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Thread: Gas Prices

  1. #21
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Electric Vehicles take too long to charge, don't have enough range or comparable performance, and the pollution emitted from the process used to make the batteries is pretty bad.
    Better batteries could be developed(if things were done as mentioned on my last post) and technology for better batteries than what are used atm already does exist, but is not being used because car industry prefers usage of oil. But yea, the batteries still need to be developed more in order to get the same results that cars using oil. But there are solutions that would make electric(or pneumatic) cars useful. For example this type of cars being used on personal vehicles used on shorter distances and alternative ways of transportation being used on longer distances.
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  2. #22
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    I'm not a huge fan of subsidizing energy development willy nilly. I think there are more pressing uses for the $ gained from ending gas subsidies (something I strongly advocate) given the fiscal predicament our country is in.

    Now, I would be willing give subsidies to alt energy co.'s that have risen to the forefront of energy development, but I'm not willing to throw billions to 100 co.'s when maaaaaybe 3 of them will come up with something useful for the market.

    There are better ways to use that $.

    To address your post, I don't think giving subsidies to battery development would be of greater benefit to the American people than spending the money on other domestic issues.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of subsidizing energy development willy nilly. I think there are more pressing uses for the $ gained from ending gas subsidies (something I strongly advocate) given the fiscal predicament our country is in.

    Now, I would be willing give subsidies to alt energy co.'s that have risen to the forefront of energy development, but I'm not willing to throw billions to 100 co.'s when maaaaaybe 3 of them will come up with something useful for the market.

    There are better ways to use that $.
    Why not use universities for developing new technology? Oh i forgot that its already being done(or dunno about usa). And while we are at it, why not do it so that the technology being developed in universities are partially funded by companies, them letting the universities to use their patents in developing the technology and the patents of end product being shared by the company and government(or actually the school, which is being owned by the government) and letting other companies to use this new patented technology also, but having to pay for usage of the patent to government, people working on the technology and to the company that helped in development? This type of system is being used in finland(not sure if it goes 100% like this, but something like that) and imo its a really good system. For example nokia does this sort of collaboration with universities.
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  4. #24
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    I think the main reason gas saving technology isn't being adopted is because there really is no need. You mean to tell me that if all the oil disappeared tomorrow humans would be forever condemned to their bikes?

    As it is right now those who control the oil (and associated) industries are all about extracting maximum dollar for as long as possible. That's kind of the point though...so I can't really blame them.

    Personally, though, just find the cheapest way to get around that works for you...and let the rest of the world do as it pleases.

  5. #25
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    I think that already happens here, but I'm no expert on Univ. R&D practices in the US.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ü View Post
    I usually spend $4.25 a gallon, but then again, I use premium grade since I have a high performance engine with a lot of miles.

    And anyone who preaches about alternative fuel sources is completely naive. Very few people are willing to pay $40k for a Chevy Volt. That damn piece of shit doesn't even go over 80. It's like a Hyundai for crying out loud.

    I guess the general trend is to blame the President.
    Hahahaha. It is $4.30+ for unleaded around here, premium is around $4.50+.

    Unless you're talking about the first version, either way, I really don't think most people need to go over 80mph let alone anywhere near 75.

    Cost efficiency dwindles significantly at 65(already) and the cost goes up going any higher.

    I could get used to being able to get at least 35 miles for $1.50. It means I don't even have to spend half of how much I usually spend a week with gas currently.

    Quote Originally Posted by xisnotx View Post
    I think the main reason gas saving technology isn't being adopted is because there really is no need. You mean to tell me that if all the oil disappeared tomorrow humans would be forever condemned to their bikes?

    As it is right now those who control the oil (and associated) industries are all about extracting maximum dollar for as long as possible. That's kind of the point though...so I can't really blame them.

    Personally, though, just find the cheapest way to get around that works for you...and let the rest of the world do as it pleases.
    As the price of gas goes up, the general trend is that most people in the U.S. would love to have alternative energy (which scares the heck out of the oil industry.)

    Either way, it is a competition, if alternative energy were adopted faster, oil prices will definitely go down because it isn't the only fuel source consumers are forced to use, and it isn't because more oil is being siphoned to the U.S.

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I see no reason why container ships (and ships generally) above a certain size shouldn't use nuclear reactors (with proper security measures). I think nuclear energy is vastly under-utilized globally, and that the problems/fears people have of it are vastly exaggerated.

