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  1. #21
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thursday View Post
    they respond with the Fe-Se " but don't worry about it, *joke and slap on the shoulder/disappear*
    very well-said
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  2. #22
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thursday View Post
    funny how the ENFJs concede but don't show their vulnerability
    I know of three ENFJs, two of which i frequently come in contact with
    and although they may relay the info like its dust in the wind
    that same dust is laced with an underlining; dark and impending/palpable sorrow

    they stare off into space - the room gets silent and tense
    you can almost see the images they are, at least feel them
    its like the Ni and Ti axis haunts them, and they respond with the Fe-Se " but don't worry about it, *joke and slap on the shoulder/disappear*
    Yeah, very well said.

    Being a semi-dual to that kind of ... poetic sorrow? (*cough*horseshit*cough*)... is a trial. Can see it, conspicuously lack the tools to address it.

    I say the dark side is there. I say it is the murky, turbid, heaving pool from which judgment arises. It has to be, doesn't it? If feeling is the source of judgment, there has sometimes to be negative judgment, yeah? Accentuating the positive doesn't make you positive all the way through, it makes for positive messaging.


    Knowing. That's what ENFJs are. They're knowing. Like INFJs but without ever taking the opportunity to rest and face what is chasing them.

    Or perhaps the shadow is only when things go wrong. But only an infant has nothing go wrong and even ENFJs have memories... actually, probably long, long memories...

  3. #23
    Senior Member chris1207's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thursday View Post
    funny how the ENFJs concede but don't show their vulnerability
    I know of three ENFJs, two of which i frequently come in contact with
    and although they may relay the info like its dust in the wind
    that same dust is laced with an underlining; dark and impending/palpable sorrow

    they stare off into space - the room gets silent and tense
    you can almost see the images they are, at least feel them
    its like the Ni and Ti axis haunts them, and they respond with the Fe-Se " but don't worry about it, *joke and slap on the shoulder/disappear*
    YouTube - Radiohead How to Disappear Completely Video Kid A

    That song right there is how, I, as an ENFJ, feel when things don't go right and I become disillusioned and introspective. You can't sum it up more perfectly than that in that song. It's really one of my favorites.

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfmaiden14 View Post
    In other words, it may just be as simple as ENFJs wanting things to run smoothly, and therefore getting stressed out if he or she feels they're not. So they try to fix it, even amongst their perceived discomfort. The shadow is not judgement, but the ambiguity of P. They'd have trouble allowing a situation to run with some of the flexibility and kinks and movement and (somewhat) conflict; having looming fears since they're so aware of the consequences unpredicted outcomes could bring.
    Excellent post. I couldn't help but go, "Damn! She hit the nail on the head with that one!" Being spontaneous is scary for me but I know it's something I'm going to have to learn. Now I just need some XXXP friends! Any takers?
    "... you think deeply about stuff [that] nobody cares about and hardly anybody can understand you." ~ Peguy talking about Ni users. So true.

  4. #24
    *ears perk up* wolfmaiden14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post

    Knowing. That's what ENFJs are. They're knowing. Like INFJs but without ever taking the opportunity to rest and face what is chasing them.
    <resentment..sorry XD> Oh, so THAT'S where the double standards come from.. </end resentment>


    What makes feeling the source of judgment? I can see thinking quite easily making judgments as well, although those might be better worded as "conclusions."

    also, thanks Chris.
    Forming characters! Whose? Our own or others? Both. And in that momentous fact lies the peril and responsibility of our existence. - Elihu Burritt

    Member of the Maverick's Biker Club - Now crashing through walls instead of just..walking into them.

  5. #25
    Senior Member The Third Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolfmaiden14 View Post
    I got lost somewhere. I still don't understand the question, but I really want to know the answer!

    Uhm, as far as I CAN understand it.. perhaps the anxiety is a sort of empathy? They put themselves in the middle of the action, so to speak, because they feel some smoothness is NOT taking place, and therefore attempt to soothe such distress(which they are currently expressing) in typical ENFJ fashion.

