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  1. #41
    jump sleuthiness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    This thread has many topics in itself so there is no something that is central argument. But this surely isone of the key parts. I am listening if you have something to say.




    I am not 100% sure at what you are shooting at here.
    It'd be easier to see what you're getting at if you'd identify what simple life pleasures are.

  2. #42
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by candylandjoe View Post
    It'd be easier to see what you're getting at if you'd identify what simple life pleasures are.
    Enjoying food and drink , watching TV , paying attention to sport events, shoping, having a pet, going to partys, and things like this.
    Even sexuality could come in this category to some degree.

  3. #43
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.

    It happened to me in many situations that NF attacks my post or OP and then he/she says that she/he feels sorry for any discomfort they made and that they are sorry if they come as hostile.

    The thing is that I would never posted that if I am not expecting debate of some kind. The whole point for my perspectives is that you should attack me.

  4. #44
    Junior Member Ultimate Feeler's Avatar
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    I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.
    I agree. As I get older, I find myself not caring if I hurt someone's feelings. I have been
    hurt one too many times. Maybe I am just bitter.

  5. #45
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I still don't understand why you guys are so careful not to hurt someone.

    It happened to me in many situations that NF attacks my post or OP and then he/she says that she/he feels sorry for any discomfort they made and that they are sorry if they come as hostile.

    The thing is that I would never posted that if I am not expecting debate of some kind. The whole point for my perspectives is that you should attack me.
    Because hurting someone means you have less power over them.

    Apologizing (and coming off as sincere) is a great strategy for almost all people, in terms of gaining power back.

    Hurting other people's feelings means they're probably mad at you, and will probably build resentment towards you if it isn't resolved. So some NFs try to resolve the problem before it turns into resentment.

    It's strategic.

  6. #46
    Senior Member placebo's Avatar
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    Hurting other people's feelings means you suck at being diplomatic and probably have low EQ. There's little sense in hurting other people's feelings unless you hate them/are angry at them and really actually want to hurt them or maybe if you're some weird power hungry psychopath. It's usually disadvantageous towards them (injuring part of who they are) and towards you (they will be less willing to do anything with you, or may be proactively negative towards you, just giving you trouble).

  7. #47
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Why do you so much care not to hurt someone, that you will even put some bigger things in a risky situation?

    Do you do it because you know how would you feel in their situation and base desicion on that?
    I think as in most things in life there's a balance. Making sure your own needs are met, fulfilling your personal longterm goals, following the path you wish to take, and staying true to yourself. Balanced against being respectful of others, who are all striving for the same thing for themselves, and sometimes swallowing your pride and letting go of the less-important things for yourself so as to make it easier or more painless for others. A balance of selfishness and selflessness.

    Yes, diplomacy. It's totally possible to treat others with respect and honesty, without being completely abrupt or callous. Treat them as a fellow human being who has most of the same questions/struggles/dissatisfactions/desires out of life as you do.

    It's impossible not to hurt peoples' feelings every now and then, especially if you stay true to yourself -- but it's highly possible to deliver the message in a considerate way.

    Why would you find nonemotional reaction in highly emotion situations disturbing? From what I have seen Fs have this tendency and exactly in this kind of situations you can see how much T I am.
    I don't know that I do find a nonemotional reaction disturbing. In fact, I'm typically the one who stays calm and cool under tense situations, and I've been called a cold robot by an NT before. A curious case of role reversal which makes me laugh at some of the generalizations on this board....just that she was far more externally emotional and out of control than I ever was.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  8. #48
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Because hurting someone means you have less power over them.

    Apologizing (and coming off as sincere) is a great strategy for almost all people, in terms of gaining power back.

    Hurting other people's feelings means they're probably mad at you, and will probably build resentment towards you if it isn't resolved. So some NFs try to resolve the problem before it turns into resentment.

    It's strategic.
    That is correct to some degree but you presume that the person will be hurt what is not true in many cases. If you do this too much NT could even be annoyed by this.

  9. #49
    Senior Member FantailedWall's Avatar
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    'Coz I care about people. How's that for an answer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    But to me it looks that there is a fear or even paranoia that you will hurt someone. I know that when I talk to someone, they can say things like "But that could hurt his/her feelings!" about the third party.
    When the paranoia manifests for me, it's generally one of two things:
    a) Being around an overly sensitive someone - whilst highly annoying, if I'm fond of them or have for whatever reason been forced to interact with them, I'd prefer for the interaction to be peaceful.
    b) The 'I want everyone to like me' paranoia. (See JD from Scrubs, see an ENFP's need to be liked) There is absolutely no logic behind this one. Perhaps it's a need for affirmation that we are good people by others reaching a general consensus that we are?

    So, I guess the unconscious reasoning of the 'don't want to hurt their feelings!' paranoia could be viewed as ultimately selfish.
    However, in general - I just don't see the point of hurting people and why some seemingly find pleasure in this. I like people, and I like people being happy.

    Quote Originally Posted by erinavery View Post
    i'm usually pretty concerned with hurting someone's feelings and i don't like to witness others getting their feelings hurt either and really can't help but stick up for someone if i feel they were hurt or treated poorly in any way...i can't explain that. it's just instinct. i am unbelievably polite to everyone always. it doesn't matter how well or how long i've known you. it's important to me to treat people with respect and consideration and to communicate effectively...but...the opposite of that is my sense of humor...i can play mean or talk shit or whatever with my friends..and i don't worry about hurting their feelings in this context nor do i easily get my feelings hurt....and i joke a lot.

    so...situations where i would be concerned about someone's feelings getting hurt would be first miscommunication...was i joking and they didn't get it and just thought i was being mean? so...i would try to clear that up and aplogize.

    another one would be...if someone was talking down to someone else...that bothers me quite a lot. i think people deserve to be talked to as equals.

    or..if someone was being dismissive...that feels disrespectful and i think everyone deserves better then that.

    or...someone not being open and listening as much as talking...discussions should be two way.

    so basically for me it just comes down to basic manners and treating people respectfully.
    You are ENFP poster-child material

  10. #50
    Member Oleander's Avatar
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    I do it regularly for three reasons: [1] I am trying to spare their feelings and be considerate. Somehow this manages to cause more hurt than if I'd told them to ram their head up their ass until they disappear up their own Black Hole; [2] They are women I am afraid of patronising because they insist on their 'equality' - so they feel I am putting them down, because women who insist on 'equality' really mean traditional deference from men, while women who do not have no doubts about dealing with men on an equal basis; [3] I am trying to explain how much their assumptions have hurt me, but when I am saying I read this attitude you want as that horrible thing I would never do, they re-read it as You want me to do that horrible thing, you are horrible.

    People - Yeeugh!

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