    There is simply no cost effective alternative which provides similar performance to gas in land vehicles, and planes.

    Electric Vehicles take too long to charge, don't have enough range or comparable performance, and the pollution emitted from the process used to make the batteries is pretty bad.
    I'm actually ok with nuclear on the condition that they are strictly regulated. If the company can't take care of their reactors and their safety on a year to year basis, some other company (or the government) can take over.

    But that is the keyword, strict.

  7. #27
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    I paid 4.37 for mid-grade gasoline yesterday. Prices here for gasoline with ethanol are closer to 3.75 but I pay a little more for the straight gas. It cost me $8 to fill up and that should last me at least a week. Better MPG, better performance and less shit building up in mah engine.

    If you want non-ethanol gas and live in Canada or the U.S., this might help you find a station near you: http://pure-gas.org/
    also, there's plenty of sites that use member-updated prices for gas stations all over the world. The one I use is: http://www.northcarolinagasprices.co...ton/index.aspx

    I'm noticing a lot more scooters, bicycles and motorcycles on the road, even over the winter in the traditional "non-riding season". I hope more people get on two wheeled transportation(assuming it's "safe" and viable). It'd save a lot of people a lot of money.

    /pushes scooters, bikes and motorcycles
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  8. #28
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    I seized driving combustion engines and am saving for an electrical car. When the time is there and research and innovation have found the best battery, I am all-in. My hometown is pretty advanced in that field. We have rebuilt our energy supply in the last 5 years and now already have 40% of our energy from renewables. We are leading in germany with that and won dozen of prices. Our nuclear energy mix went down to 3%. problem is coal thats still at 40%. We have a lot of hybrid cars already and are getting better and better. This the first time ecologogists and economics are working together and it are quite marvellous times. I am very happy that I am part of this huge process of innovation.

    I was thinking regarding batteries that maybe we are thinking the wrong way. Maybe the problem isnt the storage of more energy in electrical form, but maybe you can store energy in other forms and then convert it. Sadly things like accumulator tanks have bad degrees of efficiency. I am not quite there yet regarding the solution but I am thinking a lot about it. Maybe you can do something with photonic energy. I dunno what but I am sure we havent discovered the full potential of that yet. If you'ld for example substitute a complete electrical circuit with a photonic circuit, you maybe could eliminate switching losses and leakage current. That way you would achieve a better degree of effectiveness with boost-converter and you'ld install lesser battery cells with lesser voltage but effectively convert any voltage to 400 V of polyphase current.

    I dunno there are a billion of ways to research in that field, it has been left unattended since the days of Tesla. The next years are going to be quite exhilarating !
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  9. #29
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Lol gasoline is cheap in usa. Imo the price should be atleast doubled, so that people would stop wasting it, and it would force people to use public transportation. Naturally the crappy public transportation in most areas in usa should be fixed too, but with gas that cheap people dont have a need for that, so companies providing it wouldnt succeed, also if its not already like that, public transportation companies shouod be owned by the city and government giving some requirements for the city about it.
    - if the price is doubled, a lot of people wouldn't be able to afford to work, bus fares would rise and so would the number of empty stomachs, etc, etc. It's not as simple as raising prices. I don't know what it's like in your country, but here people don't always live within a ten minute walk of where they work. I think this may be too much for some people to understand because there are many factors involved and not every European and urban dweller on this forum seems to comprehend the complexity of the problem. It would take so long, that it's not worth actually listing since I'm currently using electricity that requires oil for it's production, and I'm trying hard to limit my consumption. If you really want to know, then make a list of every reason you can come up with for why people don't live close to where they work. And I'll give you a starting point: housing, food, fuel, clothing, water, (etc, etc) are more expensive in areas where the concentration of jobs and people is greater.

    - Local urban communities could pass ordinances to make some areas car-free pedestrian/bicycle zones or limit it to commercial/government vehicles. This would encourage people in urban areas to walk and bike a bit more and discourage using cars frivolously.

    I live in a townhouse community and many days I'll walk about 40 meters to a coffee shop, where I do most of my work. I see some of my neighbors who live next to me pulling out of our private drive, onto a state road, then into the coffee shop parking lot, head for the drive thu for their coffee, then immediately return to their homes. Raising gas to $8 per gallon will probably prevent some of these wasteful trips, but it will also hurt millions of people who must commute to work.

