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  1. #1
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Default does infj desire poetics?

    i dunno, do y'all feel compelled to develop your poetic voice and *acquire* a poetic license?
    want to stretch and get more elasticity in the musculature of your language?
    symbolize more assertively and drift along on words like the wind hitting the sail of your speech?

    do you read rimbaud, baudelaire, oscar wilde, whitman, kerouac, keats, dylan thomas, the Symbolists, magical realists like borges and italo calvino, rilke, mystical and metaphysical german poetic philosophy (the question of Being!), zen koans, liturgy and mythological literature, fairy tales, drug lit and dreams, musical lyrics, others (gardening manuals!), etc?

    what is this infj desire to be the most poetic of all types? to just like bask in it? that everything must explode before it dries up and dies?
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  2. #2
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    I'm not INFJ (rather, ENFP), but yes. Whitman is king, Keats is a genius (negative capability is awesome) but I haven't read in the French symbolists yet. I want to at some point. Who does German poetic philosophy include?

  3. #3
    a scream in a vortex nanook's Avatar
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    what i have read from infj (FiNe) is descriptive (like poems) but at the same time meticulous (like a whole story, with many details or many directions) .. so in my experience enfp are more giftet with quick short and highly abstract descriptions of anything concerning the human condition (like poems shout be, imho). or they are just journalists *g*. and infj are authors of "fantasy" or (descriptive) selfhelpbooks (defining something like the "highly sensitive person") , or teenage-poetry, like song-texts, which contain almost no abstraction at all, they just transport a story and with it an emotion (alla Clay_Aiken).


    as for NiFe people (considered to be infj by some) .. i dont know.

    personally i am not at all interested in the form of language. i am all for content. i like explaining something in order to experience understanding more than describing something in order to experiencing a story, or an emotion. i like the picture, the non dual concentrate of a moment. i found that in some enfp's poetic writings, but at other times, I find that the language games are just too distracting to get through to the content.

    i like to disassemble language, make my own grammar. my mother-tonge (german, as mutilated by me) is highly influenced by the technicality of English.
    technical is good to describe a causal context. i love words that are invented for the sole purpose of quick abstracting, like "transcendence" or "descending/ascending" "communion/agency" "mean green meme" or "darth vader move" :p ... not poetic

    i am visually/spatially inclined. patterns are so hard to match with language, i just give up. but i do adore every text that catches real content.

    check out david whyte (four videos in this series)
    YouTube - 1/4. David Whyte: Jerry Wennstrom's artistic journey

    here he is explaining something but he is also a writing poet.
    i believe he is an FiNe person

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  4. #4
    a scream in a vortex nanook's Avatar
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    also i think Steven Pinker is pretty cool. i guess you know him.... a big frigging linguist, very language skilled, analytic, dunno if he is creative in a poetic sense.

    although he is a little too meticulous for my taste, to get the big picture at times, .... but he makes up for it with volume, that is to say his views create a pretty big picture, slowly, as he goes on for hours and hours.

    what do you think: what is his type? he reminds me a little of Tim Roth or Lisa Edelstein or Carrie-Anne Moss (3 actors) so I am thinking: more intj than infj, but looks like he is on the borderline as he is well developed (thus ethical* and sensitive)

    *ethical=keyword in socionics

  5. #5
    Sniffles
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    I occasionally compose poems. My appreciation for poetry came rather late in life, around 16-17. Before that. I always hated poetry, especially having to write them in English class. It was only when studying foreign languages, which included poetry, that I began to appreciate it more.

  6. #6
    Senior Member professor goodstain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    i dunno, do y'all feel compelled to develop your poetic voice and *acquire* a poetic license?
    want to stretch and get more elasticity in the musculature of your language?
    symbolize more assertively and drift along on words like the wind hitting the sail of your speech?

    do you read rimbaud, baudelaire, oscar wilde, whitman, kerouac, keats, dylan thomas, the Symbolists, magical realists like borges and italo calvino, rilke, mystical and metaphysical german poetic philosophy (the question of Being!), zen koans, liturgy and mythological literature, fairy tales, drug lit and dreams, musical lyrics, others (gardening manuals!), etc?

    what is this infj desire to be the most poetic of all types? to just like bask in it? that everything must explode before it dries up and dies?
    Could probably link it to the basics. Most poetry reads protective of something at the core. Even rap.
    everyone uses every function about evenly. take NE for example. if there are those who don't use it much, then why are there such massive amounts of people constantly flowing through Wallmart with 20 items or less?

  7. #7
    Senior Member Winds of Thor's Avatar
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    Wow Sounds good to me...I'm ready to see into the 'soul' of your fabulous, deep meanings and insights...and enjoy every letter!
    "..And the eight and final rule: If this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight."
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  8. #8
    Senior Member professor goodstain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avatar7 View Post
    Wow Sounds good to me...I'm ready to see into the 'soul' of your fabulous, deep meanings and insights...and enjoy every letter!
    You sure? You're not gonna find much.
    everyone uses every function about evenly. take NE for example. if there are those who don't use it much, then why are there such massive amounts of people constantly flowing through Wallmart with 20 items or less?

  9. #9
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    I occasionally compose poems. My appreciation for poetry came rather late in life, around 16-17.
    Sorry, that's just so cute and funny at the same time. You make 16-17 sound downright ancient!! :-)

    I've never been one for poetry. I just don't care for it a whole lot; I suppose because I don't just automatically 'get it' when I read poetry.

    As for authors, I love Dickens, James, Dostoyevsky, Tolstoy, Maugham...actually many novelists from 1800's into the early to mid 1900's. Also throw Don Quixote in there. And a lot of sci fi and fantasy books. Oh, lots of other books...I love to read.

    As for examples in the OP, I can't say I've been drawn to those authors or the genre. I did read a Kerouac book, and it was interesting. I didn't not enjoy it; I just didn't particularly love it/enjoy it either. It was more an exercise in finishing the book and seeing/understanding/appreciating what it was all about, even though it didn't really speak to me.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  10. #10
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverchris9 View Post
    Who does German poetic philosophy include?
    as far as the poetic element of german philosophy goes, i think of it as a trajectory/trend or area of inquiry more than anything specific (or canonical). i think it shares similarities to the questions emerging out of bildungsroman novels, goethe, and especially evidenced in hesse, involving the nature of Self. transcendental philosophy is an attempt to comprehend, from the greeks, first principles and delineate the original metaphysical mystical primordial entity from which everything else emerges (emanates). it is the question of Being. it dominates german philosophy more than the epistemology or ethical theory, before taking a turn into (the game of) language with the late heidegger and wittgenstein (which, to me, signifies a decidedly poetic conceptual thrust and impetus for metaphor triumphing over the architectonic system building of previous works). hell, when hegel transitions from phenomenology of spirit to a philosophy of nature, i think it's the first great example of a poetic turn in transcendental philosophy. more superimposition, more representational freedom, more stretchiness. that something originating with extremely staid kantian analytic structure can, thru nietzsche and a return to almost eastern thinking greeks like heraclitus, see the world as something of flux, of endless complexity, as dynamic, and moving between the extremely rigid and static images of thought that language (as logic) is without poetry.

    there's also phenomenology like husserl and early heidegger (and taken up by some french theorists like merleau-ponty), which is essentially an attempt at discovering a purely descriptive language of experience beyond the confines of grammar, truth, and logic. also existentialist poets (the question of Being) like rilke and heidegger's favorite, holderlin. i'm not exactly sure where i'd mention neo-kantianism and hermeneutics. hermeneutics especially would be more relevant for the critical practice of explicating poetry, rather than writing it.

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