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  1. #31
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    And I'm like I was going to the store anyways, are you going to pay me back now?or it's no problem it wasn't out of my way. Like if it's not inconveint I'll do something for someone, but if it isn't then i won't.
    ;-) Sounds similar to me, when it comes to everyday things. I definitely don't go out of my way w/ that sort of thing.

    Similar to what others have said, I tend to be much more spontaneously helpful and giving of myself when I'm happy and confident. When I have low self esteem, I am uber-focused on that fact, so am completely self-absorbed. There is little to give, and I'm very selfish in trying to maintain and carve out my own needs - although at the same time am uncertain so don't have much backbone when it comes to saying no or asserting myself and my own views. It's a weird conflicting state. I suppose it's a sort of resentment - the act of giving, when I myself am not happy or solid.
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  2. #32
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    i relate to not having a back bone when it comes to the same things. which may be why i end up as the doormat. I should just tattoo welcome on my back, so everyone knows to wipe their shoes on me.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  3. #33
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    To mirror what others have said, if someone is focused on their self-esteem, they don't really do things for others; they're doing things in order to build/protect their self-esteem.

    This sounds like a subtle difference in priority but it has profound ramifications when a situation becomes stressful or hard choices must be made.
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  4. #34
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    When I had a lower self-esteem, I spent all my time "helping" those around me. I always answered my phone, I'd drop anything to talk a friend through a tough time, etc. But I wouldn't consider that selfless, I'd consider it stupid (and selfish, like everything else)...

    I'm much more helpful to people now that I have more healthy boundaries. This way they don't learn to rely on me, I don't build as many resentments, I can lead by positive example, etc.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Sounds like we're talking about the difference between healthy and unhealthy behaviors. The act is the same; the motive differs.

    The concept of "too-much self-esteem" is probably better named, "narcissism."
    The concept of "too little self-esteem" could be called submissiveness.

    And not only is the motive behind the act different, but the result for the doer is different.

    A selfless act can bring joy to the doer. A submissive act is more apt to bring resentment.

    This has been a long-time measure for me in whether I am responding out of need or generosity of spirit. How am I going to feel afterwards? Only learned that by crossing the line enough times to figure out where it was.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  6. #36
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainbows View Post
    Is it truly easier to be a selfless individual when you have low self esteem?
    Why or why not??
    Well, yes, if you derive self-esteem from a sense that you have some expertise to "help" others. It's not because you care. It's because you (perhaps correctly) think little of yourself and 1) helping others affirms to you that you have some competency in something, and 2) helping others helps you to condescend to them in some way by imagining yourself in some way more gifted than they are in the area of your self-designated expertise. Otherwise, the incentive to prove yourself is low.
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    I understand what you are saying, Ina, but I'm caught up with the idea that anyone should "perhaps correctly" have low self esteem. Low self-esteem is never a correct attitude to adopt from my perspective.

    How would you determine when you were doing this? How would you judge your accuracy?
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  8. #38
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anja View Post
    I understand what you are saying, Ina, but I'm caught up with the idea that anyone should "perhaps correctly" have low self esteem. Low self-esteem is never a correct attitude to adopt from my perspective.

    How would you determine when you were doing this? How would you judge your accuracy?
    Fair point, though I don't see low self-esteem as an attitude, but a state. It's not something you adopt but something that adopts you.
    Sometimes people have low self esteem because they are living way below their capabilities or indulging in self-destructive behavior or not addressing a problem (past/current) that gnaws at them. In that case, low self-esteem is a signal to change aspects of their lives. One way of doing this is to become good at something. Of course, outside affirmation/confirmation of these skills is a sign that you're not delusional.
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  9. #39
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InaF3157 View Post
    Fair point, though I don't see low self-esteem as an attitude, but a state. It's not something you adopt but something that adopts you.
    Sometimes people have low self esteem because they are living way below their capabilities or indulging in self-destructive behavior or not addressing a problem (past/current) that gnaws at them. In that case, low self-esteem is a signal to change aspects of their lives. One way of doing this is to become good at something. Of course, outside affirmation/confirmation of these skills is a sign that you're not delusional.
    exactly, no one with true low self esteem wakes up and goes you know it's tuesday i think I'm going to have no self esteem. It is not that simple. I mean esteem is not built or torn down over night. You can take steps to improve, but it's not going to be you're going to wake up one day and think you're the shit, if the day before you thought you were shit. You might think you are, but even if you feel good about your self for a split second if you have low self esteem you'll go right back to your "normal" mode of being self critical.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  10. #40
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    Yes, I agree that self-esteem seems to be more of a mind-set than an attitude. The question remains for me how one determines they are afflicted with it.

    Some people are self-aware and know that it is an issue for them. Others have developed their own coping skills to hide it from themselves/others. It will manifest to others as attitude/behavior and others can make good guesses that that may be something that a person needs to work on from what they can see.

    And prpl makes good points at how very stubborn that mindset can be.

    So now, I just had a thought. Could doing things for others possibly be a way one could work on building healthy self-esteem? Or would an attitude of service always be maladaptive for someone with low self-esteem?
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

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