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  1. #51
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ani_DiFranco-Marrow
    i'm not listening to you anymore
    my head is too sore and my heart's perforated
    and i'm mired in the marrow of my well... ain't that funny bone
    learning how to be alone and devastated

    where was my conscience?
    where was my consciousness?
    and what do i do with all these letters
    that i wrote to myself
    but cannot address?
    Yet another excerpt from the ENFJs darkside
    I N V I C T U S

  2. #52
    Senior Member SpottingTrains's Avatar
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    I still don't think that is really what the "dark side" consists of but what again as an addendum, I hate reading music like that lol.

  3. #53
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    The Shadow as I imagined it begins to sound like emotion or shock left unprocessed but the memory or instinct of it is still present and guiding. Or perhaps shadows arise as (negative) awareness that shock is so easily come by and so difficult to escape. So... negative control.


    Assuaged by Ti made sympathetic by Ne, perhaps?

    That's a thing I get signs of, like submarine pings, around ENFJs... the need to have what I don't have, Ne, because they (you guys) need someone to see you.

    (Um, that comment I just made ^^, is that like a slap? It seems like it might be. (Or is commenting on it as a slap the thing that makes it a slap?) Or do I just not know?)




    Ani DiFranco pretty much has to be INFJ, yeah? (Or has an INFJ lyricist she likes. )

  4. #54
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Ani is an ENFJ
    I N V I C T U S

  5. #55
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    J'accuse moi-meme.

    Guilty of assuming only I's reflect on negative self imagery.


    Ack, Te is such a ham-fisted device sometimes.

  6. #56
    Earth Exalted Thursday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    J'accuse moi-meme.

    Guilty of assuming only I's reflect on negative self imagery.


    Ack, Te is such a ham-fisted device sometimes.
    No.
    So what say ye, counselor?
    I N V I C T U S

  7. #57
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thursday View Post
    No.
    So what say ye, counselor?
    I say, it momentarily seemed to me that if there is this ENFJ dark side--unmentionable, unannounced, but seemingly obviously present--then having Ani sing it out for everyone to see...

    Anyway, I still think of the Shadow as turmoil. Resisted trumoil. Perhaps denied. I assume it to be part of the process by which ENFJs judge. Something about memory and response and planning. The difference between future dream and reality. And history. And hope. Perfectionism. Dunno. I suppose I'm talking about it as a way of finding out how to... take part, maybe?


    I also get a strong, strong feeling that when I have at these things with my Te voice and background Fi, that I'm scraping away at something, like a guy with a straight razor and a blindfold and a ride-on mower. Woo hoo! Beating rainbows with knobbly sticks!

    It's a vexatious conundrum and one unfortunate factor is my own version of Fi values tends me to expect other people to toughen up sometimes. To me experience says its seems wrong to warn FJs to toughen up, but value says they should, but logic says their particular toughness is in other areas, but... and so on.

  8. #58
    Senior Member Jeremy's Avatar
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    I agree with you that the ENFJs have a shadow. Their shadow is what they don't tell others. What they omit from their conversations. Why they don't want to be alone. It's easier to drown out pain and suffering if you keep yourself busy with the problems of others, and pretend to wear your emotions on your sleeve. In reality, ENFJs (and I would argue ESFJs as well) have a well-developed inner world, but it is surprisingly dark. Darker than they allow others to see.

    ENFJs and SFJs like to project themselves as being emotional, being able to be overcome by emotion, but only as an act for others, not for themselves. Fe to me is just that. It's being concerned with social niceties, not necessarily because one is "fake", but, just like all personality types, as a way of coping with reality. Fe types tend toward the outer world as a way of rejecting the reality inside them, just as Fi types can sometimes forsake the outer world as a way to reject the reality that exists outside of them, which can leave us feeling dejected and alone at times.

    The result is usually that Fe types can forget that they can be happy without projecting their emotions onto others, and all of their effort goes into projecting that happiness. Fi types, on the other hand, begin to question the emotions of the outer world, refusing to project much emotion onto others except as a means of self-affirmation. That is the origin of the shadow in both types.

    If I completely missed the mark, lemme know. I didn't read the middle of the topic. :P
    "Can you set me free from this dark inner world? Save me now, last beats in the soul.."

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  9. #59
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    My encounters with my Ti when under stress don't make a very rosy scene. Turning into a cold affective automaton, not charming. I was just telling my sister last night what a monster Fe is, floating so close to the surface. It's shock therapy, both good and bad. Some days you just don't feel like sticking your finger in the light socket.

    Does anyone else go into automatic "fix it" mode? Jaye is constantly telling me "You don't have to fix this" when I hear another problem come up. It's knee jerk with me though. I don't realize that I'm in trouble shooting mode until it's pointed out. I hear the threat and set about neutralizing it immediately.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  10. #60
    Senior Member SpottingTrains's Avatar
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    My ENTJ friends break things and I fix them, that's usually how the system goes lol.

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