User Tag List

First 23456 Last

Results 31 to 40 of 88

  1. #31
    Glycerine
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    You know, State, I *still* have yet to figure out what Ni does for me except confuse me and cause me to catch on waaaaay after everyone else. haha! Niiiiiice.

    My Fe is in charge, but my Ni is constantly pointing and shouting 'What's THAT?! That thing there?! WTH?! Was that always there?! I feel funny!! omgbbqwtf!?'
    haha, Even though it's supposed to be my dominant, I'm still trying to figure out the purpose of Ni.

  2. #32
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    infj
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    2,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Avatar7 View Post
    I have seen these cloudy, fuzzy "impressions of thoughts", and what I found is..

    What happens if you ask yourself, (inside your head), "What is that?"..I told my brain to think about this and put those fuzzy ideas into words, and to "get back with me."

    I know it sounds extreme, but I did this experiment. I found it provided words came back to me and I had a more powerful way to describe my 'holograph'..Sometimes it came in pieces or segments of the whole. Then I repeated process on those levels and words returned back, once again (after awhile of course) from what layers were dropped to me at each time or interval.

    I sure would be interested to know if I am alone on this or if you find anything similar, more, or different. You are the first person outside of me that I have heard experienced this..this is good..

    I'm sure there aren't any right or wrong things on this one and I hope to learn more about myself and others.

    A
    this reminds me of my intj friend who helps me stay on track. she just keeps repeating, but what's the PROBLEM? what's the PROBLEM? first politely, then increasingly louder as time passes. it works. it makes me look more closely and more specifically, helps me zoom in and then let concrete words (even if they're not quite the right ones!) ground and guide me when the vision itself is only sensed but inexplicit, and the process of translating makes it so that even if i am not 100% correct in explicating the intuition, i still have something down concretely that i can adjust until it is right and i just know.

    dialoguing with the page, mapping out the possibilities, letting them take you where they may- it pretty much always works to some degree, it's just frustrating how much trial and error it takes and how the insight and the inspiration often feel buried under false starts and lots of almosts. the right amount of due dilligence and the right amount of impressionistic flourishes are tough to bring into balance, focus, etc.

  3. #33
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INfj
    Posts
    3,741

    Default

    The written word is easier because you can go back and re-work the words until you get exactly (or a close resemblance) of what you need.

    The spoken word has no undo or erase function. A listener expects you to describe/explain something "logically"... what they mean by that is linear thinking. Jump back and forth too often (as Ni is prone to do) and you confuse the listener.

    Second thing is focus. INFJs attend to the listener even while speaking. They try to adjust the content based on how the listener is reacting to it. Are they understanding what I mean? Or do they seem to be focusing on the wrong thing? Hence you get a division of focus... 1. Coming up with what you wanted to say 2. Reading the listener and attempt to adjust what you're saying so it's easiest for them to understand. All this under time constraint because nobody will sit and wait 2 minutes for you to figure out what you wanted to say.

    Clearly you don't get the same while writing. You can take as much time as you want with writing. Edit it to "perfection" if necessary.
    My stuff (design & other junk) lives here: http://nnbox.ca

  4. #34
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    MBTI
    eNFJ
    Enneagram
    4w3 sx/so
    Socionics
    eNFJ Ni
    Posts
    11,443

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    That's kind of how I view Ni. Though some people seem to enjoy it.
    High times, those agitated Ni outbursts. LOL Me and my INFJ Dad having one in tandem is pretty hilarious. We're like monkeys freaking out over a tree wearing candy pants.


    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i think of Ni at its best as an ability to keep reaching higher and higher levels of abstraction. bc it sees connections between many different layers of meaning and glimpses it momentarily as a very penetrating yet complex truth (Big Picture).
    Well-said, State! I can totally see how Ni does that! In fact, I *know* my Ni does that already, usually when I'm employing it to extract minute details from a picture or word or subtle signals from others. It works great for that. And then when it encounters a strange looking fruit at the grocery store, out come the monkeys in the candy pants. lol

    No, I have no idea what that means. Just like Ni. :-p

    but if it doesn't have any good information, it just feels cold and prickly- bc you know that, not only do you NOT KNOW AT ALL, but that you also can't even sense where to begin looking.
    YES! This! I do this! I do this... A LOT. Thank you! My Sensing function is so weak that when my Intuition fails to draw enough data from the cosmic ether, I really rattle apart, esp when trying to "work" a non-people related situation, like spatial or practical matters. You can't "intuit" a strange monkey fruit at the grocery store. It has no feelings (that I know of O.o), so my Fe-primary is useless. I step to Ni, which pokes at the object a few times, tells me something obvious with a little subtle "hey, I'll bet I know what THAT's for..." thrown in, but my Se and Ti just stand around looking puzzled.

