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  1. #31
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swordpath View Post
    I just pretend that there are no other Stars Wars films aside from the originals... Pretty easy fix.
    Except you can't watch the originals anymore. Not on DVD at least.

    Every change Lucas makes imo reveals his lack of understanding for what made the movies great in the first place. It seems they were great in spite of him rather than because of him.

  2. #32
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Did I say he was perfect?

    Don't forget Indiana Jones.
    How much of that was really Lucas, though? He had much more control over the 4th Jones movie, and even Steven Spielberg couldn't really save it.

    He's a brilliant business man who took some pretty creative risks back in the day, I will give him that. If that's the talent you were referring to, then I'll agree.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Except you can't watch the originals anymore. Not on DVD at least.
    Yes you can. There was a Limited Edition DVD release in 2006. Each film came as a two-disc set, with the "special edition" that was monkeyed around with on one disc and the original theatrical version on the other disc.

  4. #34
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Udog View Post
    How much of that was really Lucas, though? He had much more control over the 4th Jones movie, and even Steven Spielberg couldn't really save it.

    He's a brilliant business man who took some pretty creative risks back in the day, I will give him that. If that's the talent you were referring to, then I'll agree.
    He wrote and directed the first Star Wars (A New Hope). The Empire Strikes Back was my least favourite of the original trilogy where he didn't write or direct it. Return of the Jedi was much better than Empire and he was involved in the writing of the screenplay. He's got way, way more talent in his little finger than Michael Bay.

    Now compared to Nolan, no comparison.

  5. #35
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    He wrote and directed the first Star Wars (A New Hope). The Empire Strikes Back was my least favourite of the original trilogy where he didn't write or direct it. Return of the Jedi was much better than Empire and he was involved in the writing of the screenplay. He's got way, way more talent in his little finger than Michael Bay.

    Now compared to Nolan, no comparison.
    I *personally* disagree with your order of preference with the Star Wars movies, but I see your point. A New Hope and even Return of the Jedi are better than anything Bay will ever create. And yeah, there's Indiana Jones as well.

    Still, if you compare current work to current work, I think the quality output is closer than you are claiming.

    This conversation reminds me of:

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BMgegut3UM"]George Lucas Strikes Back[/YOUTUBE]

  6. #36
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93JC View Post
    Yes you can. There was a Limited Edition DVD release in 2006. Each film came as a two-disc set, with the "special edition" that was monkeyed around with on one disc and the original theatrical version on the other disc.
    Ah, true. Nice. Not digitally restored, but worth torrenting for sure. Fucked if I'm giving Lucas more money.

  7. #37
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    George Lucas doesn't know what an exploding planet would look like, and it's obvious he did not consult anybody with even an inkling of such a notion. CGI all-around lacks basic physics expertise. I don't know how they did the original Alderaan explosion, but they probably used a firecracker. It's impossible to make a planet explode by blasting it with a futuristic laser weapon, or even a Star Trek phaser. The shockwaves in general look like fingerpainted smudges, and they never affect any neighboring objects. And there is never a gravity wave as any good physicist would expect. Perhaps a planet would explode if it contained a tremendous nuclear reactor deep underground. Waiting years for the big movie serial pay-off only brought some firecracker sparkles and smudges, something that nowadays many 9-year-olds with a pc a video camera and good video editing software could pull off. Even the Alderaan explosion in the original Star Wars paperback (the one with a heroic Luke holding a light-saber over his head while standing over Leia) was better than the movie's.

    CGI that includes small gravitational effects - something exploding and toppling over, or Yoda dropping down from the ceiling - looks terrible.

    Yoda himself looks (and gruntingly sounds) terrible, I wish I could just smash him and his bad English to smithereens. And Chewbacca is a disaster. Barney the Purple Dinosaur would make a more believable alien side-kick. At least Barney speaks an understandable language. Jar-Jar wasn't as bad as they said, he was just a character to take out all our frustrations on. It's no wonder Lucas keeps trying to fix things.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #38
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    My brother would crush him for such a callous remark. Star Wars is for the people!

