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  1. #11
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by COLORATURA View Post
    Without quoting you both, thank you both so much. I appreciate your input.

    I didn't want to go into too many details, but alot of what Fidelia is saying has already come to past. I guess your Ni is very accurate! Either that, or you have had some VERY good (altho that prob isn't the right word) experience with situations like this.

    Nevertheless, I am still unsure of what to do. In the past when I have neglected my feelings toward someone, and broke things off, I had a hard time moving forward. I didn't consider the ramifications of how I would feel after, and although, logically I know what I NEED to do...my heart is really fighting me.

    Anyhow, thank you both for your insight! It helps alot to get other perspectives!
    I think in the past I have underestimated the incredible ability of emotions to trump intellectual understanding every time. Proximity almost invariably will create emotional intimacy (especially if there is attraction even on one person's part). Along with those strong emotions is a natural pull towards wanting to be physically close to the person. That mixture of emotion mixed with the physical element is a pretty strong drug! The only way I have found of breaking it is to not see each other or have contact at all until those feelings subside and perspective returns! Even at that, it is easy to see the POTENTIAL that person has if only the right elements were in place all together and to dream of being with them again.

    In more than one case, I have been undeniably drawn towards someone who has many attractive qualities, but on a fundamental level shares none of the elements needed to make a long term relationship work (different religion, values, priorities, attitudes about drugs and alcohol, ages and so on). I believed at the time that having a friends talk at the beginning would then allow us to still be in one another's company. Even though I was careful in the beginning to not give mixed signals and get physically involved, spending unlimited time in one another's company, with him pursuing, made the attraction grow on my part, despite serious misgivings about the sustainability (or even desireability) of the relationship. In the second case, the proximity that we shared, our living in an isolated community without much other support system, his pursuing me, and a myriad of other factors resulted in me not wanting to not see him at all, and finally realizing at some point that we either had to start dating or else not talk to each other. I took the easier of the two options, we were together five years, but with three (I know!) of those years spent having already determined that we would only be together while we were there and not after. Had you asked me if that was a good course of action, I would have readily acknowledged that it wasn't, but by then we loved each other and I was very invested, despite seeing that it clearly could not work in the long run. Had it not been for witnessing some concerning behaviours towards me, family and friends which were rooted in insecurity, recognizing those behaviours and what they meant (from watching my siblings' and some older cousins' marriages) and determining it was doomed for failure, I would likely have married him, despite all of the foundational issues that we did not see eye to eye on.

    Insecurities and baggage from the past that have not been dealt with are often at the root of addictions. Until those issues have been sorted out, it is, as Kyuuei said, not in him to be a partner. I wish I had understood this sooner (alcohol was definitely a factor in the breakdown of our relationship -he used alcohol to cope more than I realized at the beginning - and yet by then I had invested enough and cared deeply enough about him, that I didn't want to break things off before I had to). My sister married a man who had deep emotional issues and who later turned to alcohol and drugs to cope. Soon after they broke up (last summer after a 20 year marriage in which she traded everything important to her for him), he died in an apartment fire started by accident by himself while under the influence of drugs and alcohol, which endangered many other people's lives. She was just thankful that she and the children were not casualties as well, as they faced many life threatening situations during her time with him. Only by her vigilance they did not end up dying under similar circumstances!

    Insecurity is inherently selfish (it is a disbelief that anyone else will care for the person if they don't put themselves first) and often manifests itself by curtailing any relationships or interests that you as a partner care about (thereby isolating you). It is not the persons fault that they have experienced circumstances at a formative time that have inflicted deep wounds. It is however, their responsibility (and not yours) to heal up from them and resolve those issues. Until that time, they will not be able to absorb any of the love you are showering on them.

    I feel so fortunate that my sister still has some years left of her own life and that her relationship did not claim her health, as it has many people I know. However, no one can get back the years of emotional growth that should have occurred from 20-40 (she was busy just with the business of surviving and earning them in a living while he insisted on living in an expensive city and did not work throughout the years). Neither can she get back those years of life as an extended family and the history and growth in our relationships while my parents are still living. She missed a lot of occasions (to prove her loyalty to him) that were pretty big ones in our family's life.

    Of course I realize that every situation is unique. However, I would hate to see you lose years of your life to a relationship that leaves you bereft or bankrupt in areas of life that matter a lot to you.

    I still find myself some days missing the good things about the five year guy and I think it's probably a very good thing that we are no longer in touch and live on different sides of the country. I understand that tug of war, but if there's anything I can offer in retrospect, it is that I would have done what seemed hard and heart-wrenching at the time, rather than waiting until it was even more difficult to do so.

  2. #12
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  3. #13
    Member COLORATURA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    I think in the past I have underestimated the incredible ability of emotions to trump intellectual understanding every time. Proximity almost invariably will create emotional intimacy (especially if there is attraction even on one person's part). Along with those strong emotions is a natural pull towards wanting to be physically close to the person. That mixture of emotion mixed with the physical element is a pretty strong drug! The only way I have found of breaking it is to not see each other or have contact at all until those feelings subside and perspective returns! Even at that, it is easy to see the POTENTIAL that person has if only the right elements were in place all together and to dream of being with them again.

