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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apollanaut View Post
    For those of us who haven't succumbed in that way, it is still incredibly frustrating to be gifted with vision and insight and yet to have those abilities constantly discounted, dismissed or sidelined throughout our lives. The pursuits, careers and goals we are "supposed" to aspire to in the West just do not cut it for us. Sadly, I suspect it will be long after I am gone before the pendulum swings the other way and Ni can once again take its appropriate place in an enlightened society.
    Well, hey, it's not professionally very good thing to be a Fi-Ne male either. I have been seriously considering to go to school again and become a psychotherapist, I'm sick and tired not getting any respect for anything that I do well... and of course not getting money either because I am not man enough for the man-jobs and not woman enough for the woman-jobs.

    (sorry, I think you hit my rant-nerve )

  2. #32
    Senior Member mlittrell's Avatar
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    i think the INFP and the INFJ both will, in the end, read the same exact things about people. they just take different cognitive routes to get there.
    "Honest differences are often a healthy sign of progress. "

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  3. #33
    Badoom~ Skyward's Avatar
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    i think the INFP and the INFJ both will, in the end, read the same exact things about people. they just take different cognitive routes to get there.
    I thought the same thing reading through the thread. The description of INFP having a fine-tuned 6th sense for people and INFJ having more structured ideas: "This person could be x or y with z going on..." feels very 'right' in my head. Since Ive read in other places than INFPs enjoy/thrive on 'F Vibes' that they're basically connoisseurs (Kinda like a food blogger for emotions)

    I don't think I've ever had any amazing premonitions (Besides vaguely dreaming about getting a Gamecube years ago and for Christmas we got one), but I always get vibes, I almost run totally off them (Fe adds a bit of etiquette, and Ti figures out how to say it).

    There's a kind of slight pressure in the front of my head when I think I'm 'pushing' intuition (OR Ti since the front of the brain is the logic center, who knows?).

    Have any other INFJs somehow 'know' what to do or come up with a weird, yet effective, way of doing a little thing without really thinking about it? I can't improvise when things are moving too fast for me to watch (Se clicks in then), though.
    'Imperfection is beauty, madness is genius and its better to be absolutely ridiculous than absolutely boring.' - Marilyn Monroe

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    Anthropology Major out of Hamline University. St. Paul, Minnesota.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyward View Post
    Since Ive read in other places than INFPs enjoy/thrive on 'F Vibes' that they're basically connoisseurs (Kinda like a food blogger for emotions)
    Maybe... I'm not sure. I do it all the time and it is an effort not to, so I don't know if it really is a choice. Maybe if I could try living somewhere that has only emotionless people, maybe then I could compare. I know I slowly depress if I don't see people for a long period of time, but this doesn't prove that it is for the absence of vibes.

    Oh, actually, I remember a situation that is quite closely related to your example. When I was living in a bigger city in which I had to move by train, I loved to observe people, kinda like tasting their emotions while they were on their way to work or something...

  5. #35
    Senior Mugwump Apollanaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Well, hey, it's not professionally very good thing to be a Fi-Ne male either. I have been seriously considering to go to school again and become a psychotherapist, I'm sick and tired not getting any respect for anything that I do well... and of course not getting money either because I am not man enough for the man-jobs and not woman enough for the woman-jobs.

    (sorry, I think you hit my rant-nerve )
    That's OK, I certainly didn't mean to imply that INFPs have an easier life - Fi is also seriously repressed in Western society. I've witnessed the difficulties faced by INFP males firsthand, as it is my father's type. He was born in the UK just before WWII and his family lost pretty much everything when their house was destroyed by a bomb. The next few years were totally unsettled for him, which led to many problems in later life (gambling, alcoholism) for such a sensitive soul. He found the strength to overcome all that and has just made the long journey to New Zealand with Mum to stay with us for a few weeks. Dad is something of a role-model for me - I consider myself very lucky to have had such an understanding parent who recognised and encouraged my INF traits - a rare thing from what I've heard!
    INFJ 9w1 sx/sp/so

    "A wizard is never late. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to." - Gandalf The Grey

    And if I only could,
    I'd make a deal with God,
    And I'd get him to swap our places,
    Be running up that road,
    Be running up that hill,
    With no problems.

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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apollanaut View Post
    That's OK, I certainly didn't mean to imply that INFPs have an easier life
    I didn't actually mean it like I would have thought you meant it that way... I just meant that I relate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apollanaut View Post
    Fi is also seriously repressed in Western society. I've witnessed the difficulties faced by INFP males firsthand, as it is my father's type. He was born in the UK just before WWII and his family lost pretty much everything when their house was destroyed by a bomb. The next few years were totally unsettled for him, which led to many problems in later life (gambling, alcoholism) for such a sensitive soul. He found the strength to overcome all that and has just made the long journey to New Zealand with Mum to stay with us for a few weeks. Dad is something of a role-model for me - I consider myself very lucky to have had such an understanding parent who recognised and encouraged my INF traits - a rare thing from what I've heard!
    Interestingly this is quite close to me and my mom. She is perceived as a failure by some (because of mental problems) but I think she just ... yeah, the same way you put it, overcome the issues and made them her current strength.

    to us lucky ones...