    In other words, it may just be as simple as ENFJs wanting things to run smoothly, and therefore getting stressed out if he or she feels they're not. So they try to fix it, even amongst their perceived discomfort. The shadow is not judgement, but the ambiguity of P. They'd have trouble allowing a situation to run with some of the flexibility and kinks and movement and (somewhat) conflict; having looming fears since they're so aware of the consequences unpredicted outcomes could bring.
    LOL that happens to me almost every morning when commuting to my job. It NEVER runs smoothly and something always happens and I lose "valuable" minutes and I get pissed off. Don't talk to me when I ride to work I might bite your head off.lol i need things running "according to plan".
    ENFJ 3W4

    If you read this I am sorry to say that you just lost 5 seconds of your life that you wont be getting back.*

    *Actual time may vary.

  6. #26
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    Are you talking about the ENFJ shadow when you piss one off and all of a sudden they get this stare where you swear there trying to figure out ways to physically hurt you and you cant help but get an "oh shit, I did it now" feeling.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Third Rider View Post
    LOL that happens to me almost every morning when commuting to my job. It NEVER runs smoothly and something always happens and I lose "valuable" minutes and I get pissed off. Don't talk to me when I ride to work I might bite your head off.lol i need things running "according to plan".
    I car pool to work with an ENFJ(wife) and they will bite your head off.

  7. #27
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolfmaiden14 View Post
    What makes feeling the source of judgment?
    Fe?

    I can see thinking quite easily making judgments as well, although those might be better worded as "conclusions."
    Yeah, and I can see knee jerk Fe whitewashing bad feeling.

    What can I tell ya, people--I use Fi and ENFJs look crazy, especially when you're scrambling to recover a losing situation.

    On the other hand, I do know a venerable ENFJ. She'll be 68 sometime soon. The anxiety vibe in her is much, much more under control--like a source of energy rather than torment. She almost comes off ENTJ, what with the robust bluntness of her decisions about who to be interested in and when. And she has a sense of humour.


    (over and above her willingness to dominate).


    Edit: I dunno, y'all... I'm just guessing stuff here. Following up patterns, fitting them into consequences, making sense.

    Fe is so damn programmatic, it's hard to tell the truth from the propaganda other than by working out when I'm right to feel wrong.

  8. #28
    Senior Member chris1207's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    Are you talking about the ENFJ shadow when you piss one off and all of a sudden they get this stare where you swear there trying to figure out ways to physically hurt you and you cant help but get an "oh shit, I did it now" feeling.
    That's just us being disillusioned that you would knock us down like that and not take our feelings into consideration. It's kind of like our internal processor is lagging a bit to detach all the shit you've ever told us that we've intuitively interpolated and just declare it as nonsense. I wouldn't piss an ENFJ off like that too much or you may lose them.

    I never encounter it being an ENFJ myself but I can imagine it being scary.
    "... you think deeply about stuff [that] nobody cares about and hardly anybody can understand you." ~ Peguy talking about Ni users. So true.

  9. #29
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    There's nothing that will send me further or faster into the grip than someone telling me that I'm being dramatic and that my feelings are ridiculous, esp when I'm already scorched and can't get my balance back.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
    Neutral Good
    EII-Fi subtype, Ethical/Empath, Delta/Beta
    RLUEI, Choleric/Melancholic
    Inquistive/Limbic
    AIS Holland code
    Researcher: VDI-P
    Dramatic>Sensitive>Serious

  10. #30
    Senior Member Littlelostnf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris1207 View Post
    That's just us being disillusioned that you would knock us down like that and not take our feelings into consideration. It's kind of like our internal processor is lagging a bit to detach all the shit you've ever told us that we've intuitively interpolated and just declare it as nonsense. I wouldn't piss an ENFJ off like that too much or you may lose them.

    I never encounter it being an ENFJ myself but I can imagine it being scary.
    Hmmm I have had it happen to me..and way before I ever got pissed off I was hurt beyond anything...took a long time to get to pissed off...and just as long for that person to lose me...and after they lost me I finally got back to me. It's only the ones that are wayyyy close to me that could make me feel that way...anyone else...well they may wish they'd never messed with me or my feelings. :steam:
    for my life is slowed up by thought and the need to understand what I am living.

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