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[MBTI General] Hurting feelings of other people

Joined
Jul 3, 2008
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1,858
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so/sp
This thread has many topics in itself so there is no something that is central argument. But this surely isone of the key parts. I am listening if you have something to say.




I am not 100% sure at what you are shooting at here.

It'd be easier to see what you're getting at if you'd identify what simple life pleasures are.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
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Jun 6, 2008
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It'd be easier to see what you're getting at if you'd identify what simple life pleasures are.

Enjoying food and drink , watching TV , paying attention to sport events, shoping, having a pet, going to partys, and things like this.
Even sexuality could come in this category to some degree.
 

Virtual ghost

Complex paradigm
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I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.

It happened to me in many situations that NF attacks my post or OP and then he/she says that she/he feels sorry for any discomfort they made and that they are sorry if they come as hostile.

The thing is that I would never posted that if I am not expecting debate of some kind. The whole point for my perspectives is that you should attack me.
 

Ultimate Feeler

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Sep 14, 2008
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I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.
I agree. As I get older, I find myself not caring if I hurt someone's feelings. I have been
hurt one too many times. Maybe I am just bitter.
 

redacted

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I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.

It happened to me in many situations that NF attacks my post or OP and then he/she says that she/he feels sorry for any discomfort they made and that they are sorry if they come as hostile.

The thing is that I would never posted that if I am not expecting debate of some kind. The whole point for my perspectives is that you should attack me.

Because hurting someone means you have less power over them.

Apologizing (and coming off as sincere) is a great strategy for almost all people, in terms of gaining power back.

Hurting other people's feelings means they're probably mad at you, and will probably build resentment towards you if it isn't resolved. So some NFs try to resolve the problem before it turns into resentment.

It's strategic.
 

placebo

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Hurting other people's feelings means you suck at being diplomatic and probably have low EQ. There's little sense in hurting other people's feelings unless you hate them/are angry at them and really actually want to hurt them or maybe if you're some weird power hungry psychopath. It's usually disadvantageous towards them (injuring part of who they are) and towards you (they will be less willing to do anything with you, or may be proactively negative towards you, just giving you trouble).
 

cascadeco

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Why do you so much care not to hurt someone, that you will even put some bigger things in a risky situation?

Do you do it because you know how would you feel in their situation and base desicion on that?

I think as in most things in life there's a balance. Making sure your own needs are met, fulfilling your personal longterm goals, following the path you wish to take, and staying true to yourself. Balanced against being respectful of others, who are all striving for the same thing for themselves, and sometimes swallowing your pride and letting go of the less-important things for yourself so as to make it easier or more painless for others. A balance of selfishness and selflessness.

Yes, diplomacy. It's totally possible to treat others with respect and honesty, without being completely abrupt or callous. Treat them as a fellow human being who has most of the same questions/struggles/dissatisfactions/desires out of life as you do.

It's impossible not to hurt peoples' feelings every now and then, especially if you stay true to yourself -- but it's highly possible to deliver the message in a considerate way.

Why would you find nonemotional reaction in highly emotion situations disturbing? From what I have seen Fs have this tendency and exactly in this kind of situations you can see how much T I am.

I don't know that I do find a nonemotional reaction disturbing. In fact, I'm typically the one who stays calm and cool under tense situations, and I've been called a cold robot by an NT before. :laugh: A curious case of role reversal which makes me laugh at some of the generalizations on this board....just that she was far more externally emotional and out of control than I ever was.
 

Virtual ghost

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Because hurting someone means you have less power over them.

Apologizing (and coming off as sincere) is a great strategy for almost all people, in terms of gaining power back.

Hurting other people's feelings means they're probably mad at you, and will probably build resentment towards you if it isn't resolved. So some NFs try to resolve the problem before it turns into resentment.

It's strategic.

That is correct to some degree but you presume that the person will be hurt what is not true in many cases. If you do this too much NT could even be annoyed by this.
 

FantailedWall

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'Coz I care about people. How's that for an answer?

But to me it looks that there is a fear or even paranoia that you will hurt someone. I know that when I talk to someone, they can say things like "But that could hurt his/her feelings!" about the third party.

When the paranoia manifests for me, it's generally one of two things:
a) Being around an overly sensitive someone - whilst highly annoying, if I'm fond of them or have for whatever reason been forced to interact with them, I'd prefer for the interaction to be peaceful.
b) The 'I want everyone to like me' paranoia. (See JD from Scrubs, see an ENFP's need to be liked) There is absolutely no logic behind this one. Perhaps it's a need for affirmation that we are good people by others reaching a general consensus that we are?

So, I guess the unconscious reasoning of the 'don't want to hurt their feelings!' paranoia could be viewed as ultimately selfish.
However, in general - I just don't see the point of hurting people and why some seemingly find pleasure in this. I like people, and I like people being happy.

i'm usually pretty concerned with hurting someone's feelings and i don't like to witness others getting their feelings hurt either and really can't help but stick up for someone if i feel they were hurt or treated poorly in any way...i can't explain that. it's just instinct. i am unbelievably polite to everyone always. it doesn't matter how well or how long i've known you. it's important to me to treat people with respect and consideration and to communicate effectively...but...the opposite of that is my sense of humor...i can play mean or talk shit or whatever with my friends..and i don't worry about hurting their feelings in this context nor do i easily get my feelings hurt....and i joke a lot.

so...situations where i would be concerned about someone's feelings getting hurt would be first miscommunication...was i joking and they didn't get it and just thought i was being mean? so...i would try to clear that up and aplogize.

another one would be...if someone was talking down to someone else...that bothers me quite a lot. i think people deserve to be talked to as equals.

or..if someone was being dismissive...that feels disrespectful and i think everyone deserves better then that.

or...someone not being open and listening as much as talking...discussions should be two way.

so basically for me it just comes down to basic manners and treating people respectfully.

