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  1. #31
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    This thread has made me think about how dark my dark side really is, there really are people who'd not think twice about killing horribly if they invaded my home or gave me some good excuse or if there was a break down in law and order.

    This is probably a sin I should confess or something

  2. #32
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    This thread has made me think about how dark my dark side really is, there really are people who'd not think twice about killing horribly if they invaded my home or gave me some good excuse or if there was a break down in law and order.

    This is probably a sin I should confess or something
    If they are trying to come in to hurt me or mine, they are committing assisted suicide, IMO.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  3. #33
    Retired Nicki's Avatar
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    Never, I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I participated. I'd just sit inside all day.
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  4. #34
    your resident asshole
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Depends on if everyone's doing it though.

    We are coming to it with all our preconceived notions about the wrongness of the act whereas if we had grown up in a world where it was normal to participate and the was no stigma against it....

    That would make things more complicated.
    Right. And this is a big thing people in this thread don't realize. Right now we view murder as a horrible act...but what if it were normal?

    I'd also like to add that it's much different to kill alone than to kill in a group. Groupthink is a very powerful thing. Alone, you might not feel very murderous...but a group of people feed off of one another.

    I haven't seen the movie, so I don't know what percentage of people kill and what percentage stay in their homes. Being the person I am now, with few human connections outside my family, I probably would not be a part of it. However, anyone here with wide or close circles of friends might be a part of it if it were real.

    But anyway, it obviously isn't a good solution to crime no matter how you look at it.

  5. #35
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    If they are trying to come in to hurt me or mine, they are committing assisted suicide, IMO.
    ^ This.

    Keeping in mind what @DiscoBiscuit and @DisneyGeek have been saying: I wouldn't think twice about killing people, in that situation, if I were acculturated to it. I could see myself enjoying killing people, as long as I felt that it was justified. I wouldn't be surprised if I even sought out "evildoers" during the purge, or made some sort of kill list during the year.

    Then again, I've known for a long time that if my moral code were twisted around, I'd have a Dexter/Rorschach mentality...
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  6. #36
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    I think the reason why this movie, and the idea behind such a "purge", has such salience is that despite the fact that the overwhelming majority of people are happy with our level of civilization, some of us feel that we have lost something that makes us who we are in our crusade to demonize all violence.

    Surely the use of violence in the service of bad intentions is a huge issue, and it does society no favors to lionize that sort of act.

    But at the same time, I (and maybe others here) feel that we have lost some of our agency, or some of our natural rebellious nature, or worst of all some of our natural courage to stand up against what is wrong. To me it can seem almost as if in an effort to condemn all violence, we overlook the fact that occasionally it is necessary, and can be beneficial if its use is judiciously applied.

    Surely, this isn't for everyone, the world needs peacenics just as much as it needs hard men patrolling the wall. But my worry is that we have, over corrected in response to the horrors of our own not so distant past. I think school children shouldn't worry about standing up to bullies because they may be reprimanded. I don't think there should be a disincentive to protect oneself (in a situation appropriate manner) regardless of one's capability to do so.

    The important point behind this in my mind at least, is that those inclined to use violence to further their self interest usually have much less regard for the prevailing societal norms against violence. And I think a culture that tells you to hide and surrender when faced with violent attack, forces you to give up some innate dignity. It can feel like a tacit acceptance of mal-intentioned violence. Like being victimized is better for us (both individually and as a society) than standing up for ourselves, regardless of of whether standing up for ourselves is more likely to prevent future assaults. As if you don't have a right to safety regardless of the actions pursuing that safety will force you to take. Worst of all, it lulls us into an unthinking complacence about the state's ability to take care of us. This is not to say that we should encourage vigilantism, but that we should allow space in the national narrative for differing acceptable interpretations of how best to pursue personal safety.

    Like I stated, this course of action isn't for everyone, and I respect the right of those who would rather pursue justice through other means. But having a little experience with bullies, and those who would do us harm, I know that they mostly speak one language. That language is violence.

    And unless your willing to speak it, you may find yourself face down on the pavement at the whim of those who mean you harm more often than you prefer.

    If you do speak the language of violence, you frequently only have to offer a strong rebuttal once.

    There are a few ideas here I would like to unpack a little bit more, but business calls.

  7. #37
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    @DiscoBiscuit as people are breaking in. except with 2 guns, one in each hand.
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  8. #38
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I think the reason why this movie, and the idea behind such a "purge", has such salience is that despite the fact that the overwhelming majority of people are happy with our level of civilization, some of us feel that we have lost something that makes us who we are in our crusade to demonize all violence.

    Surely the use of violence in the service of bad intentions is a huge issue, and it does society no favors to lionize that sort of act.

    But at the same time, I (and maybe others here) feel that we have lost some of our agency, or some of our natural rebellious nature, or worst of all some of our natural courage to stand up against what is wrong. To me it can seem almost as if in an effort to condemn all violence, we overlook the fact that occasionally it is necessary, and can be beneficial if its use is judiciously applied.

    Surely, this isn't for everyone, the world needs peacenics just as much as it needs hard men patrolling the wall. But my worry is that we have, over corrected in response to the horrors of our own not so distant past. I think school children shouldn't worry about standing up to bullies because they may be reprimanded. I don't think there should be a disincentive to protect oneself (in a situation appropriate manner) regardless of one's capability to do so.

    The important point behind this in my mind at least, is that those inclined to use violence to further their self interest usually have much less regard for the prevailing societal norms against violence. And I think a culture that tells you to hide and surrender when faced with violent attack, forces you to give up some innate dignity. It can feel like a tacit acceptance of mal-intentioned violence. Like being victimized is better for us (both individually and as a society) than standing up for ourselves, regardless of of whether standing up for ourselves is more likely to prevent future assaults. As if you don't have a right to safety regardless of the actions pursuing that safety will force you to take. Worst of all, it lulls us into an unthinking complacence about the state's ability to take care of us. This is not to say that we should encourage vigilantism, but that we should allow space in the national narrative for differing acceptable interpretations of how best to pursue personal safety.

    Like I stated, this course of action isn't for everyone, and I respect the right of those who would rather pursue justice through other means. But having a little experience with bullies, and those who would do us harm, I know that they mostly speak one language. That language is violence.

    And unless your willing to speak it, you may find yourself face down on the pavement at the whim of those who mean you harm more often than you prefer.

    If you do speak the language of violence, you frequently only have to offer a strong rebuttal once.

    There are a few ideas here I would like to unpack a little bit more, but business calls.
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  9. #39
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    It's just a horror movie. Not emblematic of some philosophical position that anyone should entertain.

  10. #40
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    What keeps me from killing people isn't the legality of it.
    YES.

    IMO, the law is the bottom rung of morality & is more about keeping people organized than moral.

    Something being legal doesn't necessarily make it a moral option for me.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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