    I'm trying to strengthen what Se/Si I've got so I'm not such a sitting duck.

    If it has to do with thought systems or people, my Ni is a Jack Russell and can chase something in the dark underground for miles.

    for an enfj i would imagine that Ni would show itself more in the service of actions and activities than in thoughts. infj is so introverted that most time is spent in pause mode, thinking, and NOT in participating and developing reliable instincts, habits, etc. enfj would use Ni pattern recognition and the ability to perceive many layers of meaning, but it would be externalized and aided by having a viable Se function to compliment. it sounds very flexible and adaptable. but with Ti as aspiring there is less conceptual storings of pattern, metaphor, etc to rely upon to internally organize Ni and refine it, and instead more of a constant stream of information coming in from the environment that provides new opportunity and external practice with more situations. ie less focused on inner/theoretical meaning and more on handling situations and recognizing their intricacies in a penetrating Big Picture kind of way.
    You tell me if my hair's standing on end, and I'll make sure you don't leave the house without your pants on.

    Quote Originally Posted by lane777 View Post
    Ay, I'm always very tuned in to body language. It says more than words.
    Do you find you stare at the eyes then the mouth, back and forth? I get so much data from body language.

    Quote Originally Posted by IDK123 View Post
    haha, Even though it's supposed to be my dominant, I'm still trying to figure out the purpose of Ni.
    It's wacky.

  5. #35
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    infj
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    2,460

    Default

    re: candy pants, i see two possibilities, you'll have to enlighten me further if they are unsatisfactory
    1) i'm imagining something so shiny that it could only be the glossy and sugary wrapper for laffy taffy, and nothing else
    2) underwear made out of fruit roll-ups, i've seen monkeys in diapers so pants might be a decidedly "loose" definition. either way, ginger definitely is involved.

    also, you simply must discover what this mysterious and (i assume) delicious fruit is. winter sucks.

    i also just want to explain, and this is an example of infj self-disclosure, that the cold and prickly feeling when Ni short-circuits was inspired by harry potter. damn you, lord voldemort, damn you and your death eaters!

    i do imagine that enf generally does play a large part in helping refine the fashion sense of the inf. fine then, i'll put on a pair a pants, but i WON'T LIKE IT.

    (i apologize for putting my elbows on the table. i would have liked to multiple quote, but my message-board etiquette is lacking- i'm highly out of practice)

  6. #36
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w6 so/sx
    Posts
    3,467

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    very specifically- i think infj has the most difficulty communicating of any type with infp close behind.

    infp can't articulate its feelings and values, they are decidedly private and deliberately fuzzy. they exist internally and their articulation only happens in the rarest of occasions (art, saintly gestures, etc). plus they feel themselves more clearly and use that as an extremely powerful internal compass. they live out their ideals and suffer their contradictions. they embody or become or perform them, acting them out, and discover the boundaries of their values thru experience and experimentation.

    infj is relying on Ni to formulate its thought, speech, and feeling. Ni is the worst form giver possible, bc it is only a glimpse of something, a revelation, an illumination that can be held together only for a second. you're trying to construct logically flowing (yet unbastardized) meaningful speech out of Fe and Ti when the only thing you have to go on is an invisible holograph that you sort of feel but can't really reconstruct or remember.

    not to mention that infj needs more desperately than infp to explicitly articulate and express its understandings. it is its whole mode of operation, its whole reason for existing, raison d'etre. to symbolize it, to create a meaningful artifact out of it, to congeal it into something powerful that will explode and impact everything around it.

    personally, all my life it's like i've been staring at this picture far off in the distance or this shape in the clouds that i can't fully see, and it's all i ever want to talk about. i want to grasp it finally and completely with total conviction and understanding. but i don't even know what it is, can't see it, don't even remember half the time where to look...

