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  1. #121
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I don't believe the OP to be anti-women per se, he just seems angry and out to hurt others - male or female- in an effort to share the misery, as such

    It is unfortunate that instead of seeking help to deal with that anger, he seeks to harm others with his attitude. It is one thing to vent, it is another to purposefully seek out a 'wet dog' to kick. :
    Do you think he's contributing to a hostile environment?

    Quote Originally Posted by Saudade View Post
    Nothing misogynistic about that.
    Hopefully by the time you graduate from high school you'll have improved your understanding of the world. For my part, I refuse to just ignore it anymore.

  2. #122
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Do you think he's contributing to a hostile environment?
    I do, but if tbh, if we are going to use my definition of hostile environment, you, and several others would be also be on that list. That is my personal preference and my personal interpretation and shouldn't be a yardstick. I'll admit that there is a difference between his attitude and some of the others - like yourself - to me, in that sometimes, despite the increase of hostility, it does appear to be at least somewhat constructive both for the poster themselves and others in that they work through things and grow in their understanding. And I have yet to see that kind of contribution from him. But that, again, is a highly subjective view and I could very well be wrong - perhaps he needs to deal with his anger in this way in order to learn in life

    And I'd also wonder what would happen people who are filled with anger didn't find an outlet in communities such as ours, felt therefore unheard and became isolated that way with no input from others whatsoever in return. Anger is a powerful emotion, capable of a lot of harm, especially when left fretting somewhere locked away. At best, they might take it out on themselves. At worst, they'll take it out on the world, in a much more concentrated form than they would if they could systematically 'vent'.

    I think I'll end my too honest for my own good-mode here
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  3. #123
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    1. It's my aim to make it as hostile for misogynists and racists as is in my power. No apologies for that.
    2. My posts get deleted. Meanwhile, his are still here.

  4. #124
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    1. It's my aim to make it as hostile for misogynists and racists as is in my power. No apologies for that.
    2. My posts get deleted. Meanwhile, his are still here.
    I am all pro encouraging them to re-examine their povs, though I'm not sure hostility is the way to go about it. It could work on certain individuals, I'm sure.

    And I'd wager 2. is due to teh fact that he hasnt been here that long yet, and still has some benefit of the doubt to use up which you probably had as well when you first joined, for a long time. So, in that respect, I'd say it's only fair.

    Is it annoying? Sure. Even harmful and unfair for those targeted at times, imho, but I doubt there is a perfect solution for this. There rarely is, in life.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  5. #125
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    no matter if it's justified or not hostility is hostility and ultimately alienates the person from others. It doesn't matter one's rationalization for being hostile, because everyone rationalizes being hostile when they are. IMO it does more harm than good in the long run. You can think I'm an idiot all you want, which is fine. Because I'm not bitter, about being dumb.

  6. #126
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prplchknz View Post
    no matter if it's justified or not hostility is hostility and ultimately alienates the person from others. It doesn't matter one's rationalization for being hostile, because everyone rationalizes being hostile when they are.
    That was beautifully expressed, prp.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  7. #127
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    1. It's my aim to make it as hostile for misogynists and racists as is in my power. No apologies for that.
    2. My posts get deleted. Meanwhile, his are still here.
    Yes, we get that you're all "fight fire with fire" ... the problem is, in that doing so, you single-handedly manage to up the hostility factor on this forum by a factor of 10.

    You battle your interpretation of misogyny, but in hypocritical fashion, your tactics manage to perpetrate the same type of injustice against almost as many categories in the term "discrimination" as I can think of here. You make ageist comments (against both young and old), you mock persons of disability (just today you compared Coriolis to an autist for example), you make sexist comments, you're derogatory towards women who embrace elements of traditional roles ... I could just go on and on ond on.

    "Pot - kettle - black" applies to so many of your posts lately, I have lost interest in sorting the screed from the message. It all just comes across as screed. It does not serve your purpose here.

    If you want rules enacted on the forum regarding hateful language, it will have to apply to your words just as much as anyone else's words here too.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  8. #128
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I am all pro encouraging them to re-examine their povs, though I'm not sure hostility is the way to go about it. It could work on certain individuals, I'm sure.
    Being hostile towards something simply means opposing it. You don't seem to be prepared to oppose anything. Somehow you think this makes you a better person? Are there no issues on which you're prepared to take a stand ?