    In more than one case, I have been undeniably drawn towards someone who has many attractive qualities, but on a fundamental level shares none of the elements needed to make a long term relationship work (different religion, values, priorities, attitudes about drugs and alcohol, ages and so on). I believed at the time that having a friends talk at the beginning would then allow us to still be in one another's company. Even though I was careful in the beginning to not give mixed signals and get physically involved, spending unlimited time in one another's company, with him pursuing, made the attraction grow on my part, despite serious misgivings about the sustainability (or even desireability) of the relationship. In the second case, the proximity that we shared, our living in an isolated community without much other support system, his pursuing me, and a myriad of other factors resulted in me not wanting to not see him at all, and finally realizing at some point that we either had to start dating or else not talk to each other. I took the easier of the two options, we were together five years, but with three (I know!) of those years spent having already determined that we would only be together while we were there and not after. Had you asked me if that was a good course of action, I would have readily acknowledged that it wasn't, but by then we loved each other and I was very invested, despite seeing that it clearly could not work in the long run. Had it not been for witnessing some concerning behaviours towards me, family and friends which were rooted in insecurity, recognizing those behaviours and what they meant (from watching my siblings' and some older cousins' marriages) and determining it was doomed for failure, I would likely have married him, despite all of the foundational issues that we did not see eye to eye on.

    Insecurities and baggage from the past that have not been dealt with are often at the root of addictions. Until those issues have been sorted out, it is, as Kyuuei said, not in him to be a partner. I wish I had understood this sooner (alcohol was definitely a factor in the breakdown of our relationship -he used alcohol to cope more than I realized at the beginning - and yet by then I had invested enough and cared deeply enough about him, that I didn't want to break things off before I had to). My sister married a man who had deep emotional issues and who later turned to alcohol and drugs to cope. Soon after they broke up (last summer after a 20 year marriage in which she traded everything important to her for him), he died in an apartment fire started by accident by himself while under the influence of drugs and alcohol, which endangered many other people's lives. She was just thankful that she and the children were not casualties as well, as they faced many life threatening situations during her time with him. Only by her vigilance they did not end up dying under similar circumstances!

    Insecurity is inherently selfish (it is a disbelief that anyone else will care for the person if they don't put themselves first) and often manifests itself by curtailing any relationships or interests that you as a partner care about (thereby isolating you). It is not the persons fault that they have experienced circumstances at a formative time that have inflicted deep wounds. It is however, their responsibility (and not yours) to heal up from them and resolve those issues. Until that time, they will not be able to absorb any of the love you are showering on them.

    I feel so fortunate that my sister still has some years left of her own life and that her relationship did not claim her health, as it has many people I know. However, no one can get back the years of emotional growth that should have occurred from 20-40 (she was busy just with the business of surviving and earning them in a living while he insisted on living in an expensive city and did not work throughout the years). Neither can she get back those years of life as an extended family and the history and growth in our relationships while my parents are still living. She missed a lot of occasions (to prove her loyalty to him) that were pretty big ones in our family's life.

    Of course I realize that every situation is unique. However, I would hate to see you lose years of your life to a relationship that leaves you bereft or bankrupt in areas of life that matter a lot to you.

    I still find myself some days missing the good things about the five year guy and I think it's probably a very good thing that we are no longer in touch and live on different sides of the country. I understand that tug of war, but if there's anything I can offer in retrospect, it is that I would have done what seemed hard and heart-wrenching at the time, rather than waiting until it was even more difficult to do so.
    I don't really know what all to say. Thank you very much for your insight, though. You have definitely opened my eyes to some situations that could arise.

    I don't know that I could ever let it get so far as to some of the situations you describe, though. I am not that tolerant!

    My boy does show signs of huge improvement, but he does get discouraged (and obviously so do I) by not being able to fix his life overnight. This is the biggest problem that we both have, and this is what triggered his heavy drug use. He lost his license at 18 after getting busted for marijuana. Marijuana is a plant, but here in SC, it is a drug. The backwards-ass town that took his license away, took it away for many years, and I know people are busted with METH and don't even get that harsh of a punishment. He lost his scholarships, his family's support, and etc. Not many since then have given him many breaks or opportunities. To make things worse, he lives in a house that is out in the middle of nowhere. He wanted to be a music teacher (his mother is a home-economics teacher), and as an ENFJ with no license stuck out in the middle of nowhere...he got very lonely, and frustrated. He felt like he there was absolutely nothing he could do to get somewhere, and he gave up. He started selling drugs, which led to harder ones...

    I feel like I can help him to an extent. I think people here really suck for judging him and holding that one mistake over his head. I will not sacrifice myself for him, but I feel like I am wrong if I just give up on him. Especially since he is trying very hard to find a job, and change his life.

    See? Yesterday my head was talking...today you get my heart...
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