    The problem of communication is a result of not only the abstract nature of these two types, but also poor logical reasoning skills.

    There is almost nothing you can do about the first problem because you naturally perceive things in a very abstract and a complicated manner. This process happens unconsciously and unwittingly. You can solve the second problem however. If your logical reasoning skills are good you can make sense of your perceptions and present them in a way that is clear to others. Quite simply, INFs have trouble explaining their views to others because they don't know what they are talking about themselves. How on earth can you expect for another person to understand what you mean when you don't even know what you mean?

    Buy this book and get to work asap.

    Amazon.com: The Logic Book: Merrie Bergmann, James Moor, Jack Nelson: Books
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  7. #37
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ESFP
    Enneagram
    9w8 sx/sp
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    7,004

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SolitaryWalker View Post
    The problem of communication is a result of not only the abstract nature of these two types, but also poor logical reasoning skills.... How on earth can you expect for another person to understand what you mean when you don't even know what you mean?
    As for these points we are just fine with logical reasoning. We are far from irrational. When we try to express this to other people it sounds illogical at first until we think of a way to make them "get it." Te for INFPs is an exterior function... applying logic to things. This doesn't mean we don't understand things internally. I for one do just fine with logical reasoning, people understand what I'm talking about, things go smooth. It just takes a little while (a few seconds or several) for me to think of how to make that happen. INFJs have the same problem, internal understanding but not being able to express it as first until they think about for a few moments.

    It's not a problem really. The only "problem" is that we have to think of a logical response and also think of how to make it make sense to the other person. Once you get that down then you're fine.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  8. #38
    nevermore lane777's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    635

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Do you find you stare at the eyes then the mouth, back and forth? I get so much data from body language.
    Sometimes - if they break my gaze. Otherwise, I hold their gaze. Most of the body language I pick up on though, is through peripheral vision. Unless they're a hand talker, then I'll glance at the hands from time to time.

    It's fun to try and type someone from a distance, just based on just body language.
    To die would be an awfully big adventure - Peter Pan

    INFJ ~ 4w5 sp/sx ~ RLOAI ~ Inclusion e/w=1/0 (Melancholy Compulsive) Control: e/w=0/6 (Supine) Affection: e/w=4/0 (Phlegmatic Melancholy)

  9. #39
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INfj
    Posts
    3,741

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    As for these points we are just fine with logical reasoning. We are far from irrational. When we try to express this to other people it sounds illogical at first until we think of a way to make them "get it." Te for INFPs is an exterior function... applying logic to things. This doesn't mean we don't understand things internally. I for one do just fine with logical reasoning, people understand what I'm talking about, things go smooth. It just takes a little while (a few seconds or several) for me to think of how to make that happen. INFJs have the same problem, internal understanding but not being able to express it as first until they think about for a few moments.

    It's not a problem really. The only "problem" is that we have to think of a logical response and also think of how to make it make sense to the other person. Once you get that down then you're fine.
    Exactly! It's almost as if you're translating from the language you can in your mind into something that's understandable to the other person. It takes time
    My stuff (design & other junk) lives here: http://nnbox.ca

  10. #40
    Glycerine
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    Exactly! It's almost as if you're translating from the language you can in your mind into something that's understandable to the other person. It takes time
    Haha, yeah. I get mental pictures in my head of what I want to say or I will have a word pop up in my head (spelled correctly) but my mouth stll sometimes comes out with the weirdest phrasing or will just freee up?. Is it like that for you as an INTJ?

Similar Threads

  1. IQ and communication
    By Risen in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 03-23-2013, 06:09 PM
  2. [JCF] Of Intuition and Communication...
    By Ethereal in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 12-06-2009, 06:48 AM
  3. [SJ] SJs and communication
    By poppy in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 08-19-2009, 10:25 PM
  4. News and Communication Style [split from NTs: Just Plain Rude?]
    By Erudur in forum Arts & Entertainment
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 05-22-2009, 10:43 PM
  5. [INTP] INTP and communication skills.
    By Cypocalypse in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 05-19-2008, 06:49 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO