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  1. #1
    Senior Member SpottingTrains's Avatar
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    Default ENFJs and Criticism

    I saw a post along the same lines as this about ENTJs and was wondering how other ENFJs deal with criticism.

    Personally, I find it very hard to separate the actual advice (if there is any) from whatever they are criticizing.

    Just curious / looking for advice ?

  2. #2
    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    I've not read the ENTJ thread but will give you some of my experience .

    Even though I think this is true for several of the types my acceptance of criticism will be totally dependent on it's presentation. There is a multitude of ways to do this and the variety I've seen has surprised me. The biggest difference seems to be between thinkers and feelers. Feelers beat around the bush too much or go straight into confrontation mode hoping to get it over with. Thinkers on the other hand seem to be 'lost' when attempting to discuss something they think may go unpleasant with me and this can be annoying. You can put me in defense mode (and worse offense) if you didn't come prepared. They have tried the "blurting method" out of the blue to say something or sarcasm. Sarcasm isn't so bad but rude behavior/arrogance never goes over well with me. Joking around when the issue is mild is pretty good usually. I will get the hint. The way I like to deliver and would prefer to receive would be quick, factual and to the point. I have to change my style depending on the person just like anyone else. I try to avoid the Feeler pitfalls if at all possible.
    "At points of clarity, I realize that my life on earth is meaningless, and that I am merely a pawn in a bigger game. A game I cannot possibly understand or have control of. Thankfully, before depression sets in, I drift back into my cloudy, bewildered daily routine." **Joel Patrick Warneke**

  3. #3
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpottingTrains View Post
    Personally, I find it very hard to separate the actual advice (if there is any) from whatever they are criticizing.
    Anecdotally, yes, this is the crux of the issue, with one of my best friends, an ENFJ, who I frequently say, 'if only you were a boy'. We *get* each other. Her empathy towards others is awe-inspiring. I've never known anyone else who seems to sincerely *care* about trivialities of another's life. She can listen to a person talk about their random family issue, and she will keep on asking questions, and is actually *interested*. While most others would think, 'this person doesn't even know about them, I'm sure I'm boring them with details of the situation'...but, not with her, she will make the other feel that she is genuinely intersted in what they have to say. (and she truly is)

    However, there is a huge discord in terms of how we view/approach commentary on our personal self by others. For her, she cannot help but *care*, and thus, internalizes a commentary into how it fits into her perspective of self. I'm guessing it's because she is so attuned to the external thoughts/situations/ideas of others, which she manifests through an inside to out connection, all rising from the *self*. While for me, most opinions are like water off a duck's back. Only time opinions affect me is when it is a rational challenge on an ability/mastery of skill of mine, which I know myself to possess. I.e., it happens very infrequently, anything that gets me riled to a point of defensiveness. Most I argue with great determination - not for a personal stake - but for the hell of it. When she's upset, she finds this to be quite frustrating. In general, she likes this quirk of mine.

    For example, one time we had an argument over email exchange, lasting quite a few back/forth emails, where she was going to an event, and wanting to dress in x clothes. When I was invited, I said I didn't want to go cuz to me, it was a smooze fest and if I went I would wear y clothes. She took it as a personal criticism on her. Which is quite frustrating to me, when someone projects my own commentary to themselves. And, most importantly, why would you care, they're just opinions? Just get on with it, and deal with it. Don't sit in the hurt of another's opinion.

    Her response to me, and quite a few commentary on my character:
    "I appreciate the fact that i care about what others think of me. It may be overly so for some others, but for me, as per my belief, it is an APPRORIATE amount. In fact, i think, that others, should be just as concerned about what others think. IN MY OPINION, again, it is considerate. Those who aren't as conscious of those around them, THINK their actions and beliefs, despite what they may feel, doesn't affect others. They don't exist in a world of their own making, and though many ppl have that egocentric view that things run their way and who the fuck cares what others think, i have a very different opinion to that. I think ppl need be more considerate of their surroundings. I hope i have put nothing in anyone's mouth in the statements made above. I solemly swear that the statements made here are solely an expression of my own individual thoughts and if i've stuffed anyone's face with my opinion, i could say i'm sorry, or i could take given advice, and say, go fucking deal with it."

    haha!

    ENTP-ENFJ. Fun times. She likes to take my impersonal (sometimes, brutal?) advice to her and throw it back in my face, when upset. It only raises my amusement with the whole situation.

    But, at the end, there's always the love to come back to, and deep understanding of each other. Once the 'fight' ended, here was her commentary on the whole situation:
    "Yaay! Like old times. I'm like, Qre:us and i have resorted to arguing on the net....it's definitely diff, and it's been some time overdue. It was fun. We're getting more focused and controlled at this. There's less loss of cool...i sense a def. improvement ...we're bouncing well to each other's tunenow, if you get my drift. Practice makes purrfect. Anyways, i'm tired. Go eat your pickles, go groan....i wish i was there, so i could just walk over from my room and wring your neck. Oh i also wish i was there cause i miss you. Gnite!!"

    So, once cooled down, she can laugh at the situation, and access her Ti, which makes her take a step back, take stock of the whole situation, and finally find the *calm*. And, the humour. Which she got in spades.

  4. #4
    Senior Member The Third Rider's Avatar
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    That reminds me EXACLTY of how my interection goes with my best friend (ENTJ).

    ENTP-ENFJ. Fun times. She likes to take my impersonal (sometimes, brutal?) advice to her and throw it back in my face, when upset. It only raises my amusement with the whole situation.
    Oh yes i seen that from him many many times as well, that bastard.
    ENFJ 3W4

    If you read this I am sorry to say that you just lost 5 seconds of your life that you wont be getting back.*

    *Actual time may vary.

  5. #5
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Constructive criticism is welcome. But personal criticism? I don't always take that so well. Esp not about something that I find embarrassing or that smacks of failure in spite of my efforts. I've gotten a thicker skin as I've gotten older, but it's still no cake walk.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

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    Senior Member SpottingTrains's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Constructive criticism is welcome. But personal criticism? I don't always take that so well. Esp not about something that I find embarrassing or that smacks of failure in spite of my efforts. I've gotten a thicker skin as I've gotten older, but it's still no cake walk.
    I'm pretty much the same way, if it's personally embarrassing it makes it all so much worse ><

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    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Go eat your pickles, go groan....i wish i was there, so i could just walk over from my room and wring your neck. Oh i also wish i was there cause i miss you.
    Good heavens. I've said this before. LOL

    "If I loved you any more, I'd have to kill you."

    "I hate you, I can't stand the sight of you. You make me feel sick in ways that words haven't been invented to describe. Also, I want to have your babies."

    "I'm selling you to nomads for many fancy hand-loomed rugs. Stop crying. Remember I love you."

    It's just love taps. My ENTP was all about it too. He didn't feel "right" unless I was calling him a sexy beast while I was clinging to his leg trying to cut his boot straps with my knife for being an intolerable smart aleck.

    I had a recurring fantasy of knocking him down in the hallway, planting my pointy knee in his back and gleefully berating him to Shakespearean levels. He loved it. Perhaps he was more perverted than I gave him credit for. Shame on me.

    Ah yes. Good times.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

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