It's ok, really. :-)

    I think another critical thing is to recognize and acknowledge that your gifts are unique, and that while perhaps unfortunate, it's simply a reality that most other people out there aren't going to be able to fulfill you in the same way you're able to fulfill them. It's just not in their makeup or personality. So I think it's equally important not to 'expect' that others will/can be there for you in the same way - not that you are expecting it, but I do think that's something at the root of the anger.

    I've sometimes felt 'used' in the past, but the reality was that I chose to do what I did. In some cases I was barking up the wrong tree - attending to others who were quite selfish and who had no desire to reciprocate. But you know...I did 'allow' that, in a sense. Just something you learn. I rarely have issues now with that and don't feel used anymore, because I now realize it's all in my control as to what I do and what I don't do.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  9. #29
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I don't know, people take as much advantage of you as you allow them to.
    Yep. That's what I had to learn about mine too. He never allows himself to be taken advantage of. That's why it never happens. I never even stopped to consider that possibility.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  10. #30
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascademn View Post
    I think this is true.

    I think it's possible to reach a balance, Desperado and all of you ENFJ's!! Part of it may be learning to stand your ground and when you feel any anxiety/overextension rising within you, then just allow yourself to take a step back and give yourself some 'Me' time. It's ok, really. :-)...
    You know there's the pushover aspect to this that I think is rubbing me the wrong way. I've never been a pushover or one to get trampled. I'm more likely to do the trampling than vice versa. So maybe this is why I don't identify.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
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