    National regulation of transportation does not make sense here, take a look at the our geographic diversity and the varied layouts and range of our cities and towns. Then look at the last 20 laws our legislative branch has passed concerning complicated issues.....It's too much for the stooges we have in congress...they would simply fuck it up or use it to further their partisan agendas or subsidize their favorite political contributors.

    - As far as the crappy transportation goes: there's no way that public transportation in the US will ever be as efficient(i.e. affordable/plausible) as in a small european province or a tiny island nation. The infrastructure here has been built to accommodate individual, motorized transport specifically because of our geography, for the profit of the automotive industry and the convenience of consumers among other factors, including legislation from the first half the last century. The cost of converting our infrastructure to one that's geared towards public transportation is too high. We can't even afford to convert to the metric system yet...

    Like the commuter culture we've developed, public transportation and it's flaws are a result of many factors, research on this topic can be enlightening for you ignorant swine. Either way, the entire world human population depends on oil and it's byproducts, for food production, medicine, shoes, tires, fuels, electricity, housing, etc. Without oil, and even with a complete conversion to nuclear power, we cannot sustain 6-7 billion people for very long. Seeing as how almost everything we use in modernity depends on oil, any major changes to transportation here in N. America will have to be preceded by advancement in technology and shifting of profits from the old, oil-driven combustion engine to something that is dramatically less dependent on oil. Nuclear power coupled with electric vehicles, thus far and with limits, is the only solution that makes any sense. Do you have any better ideas?
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEGERdeMAIN View Post
    - if the price is doubled, a lot of people wouldn't be able to afford to work, bus fares would rise and so would the number of empty stomachs, etc, etc. It's not as simple as raising prices. I don't know what it's like in your country, but here people don't always live within a ten minute walk of where they work. I think this may be too much for some people to understand because there are many factors involved and not every European and urban dweller on this forum seems to comprehend the complexity of the problem. It would take so long, that it's not worth actually listing since I'm currently using electricity that requires oil for it's production, and I'm trying hard to limit my consumption. If you really want to know, then make a list of every reason you can come up with for why people don't live close to where they work. And I'll give you a starting point: housing, food, fuel, clothing, water, (etc, etc) are more expensive in areas where the concentration of jobs and people is greater.

    - Local urban communities could pass ordinances to make some areas car-free pedestrian/bicycle zones or limit it to commercial/government vehicles. This would encourage people in urban areas to walk and bike a bit more and discourage using cars frivolously.

    I live in a townhouse community and many days I'll walk about 40 meters to a coffee shop, where I do most of my work. I see some of my neighbors who live next to me pulling out of our private drive, onto a state road, then into the coffee shop parking lot, head for the drive thu for their coffee, then immediately return to their homes. Raising gas to $8 per gallon will probably prevent some of these wasteful trips, but it will also hurt millions of people who must commute to work.

    National regulation of transportation does not make sense here, take a look at the our geographic diversity and the varied layouts and range of our cities and towns. Then look at the last 20 laws our legislative branch has passed concerning complicated issues.....It's too much for the stooges we have in congress...they would simply fuck it up or use it to further their partisan agendas or subsidize their favorite political contributors.

    - As far as the crappy transportation goes: there's no way that public transportation in the US will ever be as efficient(i.e. affordable/plausible) as in a small european province or a tiny island nation. The infrastructure here has been built to accommodate individual, motorized transport specifically because of our geography, for the profit of the automotive industry and the convenience of consumers among other factors, including legislation from the first half the last century. The cost of converting our infrastructure to one that's geared towards public transportation is too high. We can't even afford to convert to the metric system yet...

    Like the commuter culture we've developed, public transportation and it's flaws are a result of many factors, research on this topic can be enlightening for you ignorant swine. Either way, the entire world human population depends on oil and it's byproducts, for food production, medicine, shoes, tires, fuels, electricity, housing, etc. Without oil, and even with a complete conversion to nuclear power, we cannot sustain 6-7 billion people for very long. Seeing as how almost everything we use in modernity depends on oil, any major changes to transportation here in N. America will have to be preceded by advancement in technology and shifting of profits from the old, oil-driven combustion engine to something that is dramatically less dependent on oil. Nuclear power coupled with electric vehicles, thus far and with limits, is the only solution that makes any sense. Do you have any better ideas?
    Lold at bold.

    Dont live in places where you cant afford to live in.

    You should research this from bit wider point of view and stop crying about poor people living in places they cant afford to live in, you would soon notice that its not me whos the ignorant one.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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