You are ENFP poster-child material :yes:
 

Oleander

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Sep 30, 2008
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I do it regularly for three reasons: [1] I am trying to spare their feelings and be considerate. Somehow this manages to cause more hurt than if I'd told them to ram their head up their ass until they disappear up their own Black Hole; [2] They are women I am afraid of patronising because they insist on their 'equality' - so they feel I am putting them down, because women who insist on 'equality' really mean traditional deference from men, while women who do not have no doubts about dealing with men on an equal basis; [3] I am trying to explain how much their assumptions have hurt me, but when I am saying I read this attitude you want as that horrible thing I would never do, they re-read it as You want me to do that horrible thing, you are horrible.

People - Yeeugh!
 

sculpting

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Antisocial,

I have chatted much w my entp friend about this topic. Have you heard the commercial on the radio recently where the women hides in the closet drinking a diet dr pepper and her husband finds her? Then she acts all crazy and guilty and he just says "I dont understand" and shuts the door.

she says feelers are like that. totally bizarre and lacking in T style logic mostly.

I think you are seeing biology at play. Evolution found empathy to be a handy tool for the survival of many more advanced animal species. I scratch your back and you scratch mine. The social bonding that glues groups of animals together relies of mixes of all the fun love hormones-dopamine/vasopressin/oxytocin. One animal is sick or needs a bit of help, the others will help-TO A CERTAIN EXTENT. If the animal fails to thrive after some time, they will abondon it and the animal will let itself be abondoned.

empathy yields social assistance which either results in recovery, in which case the animal may later help the first animal, or failure to recover which results in depression , abondanment and death.

Most important- For a feeler empathy is a feeling of unhappiness or even true discomfort at seeing others in pain. Nobody likes to be in discomfort so they act to remedy that internal discomfort by helping the other who was suffering.

For an SF, the above scenario makes sense. They will help those in thier immediate social group and the Feely give or take of help enhances the social bonding of the group. The SF lacks the big world picture, thus can ignore the suffering outside the group or easily abandon those who do not fit well within the group.

For an NF (at least me), something is off kilter. I cannot ignore the big picture. I recognize the suffering of the larger group and thus at times have felt considerable discomfort/aka empathy, that I cannot do more to relieve the suffering of the whole. It is actually sorrow and pain. I have at times carried around a lot of guilt for no real reason, just that I feel like I did not "help" enough. I have had to learn to mentally forgive myself for those feelings even though I never did anything wrong in the first place. Likely volenteer work is the best mental therapy you can have any NF do. It makes me mildly euphoric. (coo-coo) Also I have noticed that a lot of NFPs end up as subs in S&M relationships-potentially as a way to seek that "forgiveness" in a controlled safe fashion.
 

CzeCze

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Why do you so much care not to hurt someone, that you will even put some bigger things in a risky situation?

Do you have examples of where your 'T' shows and you don't understand the 'F' behavior? :) Sometimes consideration and following social protocol is mistaken for 'kindness'. I'm guessing you were referring to more personal dynamics than mere politeness?

My answer: I've always been a super empathetic, super compassionate child and since ENFPs are essentially 5 years old forever (ha. ha. ha) I am still this way. I can imagine myself in other people's shoes pretty naturally.

Essentially, when other people hurt, I hurt. It took many painful years to toughen up and prioritize myself and my emotional boundaries and health over other people. And realize that not everyone is nearly as concerned with other people's feelings or my feelings, and that's okay!

I try to be discerning and wise in the way I direct and refine my kindness or compassion. I try to be appropriate for the situation.

For instance: the truth is painful. I'll still tell it to people, I will just make sure it is easier for them to accept. People have to be in a place of safety for them to accept painful things from you.

Sometimes people getting their feelings hurt is inevitable -- you can not and should not prevent it, but you can deliver the message as compassionately as possible.

So depending on what you mean by 'bigger things' -- I try not to risk 'bigger things'...I think. I try to consider the whole picture, the dynamics involved, and 'the point' of the conversation or interaction. And I definitely consider myself and what I want and need.
 

Siegfried

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Aug 21, 2008
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I try not to hurt other's people's feelings, unless it is something that is objective and something which they can learn from.

There are a few factors, I've noticed in people, I try to avoid before considering hurting other's feelings, due to fairness.


1) Justifying current position, people do this as an immature ego defense mechanism. They will look at all angles not necessarily consciously until they can find a flaw in other's actions, to make themselves feel better.

2) Criticising others can be a reflection of the self at times. It is healthy when you are productively self critical, but you might be criticising others excessively due to self loathing.

3) To improve social standing, often people will see characteristics that are just different or normal, but due wanting to be externally accepted and status, they point out flaws, to earn respect.

4) There is a likelihood of projection.

5) Often used to show superiority over the person, or power over them, due to insecurity.

6) Not enough thoroughness in critiquing, can result in incorrect assumptions of flaws, due to lack of data collection.

So in a nutshell, I try to do constructive critcism or very precise critique, to my capacity, if I have to hurt other's feelings. Even if these reasons are presentable and I'm on the other side, it is efficient to see the validity in the comments, taking the proportionate validity in relation to these factors, with a disposition towards learning/personal growth.
 
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