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  1. #1
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Question Qualitative Associations with Superior to Genius Level IQ

    This thread is the lovechild of my thoughtful nature and bionic's rigid standards for choosing a mate. In the thread entitled Too ugly for a "beautiful people" dating site?, bionic asserted that she would be unwilling to take a lover with an IQ lower than 130. This got me thinking about those qualitative properties that might be associated with having a higher IQ.

    Looking first at some average adult IQs associated with real-life accomplishments:


    This graph was adapted from Figure 12 of Hauser, Robert M. 2002. "Meritocracy, cognitive ability, and the sources of occupational success." CDE Working Paper 98-07 (rev). Center for Demography and Ecology, The University of Wisconsin-Madison, Madison, Wisconsin. The figure is labelled "Wisconsin Men's Henmon-Nelson IQ Distributions for 1992-94 Occupation Groups with 30 Cases or More" and is found at http://www.ssc.wisc.edu/cde/cdewp/98-07.pdf
    .

    I notice that for the most part all occupations are well represented by individuals with IQs lower than 130. In terms of ability to understand complex materials, succeed in intellectual environments, converse with peers, etc., an individual with an IQ at around 120 should (given sufficient interest and drive) do reasonably well. Furthermore, if one were to look at those correlations with IQ which might be useful in choosing a mate (heath, propensity for criminal behavior, job performance, income, etc.), one would note that such relationships are modeled well by nonlinear (logarithmic) regression; and that although there is correlation between IQ and these variables, such a correlation approaches 0 when one deals exclusively with IQs from the upper limits of above average to genius levels.* This effectively means that increases in IQ after a certain point are not substantially correlated with those quantitative factors which might be useful in mate selection.

    This brings me to the main topic of this thread, which deals with those qualitative aspects of a person which are associated with having a higher IQ. What positive traits might a person gain by those 10, 20, 30 point increases in IQ, once said person is already well above average? Could it be that the mathematics professor with an IQ of 150 has an easier time accomplishing his work objectives than the professor with an IQ of 125? Would the very superior professor accomplish more or be able to devote more time to his spouse than his above average counterpart? Could there be less stress for Mr. Very Superior, which affords him a lifestyle which promotes kindness and warmth?

    I'm curious about how different the experiences would be when dealing with someone with a genius level IQ as opposed to a similarly inclined individual with just a superior IQ. Once a certain level of intellect is reached, what differences might we observe when looking at individuals with markedly different IQs (130 vs. 160 for instance)?

    Also, if anyone has had his/her IQ officially tested, it might be interesting if you'd share it and provide some personal anecdotes about your relationship style, life success, etc.


    *Terman's Classification
    • 164+ Genius or Near Genius
    • 148-164 Very Superior
    • 132-148 Superior
    • 113-132 Above Average
    • 84-113 Average
    • 68-84 Dullness
    • 52-68 Borderline Deficiency
    • Below 52 Definite Feeble-Mindedness
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  2. #2
    Senior Member LeftKick's Avatar
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    I'm a Master Volvo Tech, and am, in my humble opinion which I value highly,darn good at it. Volvo's are a bit more complicated than most brands. The newest ones have 3 different communication networks that link over 26 modules and a fiber optic network that runs the audio and navigation system. Imagine 26 laptops linked together bouncing down the road. Anyway,last time I had my IQ checked was 20 years ago in High School. It was 136. Graduated 14th in senior class of 360 students. From what I understand,a persons IQ does not change during their lifetime. It would be interesting to test again. I am not the fastest tech, nor do I make a lot more than most. I have seen guys replace a tranny in 4 hours (that's fast) who can't figure out how to use e-mail. I on the other hand am the person they come to when they need help with a networking problem or software issue in a car. Each of us has strengths and weaknesses. I like to troubleshoot problems,other guys like to rip motors out. Because of this though,I get the pain in the ass problems others have given up on. This causes more stress since customers are complaining because they want their cars back,and want to know what is taking so long. Also I have to stay late sometimes to button things up or figure things out.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Smile! Now!

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    Useless, but still bring a smile to your face when you push them down the stairs.

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  3. #3
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Thanks for your contribution LeftKick. In your case, when compared to your peers, your IQ perhaps provides you with a better 'well-roundedness' and places upon you the burden of solving more difficult problems. Do you find yourself to be a substantively different person than those coworkers whom you perceive as less mentally gifted?
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    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    Hmmm....It can be very isolating. If you have a substantly Higher IQ than the people around you.
    I was talking to some one the other day, where I couldn't use smaller words with out taking away meaning from what I was trying to say. Very frustrating. It makes communication difficult. I wasn't sure if the person was joking or not. I think 10-15 points either, not terribly different. A good thirty points or more, you live in different worlds.
    That said, I won't date any one where I suspect I'm the smarter of the two. It's opening a can of worms right there. Not because I'm an intellectual snob, but because there is less likely to be a sense of connection. I can't tell them about the interesting article I read about black holes and time travel, without seeing their eyes glaze over.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

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  5. #5
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    My IQ is approximately 140, although one can easily argue that the nature of the tests makes the fidelity of anything out with the target test range 85 to 115 as they are outside a standard deviation.



