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[MBTI General] who're more manipulative? entp or infj

R

Riva

Guest
ok i know that infjs have good intentions. and that they will hardly do anythin what they believe to be wrong. but to get what they want(sumthin good maybe) i have noticed that they are capable of manipulating people, in a quiet and forceful way, which never hurts any1.

But thats not the point i am after. for good intentions or bad, manipulation is manipulation and i have noticed that Infjs are quite manipulative.

what say you?

AFTER EDITING.

i believe that ENTPs are the master schemers and manipulators. they are like Satan tryin to feed you a forbidden fruit. they will go a very long way without ever getting caught by their actions, and they are very hard to predict.

BUT, they have that, "i am sneaky and manipulative" look to themselves.

like Garak in star trek DS9, or satan in passion of the christ.

BUT, infjs dont. but they are equally manipulative but in a silent manner. makin them harder to be caught and to doubt.
 
Last edited:

Synarch

Once Was
Joined
Oct 14, 2008
Messages
8,445
MBTI Type
ENTP
I believe in manipulation as long as your goals are positive and noble and your approach is open and honest. What is manipulation? It means literally: "Operation with the hands." Influence. Persuasion.

If I attempt to influence you and you do what I want, how is that a bad thing? Many people would benefit from being manipulated in this way. If I say, "I want you to do XYZ." and XYZ is something you want but fear, how can this be bad?

The issue here should be dishonesty.

To answer your question, I have noticed that INFJ's can tend toward being passive-aggressive. They try to bait you. Luckily, I very much appreciate being baited.
 
R

Riva

Guest
i agree with you. i myself is extremely manipulative, but my goals are most of time noble.(except for when it comes to girls, i am only 21 and i think i have a long way to go before i start havin a serious relationship).

so yes you are ryt.
" If I attempt to influence you and you do what I want, how is that a bad thing? Many people would benefit from being manipulated in this way. If I say, "I want you to do XYZ." and XYZ is something you want but fear, how can this be bad? "

i do that all the time myself. especially for my CLOSE friends.

but Synarch what i was tryin talk about was NOT whether manipulation is bad or not.what i was tryin to ask was that have you guys have noticed whether INFJs are manipulative or not.

thats what i was tryin to ask, and the reason i dragged the poor ENTPs was to compare their manipulation to INFJs manipulation METHOD
 

Synarch

Once Was
Joined
Oct 14, 2008
Messages
8,445
MBTI Type
ENTP
but Synarch what i was tryin talk about was NOT whether manipulation is bad or not.what i was tryin to ask was that have you guys have noticed whether INFJs are manipulative or not.

I think I answered that, goober. INFJ's can manipulate passive-aggressively.
 
R

Riva

Guest
Goober. lol. well i was expecting others to pour things in too, not just you. but thanks anyway, i learned a new word today. GOOBER. so much for being English my 3rd language.

passive-aggressive. thats the word i was lookin for.
 

SoAndSo

New member
Joined
Nov 16, 2008
Messages
187
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
1w?
I'm totally passive-aggressive sometimes...all for good, not evil ;)
 
V

violaine

Guest
(Anyone can be manipulative) but to answer the OP I guess INFJ could do it very well without someone knowing it.

I hate being manipulated. So I don't think I do it. I think I need to work on being ok with influencing others though... I don't even like to influence someone into having a relationship with me unless that's what they really want.
 
G

Glycerine

Guest
Well, I can be very manipulative, at times. I usually know how to get on people's good side (it's more for a calm environment then trying to get something from someone) and I am pretty good at getting out of trouble. However, I would never try to negatively manipulate or intentionally harm someone.
 

Udog

Seriously Delirious
Joined
Aug 2, 2008
Messages
5,290
MBTI Type
INfp
Enneagram
9w1
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
To answer your question, I have noticed that INFJ's can tend toward being passive-aggressive. They try to bait you. Luckily, I very much appreciate being baited.

Are you trying to say INFJs are master baiters? :shock:

Um, yes, INFJs I've known are manipulative, but for the most part I mean that in the best possible way. They may get you to do what they want, but they generally go to great lengths to ensure your happiness, because they also genuinely care about how you feel.

Even when I could tell I was part of some INFJ's scheme, I couldn't bring myself to get angry... most of the time.
 

Lauren Ashley

Revelation
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Aug 19, 2008
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3,067
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INFJ
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4
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sx/sp
^Yeah, it's only for your own good!
 

SoAndSo

New member
Joined
Nov 16, 2008
Messages
187
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INFJ
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1w?
Usually the manipulation will ensure that everyone involved is happy.

..and yes, I'd say we are master baiters :D
 

iwakar

crush the fences
Joined
May 2, 2007
Messages
4,877
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Is it just me, or are your posts saturated with disdain for whom/whatever is on your grudge list for the hour?

As for the original question: It's hardly quantifiable.
 

Anja

New member
Joined
May 2, 2008
Messages
2,967
MBTI Type
INFP
I've seen that sort of manipulation from INFJs. Another forum I'm on has an INFJ mod and I can see her coming from a mile away.

It starts with an innocent-sounding question followed by unsuspecting honest replies. Then she goes into full gear with exclamations of righteous indignation. Once she has established her moral superiority all goes smoothly again.

I spent a couple of hours at lunch with her one day on my toes to stay one jump ahead of the pattern!

And she's a delightful woman. Smart, funny, kind. Just has that annoying habit of having to jack up her moral self-esteem a couple times an hour. Hah.
 

Chris_in_Orbit

New member
Joined
Jul 7, 2008
Messages
504
MBTI Type
ESTJ
I don't see why an ENTP (generally) would be manipulative. Would they even care about anything enough to manipulate someone? Maybe if it was manipulating someone to stay out of their way I guess...
 

Kestrel

New member
Joined
Nov 14, 2008
Messages
138
MBTI Type
INFJ
Enneagram
2w1
So wait, is this thread trying to state that INFJ's are more manipulative than other types, or just manipulative, period?

Well, since all types have their ways of getting what they want, I think it's safe to say that they are all manipulative.

But I don't see any evidence that INFJ's are more manipulative than other types. I'm usually upfront and honest with people if I want something from them. I'm not "actively" manipulative, I would rather put my energy into other things.
 

Udog

Seriously Delirious
Joined
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INfp
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I must admit that ENTP vs INFJ is a strange comparison. My ENTP co-worker can be manipulative, but it always has a 'I'm curious if I can get away with this' quality, and if it doesn't work, he just moves on to the next thing.

Also, I wouldn't say that INFJs are more manipulative than other types (some types in particular), but they often are better at it. More subtle.
 

mippus

you are right
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
906
MBTI Type
Intp
Enneagram
5w6
ENTP manipulation often seems to have a "fun" character to it, like it is a game.
The INFJ's I know manipulate without humour. The pattern Anja describes is how I perceived it...
 
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