  7. #37
    Senior Member paisley1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apollanaut View Post
    That's OK, I certainly didn't mean to imply that INFPs have an easier life - Fi is also seriously repressed in Western society. I've witnessed the difficulties faced by INFP males firsthand, as it is my father's type. He was born in the UK just before WWII and his family lost pretty much everything when their house was destroyed by a bomb. The next few years were totally unsettled for him, which led to many problems in later life (gambling, alcoholism) for such a sensitive soul. He found the strength to overcome all that and has just made the long journey to New Zealand with Mum to stay with us for a few weeks. Dad is something of a role-model for me - I consider myself very lucky to have had such an understanding parent who recognised and encouraged my INF traits - a rare thing from what I've heard!
    Yes, very rare, luckily for me, my older sister and I are 2 years apart and both INFJ's, which has made it easier for me and my father to relate as he's had to get used to her before me, although my father's 90% sensing and I'm 95% intuition. It's funny because he falls into every ISTP stereotype there is, from occupation to how he says things. We don't see eye to eye on much, but he's had to grow used to the deep intellectual conversation of an INTP wife, and 3 INFJ children. However, I don't think he's ever gone so far as to "encourage" my INF traits, as he's never really understood us. ISTP's and INFJ's are supplement's to each other, as though we fill in each others existential gaps, when needed, ie, "Take this, to get back on track and help you live right." However, I think you have something unique, in that your father, an INFP, is the INFJ's complement, and fully completes the characteristics of an INFJ. Together you can answer questions with a rare finality, from foundational theses to panoramic summation. Therefore, the bond with your father must be very tight forming a very close knit relation, I'd go so far as to say you phone him up regularly just to clear your head? Am I right? Whereas, the only quality time I'd get with my father, is working on a vehicle or laughing at something getting blown up in a movie. LOL!

  8. #38
    Senior Mugwump Apollanaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skyward View Post
    There's a kind of slight pressure in the front of my head when I think I'm 'pushing' intuition (OR Ti since the front of the brain is the logic center, who knows?).

    Have any other INFJs somehow 'know' what to do or come up with a weird, yet effective, way of doing a little thing without really thinking about it? I can't improvise when things are moving too fast for me to watch (Se clicks in then), though.
    I get the same feeling when I'm pushing my own intuition, though Ni and Ti are supposed to be mainly situated in the rear of the brain (left for Ni, right for Ti). Maybe what we're doing is actually using Ne, a front (right) brain function. This is naturally harder for us to use, so may require more effort. Alternately, we could be trying to direct it via Fe, another front (left) brain function. Or maybe both!

    Hmmm, once more I've got that subtle Ni tingle that tells me I'm on the right track.

    As for your second point, yeah I do this all the time. I have countless little shortcuts I've devised to help me do things more efficiently, both at work and at home. The idea is to put all of the mundane, boring s**t I have to do onto autopilot, freeing up my mind to ponder the sort of abstract ramblings I prefer. I get very annoyed at work when the petty bureaucrats decide to change our procedures yet again (it happens a lot!). It can take me quite a while to re-jig my shortcuts and put the damn thing back on autopilot again where it belongs
    INFJ 9w1 sx/sp/so

    "A wizard is never late. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to." - Gandalf The Grey

    And if I only could,
    I'd make a deal with God,
    And I'd get him to swap our places,
    Be running up that road,
    Be running up that hill,
    With no problems.

    - Kate Bush

  9. #39
    Senior Mugwump Apollanaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paisley1 View Post
    However, I think you have something unique, in that your father, an INFP, is the INFJ's complement, and fully completes the characteristics of an INFJ. Together you can answer questions with a rare finality, from foundational theses to panoramic summation. Therefore, the bond with your father must be very tight forming a very close knit relation, I'd go so far as to say you phone him up regularly just to clear your head? Am I right? Whereas, the only quality time I'd get with my father, is working on a vehicle or laughing at something getting blown up in a movie. LOL!
    What is going on with this thread?!!? Maybe the concentrated powers of all us INFJs and INFPs has invoked The Force or The Matrix or something.

    I was just in the middle of replying to your post, when my father phoned me from home to discuss an old "Star-Trek" novel he had just purchased from a charity bookshop! So, yes, I'd have to admit that you are spot on in your description of our relationship.
    INFJ 9w1 sx/sp/so

    "A wizard is never late. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to." - Gandalf The Grey

    And if I only could,
    I'd make a deal with God,
    And I'd get him to swap our places,
    Be running up that road,
    Be running up that hill,
    With no problems.

    - Kate Bush

  10. #40
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    Hmm... I think it is anything but black and white for me. When I get a feeling from a person through intuition, I usually start thinking about why would they feel that way and how probable it is. Before I know it I am adapting to the feeling somehow. I very rarely actually do something in the normal sense "doing things", it is more like a slight change of attitude. In more dramatic cases I might prepare for something that might happen, for example, I often pay attention to someone who seems like he might get violent.
    I'd imagine that it strikes people differently. For me, I make it a black-or-white situation; i.e. is their aura good or bad, trustworthy or nontrustworthy, active or nonactive, etc. However, how I think and act seems to change depending on who I'm with, like a chameleon.

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