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by mal12345 View Post
    George Lucas doesn't know what an exploding planet would look like, and it's obvious he did not consult anybody with even an inkling of such a notion. CGI all-around lacks basic physics expertise. I don't know how they did the original Alderaan explosion, but they probably used a firecracker. It's impossible to make a planet explode by blasting it with a futuristic laser weapon, or even a Star Trek phaser. The shockwaves in general look like fingerpainted smudges, and they never affect any neighboring objects. And there is never a gravity wave as any good physicist would expect. Perhaps a planet would explode if it contained a tremendous nuclear reactor deep underground. Waiting years for the big movie serial pay-off only brought some firecracker sparkles and smudges, something that nowadays many 9-year-olds with a pc a video camera and good video editing software could pull off. The Alderaan explosion in the original Star Wars paperback (the one with a heroic Luke holding a light-saber over his head while standing over Leia) was even better than the movie's.
    Wow. I don't defend Lucas for pretty much anything, but WTF? Do you know how rudimentary visual effects were in 1977? What was accomplished in this movie was amazing. And if you want to complain that a sci-fi movie with a neurotic robot, something called "the Force", a spaceship-piloting Bigfoot, and that double-bun haircut didn't hew closely enough to the laws of physics, then I wonder how you manage to enjoy anything at all. This is exhibit 1-A in the case of why George Lucas went off on those people, even if those people in particular were not worthy targets.
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  10. #40
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nijntje View Post
    Then they very politely asked why he wouldn’t make the original versions of the movies available on DVD/Blu-Ray. They stressed that they don’t mind the retroactive edits (doubtful, but they were being nice), they just wanted good digital copies of the original cuts, too. [i]Lucas’s response? An eyeroll and a huffy, “Grow up. These are my movies, not yours.”
    This is why the visual quality of the second trilogy of movies might have been wonderful, but the stories and directing really made the movies a lot less than they should have been. The guy's unable to let things go, and he's also unable to set aside his own self-obsession for the sake of the story and characters. There's a reason why computer games like SWKOTOR 1&2 are a far more true-to-universe adaptation and implementation of the Star Wars mythos than anything Lucas himself typically puts out.

    Lucas’s point—“these are my movies”—is debatable. Episode IV and the prequels? Yes, sure. He directed them. But Empire and Return of the Jedi were directed by other people. Does Lucas really have the right to alter a movie he didn’t direct? Well obviously he thinks so because he’s at it again, adding a new round of “improvements” to the original trilogy, due on Blu-Ray later this month. The most insulting change is probably adding Vader screaming “Noooo” as he kills the Emperor. Darth Vader is one of the most enduring villains in all of cinema and Lucas seems determined to turn him into a complete pussy. But the bigger insult to his legacy is easily the lack of respect Lucas has for his fans, the very people who kept Lucasfilm afloat by buying pointless Star Wars crap after an expensive divorce leveled his finances. It’s one thing to see a beloved childhood movie defaced but I’ll never forget the disappointment in those guys’ eyes as their hero belittled a lifetime’s interest in his work."
    He's unable to share his work and legacy with others. It's apparently about him. It must gall him to have realized that many consider TESB to be the "best" movie in terms of nuanced drama, while it was directed by Lawrence Kasdan and not himself. Most people move forward with their lives and work on new things; his career has been about doing prequels to Star Wars and now revising his major contribution to cinema to somehow perfect it, not realizing that he is simply adding new inconsistencies and problems to the work in question even while he corrects the things he wanted to conform to his original mental conception.

    For some reason, I'm also reminded of Night Shamalyan, who has similar issues with letting himself and his ego getting in the way of his storytelling, to detrimental effect. Both directors have talent, and their first big releases in the genre are classic, trend-setting pictures... but everything seems to have really gone downhill for each since then.

    I guess novelists, since there is no real "medium" restrictions on their work, get used to the idea sooner that once their books are published, the storytelling experience leaves their control and now the audience is a participant and not just an observer. Each reader brings something different to the text. You rarely if ever see authors rewriting popular books; I guess I could fault Lucas less if he was just adding some shine and buff to his quality of work, but when he starts messing with story and scenes, then it's kind of a violation of the director/audience contract.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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