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  1. #31
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Well yeah, because we actually liked that topic and put some thought into it. You kind of hijacked it with your experiment.
    I don't really understand at all how having some more posts in here in any way prevents you from continuing to discuss whatever you wanted to discuss. It's not as if I've somehow made a law that the only allowed direction in the thread is the one I wanted.

    The discussion of NFPs actually related directly to the OP, but I don't expect organizing-happy mods to understand or appreciate the connection, so whatever. "Organize" away, champs.

    "Highjacking" threads is a myth; that's ridiculous. The worst it does is cause an extra five seconds of scrolling or another click--there's absolutely no reason you can't continue discussing the OP in addition to whatever else is going on.

    P.S.,

    Mods, can you change the thread title to, "Millions of NFs take it as a personal attack"?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #32
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Nope, us INFJs hate the disorganization of several different discussions concurrently. I like posting in both discussions but keeping them organized. It is related to the OP, but really, what the person there wanted was a little handbook for the care and feeding of the two different types, not a discussion about NTs and NFs, even if it is quite interesting and useful.

  3. #33
    Senior Member SciVo's Avatar
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    Oh, I see, simulatedworld. You refuse to believe that Ts have emotions to be displayed? Or that Ps can use S to perceive the species-wide signs and symbols thereof? Pshaw and humbug. I shall leave you to your small, tiny little world of human people as pathetically limited abstract constructs.
    INFP ~ Fi/Ne/Ni/Te ~ 9-2-4 sp/so

  4. #34
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I saw that edit, Sim! Actually, that should be a valuable bit of understanding in the science experiment you conducted. That method of communicating your opinion to an NF=your argument is a personal attack. Good to know for next time if it matters, isn't it?

  5. #35
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Nope, us INFJs hate the disorganization of several different discussions concurrently. I like posting in both discussions but keeping them organized. It is related to the OP, but really, what the person there wanted was a little handbook for the care and feeding of the two different types, not a discussion about NTs and NFs, even if it is quite interesting and useful.
    Moreover, this discussion is pointless in so many ways. It's been done many times over and it's clear that the poster(s) involved are more interested in pointing out what's wrong with the other side than reaching any compromise or understanding.

    But of course I'm taking this "personally" since I have F in my type code.

  6. #36
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    No one says they know your feelings better than you do. But if you consistently get accused of being emotional when you are not, then your approach is clearly ineffective, and you think you'd use your oh so superior logic to see that and adjust it. Continuing to employ the same ineffective behavior suggests that you are not in as much control as you'd like to think.
    What's funny is that I never get accused of being emotional when I'm not, in real life. If anything people tend to see me as too stoic!

    This suggests to me that the text-based medium of the internet eliminates enough context that emotional tone can't really be read effectively through it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    And there are general standards in society which do define the motivation behind certain actions/words (ie. if you slam a door, then you're probably angry). If you exhibit that behavior, then you cannot expect people to not interpret it based on those standards. If the issue is poor social and communication skills, well then, that is still your error.
    Uh huh, it's just that when it comes to the internet you really don't have enough context at all to be making those sorts of assumptions about anyone's emotional states, so the only thing you can really do is just ask for an explanation of how they're feeling.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    And yes, Thinkers do annoying things like assuming they know the reasons for your beliefs, which they think to be illogical. Most of the time, they are WRONG and your reasons are completely different and perfectly sound. So in a similar way, Thinkers seem to think that they know what and how Feelers reason. I'd say having to constantly explain your reasoning is probably a lot more tiring than denying emotion behind your words/behavior. Thinkers have this "guilty until proven innocent" attitude towards people who have different views from them. They assume illogic until it's broken down for them.
    Yes, I have a very similar problem with INTPs. I can certainly see where some Thinkers do this, but it's rather hard for us to accept a position as logical until we can directly see why--do you not have this problem?

    Do you tend to go around accepting everything everyone tells you without questioning why it might or might not be true? Because that seems to be the only alternative here.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Thinkers also assume there is emotion when there may not be. If an NF takes any offense at anything, it's assumed they are being sensitive and got their wittle feelings hurt. Maybe they are just mildly irritated too, hm?
    Could be...are you suggesting that when Feelers respond negatively to this sort of situation, they actually don't intend to place their words in an emotional context most of the time?

    If that's the case I would be very interested to hear more about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Based on much of what you write, you in particular have a very poor grasp of how Fi works. The whole rant on the Orthodox Muslim INFP scenario is ridiculous and has nothing to do with Fi in itself....
    I see. Can you explain why this has nothing to do with Fi, and furthermore why it's ridiculous?

    Also, regardless of which function(s) it represents--are you justified in refusing to accommodate the man's feelings here? Why or why not?


    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    Moreover, this discussion is pointless in so many ways. It's been done many times over and it's clear that the poster(s) involved are more interested in pointing out what's wrong with the other side than reaching any compromise or understanding.

    But of course I'm taking this "personally" since I have F in my type code.
    That's kind of a sad misinterpretation of what's going on here. You are aware of how the Ne learning process works, right?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  7. #37
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Even if it has been done a lot here, LA, some of us haven't been here for as long as the rest of you. I have learned a lot during my few months here in how differently people communicate. While I usually get annoyed when two people have little fighting matches amongst a thread and they go on for pages, I don't think that's completely what's happening here. I would like to see why an NT doesn't think that what they are doing would provoke the reaction it quite universally does. I also notice that Sim has actually posted some questions that indicate he might be interested in better understanding, even if it is not framed in the kind of language most NFs would prefer for him to use.

  8. #38
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    The thing is though LA that even if it has been done a lot here - some of us haven't been here for as long. I have learned a lot during my few months here in how differently people communicate. While I usually get annoyed when two people have little fighting matches amongst a thread and they go on for pages, I don't think that's completely what's happening here. I would like to see why an NT doesn't think that what they are doing would provoke the reaction it quite universally does. I also notice that Sim has actually posted some questions that indicate he might be interested in better understanding, even if it is not framed in the kind of language most NFs would prefer for him to use.
    Nah, that just means I'm super upset and secretly hope NFs will all go fall off a cliff.

    That's what the crystal ball is saying today, anyway.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  9. #39
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Aw c'mon SW, humour me please and don't provoke unnecessarily. I am interested in this discussion!

  10. #40
    Revelation Lauren Ashley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    While I usually get annoyed when two people have little fighting matches amongst a thread and they go on for pages, I don't think that's completely what's happening here.
    Yes, it is. If you want to see how this debate usually goes, look through Sim's older posts. But anyway, I understand you like giving people the benefit of the miniscule, nearly invisible doubt, so carry on if you wish.

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