    And I'd wager 2. is due to teh fact that he hasnt been here that long yet, and still has some benefit of the doubt to use up
    You'd lose your wager. The reason, as the mods have already explained, is that such expressions do not contravene existing rules, which means they can't/won't do anything about it. I don't care about this guy. I'm just making an example of this thread. Everyone agrees it's misogyny. No one is prepared to do anything about it. Something is wrong with this picture.

    Is it really so hard for people to distinguish the difference between someone who expresses themselves in ways that make others uncomfortable and someone whose agenda is to denigrate groups of people on account of their gender/race/sexuality/etc?
    Really? You can't tell the difference?
    I guess I'm always giving people more credit than they deserve.

  9. #129
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Being hostile towards something simply means opposing it. You don't seem to be prepared to oppose anything. Somehow you think this makes you a better person? Are there no issues on which you're prepared to take a stand ?


    You'd lose your wager. The reason, as the mods have already explained, is that such expressions do not contravene existing rules, which means they can't/won't do anything about it. I don't care about this guy. I'm just making an example of this thread. Everyone agrees it's misogyny. No one is prepared to do anything about it. Something is wrong with this picture.

    Is it really so hard for people to distinguish the difference between someone who expresses themselves in ways that make others uncomfortable and someone whose agenda is to denigrate groups of people on account of their gender/race/sexuality/etc?
    Really? You can't tell the difference?
    I guess I'm always giving people more credit than they deserve.
    I am opposing hostility, you could say

    I take a stand when people harm others, for no other reason than to harm. And yes, I am willing to use a grayscale for that. My particular pet peeve is harming animals and exploiting them as they do not have a voice. Their rights are even more back in the stone age than women's, as far as I'm concerned. So yes, I do understand what it is like to have your blood boiling due to the injustice you perceive everywhere. But I also know that boiling blood isnt going to do anyone any good, and that that kind of frustration will in the end do more harm than good, both to me and the people around me.

    Its the old saying of using honey instead of vinegar, really. Awareness should most definitely be raised on these issues. But extreme hostility, even when used for a worthy cause, is always going to alienate others - and the last you want is for people to want to get away from you when you re trying to convince them of the unjustness of what you re addressing. It's...kind of counterproductive

    And again, I dont believe this thread is an example of misogyny. I believe it is an example of redirected aggression - and it seems male or female, it is all fair game

    I have no problem with someone holding a different view on an issue than mine. But I will very much take issue with someone feeling that they are somehow entitled to being hostile towards me coz they have no respect for my povs. And that you most certainly are guilty of. And that does hurt your credibility in your crusade.

    Whether you like it or not, people respond a lot better to someone who puts effort in their relationship - however brief or shallow it is - with them, and will be more motivated to listen to your plight and your mission. However worthy your cause is, prioritizing it at the expense of the good will of the people you are trying to reach will get you no where. If that is of no consequence to you, so be it. But then do not be surprised when you are unsuccessful in gathering support for your cause, since you just decided to shoot yourself in the foot.

    I agree that your hostility at least most of the time seems to serve a purpose - though it sure as hell gets used when you just do not like the person as well, it seems. I'll grant you that distinction. It does not mean it is warranted, nor that it is the best course of action. And it won't protect you from being guilty of pot-kettle syndrome, sorry.

    You do contribute to a hostile environment. And the distinction you're harping on borders on hair-splitting. So be very careful about what changes you push for on this forum, unless you plan on changing your own methods in the near future.

    The responses here alone should give you a clue. Somehow you and your approach have become the topic instead of the cause you're fighting.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  10. #130
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    That's always the case. Because most people are incapable of setting aside their personal issues with someone to impartially examine the bigger picture. The petty-minded are always itching to make things personal. It's not about me and it's disingenuous of you to jump on that band-wagon. But then being disingenuous is something I've long noted in you so it doesn't surprise me. I've also noticed that you're much happier to give men the benefit of the doubt than women, even really pretty despicable men who end up getting permabanned for their behaviour, but are flirting partners so you look the other way. It's funny that you think this makes you some kind of moral paragon, but people are full of self-delusion. Check your own prejudices Amargith, we both know you're not as innocent as you like to pretend you are.

    Eta. I've got the only response from you I wanted, so I won't continue to play your silly power games.

    It is disappointing that so many women are unprepared to cooperate with each other to achieve mutually beneficial aims, but instead sharpen their claws on one another. But it was ever thus - it just makes the struggle harder when you're surrounded by "mimsy quisling fucks", it doesn't make it less worthwhile.

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