    Quote Originally Posted by CrystalViolet View Post
    Hmmm....It can be very isolating. If you have a substantly Higher IQ than the people around you.
    I was talking to some one the other day, where I couldn't use smaller words with out taking away meaning from what I was trying to say. Very frustrating. It makes communication difficult. I wasn't sure if the person was joking or not. I think 10-15 points either, not terribly different. A good thirty points or more, you live in different worlds.
    That said, I won't date any one where I suspect I'm the smarter of the two. It's opening a can of worms right there. Not because I'm an intellectual snob, but because there is less likely to be a sense of connection. I can't tell them about the interesting article I read about black holes and time travel, without seeing their eyes glaze over.
    Yes, no and good lord if I said that I would get stones thrown at me from all angles.

  6. #6
    Superwoman Red Herring's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    In the thread entitled Too ugly for a "beautiful people" dating site?, bionic asserted that she would be unwilling to take a lover with an IQ lower than 130. This got me thinking about those qualitative properties that might be associated with having a higher IQ.
    Okay, these are two seperate points we are discussing here. The first one is the relevance of intelligence (or, more precisely, IQ) in a relationship and the other is the influence of a few IQ points more or less on the ease and/or success with which you do your work.

    In terms of ability to understand complex materials, succeed in intellectual environments, converse with peers, etc., an individual with an IQ at around 120 should (given sufficient interest and drive) do reasonably well.
    Rumour has it Richard Feynman had an IQ of 125 according to his high school IQ test and that he refused an offer to join Mensa because they require a minimum of 130.

    I do think that, starting at a certain point, you can deal with any material. The finer differences then concern your speed at doing this and maybe how unconventional and creative you are at doing this.

    Furthermore, if one were to look at those correlations with IQ which might be useful in choosing a mate (heath, propensity for criminal behavior, job performance, income, etc.), one would note that such relationships are modeled well by nonlinear (logarithmic) regression; and that although there is correlation between IQ and these variables, such a correlation approaches 0 when one deals exclusively with IQs from the upper limits of above average to genius levels.* This effectively means that increases in IQ after a certain point are not substantially correlated with those quantitative factors which might be useful in mate selection.
    Actually, I doubt that this is the conscious background for many people's wish for an intelligent partner (though this may be a good evolutionary explanantion). I would assume that it is more about having somebody who can hold their end of a conversation and doesn't make you feel lonely.

    Intelligence, personality and sexual attraction are the three main areas that have to be covered. I am personally guilty of overestimating the first one only to later see that it is a neccessary condition but not a sufficient one.

    Could it be that the mathematics professor with an IQ of 150 has an easier time accomplishing his work objectives than the professor with an IQ of 125? Would the very superior professor accomplish more or be able to devote more time to his spouse than his above average counterpart? Could there be less stress for Mr. Very Superior, which affords him a lifestyle which promotes kindness and warmth?

    I'm curious about how different the experiences would be when dealing with someone with a genius level IQ as opposed to a similarly inclined individual with just a superior IQ. Once a certain level of intellect is reached, what differences might we observe when looking at individuals with markedly different IQs (130 vs. 160 for instance)?
    Ehmm, naturally I can't completely exclude this possibility. But my suspicion is that the stronger outlier would be more likely to lack the social skills/interest in human interaction/whatever-you-want-to-call-it to even desire to use the additional time like this. Think of Gauss jumping out of bed during his wedding night to write down an idea. There is an enormous number of anecdotes illustrating this form of social and emotional detachment. They would probably use this extra capacity to work on even more projects.

    Also, if anyone has had his/her IQ officially tested, it might be interesting if you'd share it and provide some personal anecdotes about your relationship style, life success, etc.
    *waits for this to turn into the inevitable pissing contest and/or debate on the comparability of test results*

    For what it's worth, I am a Salieri among you Mozarts. I did a test once and know for a fact that it is the math section and only the math section, that stands between me and the key to the executive lounge. I intend to practice some basic math skills, retake it and join the Olympus just to prove a point. Yes, it is pathetic. So what?
    The good life is one inspired by love and guided by knowledge. Neither love without knowledge, nor knowledge without love can produce a good life. - Bertrand Russell
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  7. #7
    Ginkgo
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    According to Terman's classification, I barely have a "superior IQ". Compared to my own vision of success, my life has proved to be less than spectacular. Despite my IQ, my isolation was due to many other factors: self-isolation, awkwardness, low self-esteem, eccentricities, over-all worldview, and environment. My nature is not and will never be confined by my IQ, nor will it be confined by my aptitude for problem-solving. Only a factor in a teaming sea of others. Those who have the will to flourish and the drive to overcome obstacles shine in a pool of lazy-geniuses and lazy fools. Not to say that genius and drive are mutually exclusive, but I admire many of those who occupy that central region of the graph.

  8. #8
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    This thread is the lovechild of my thoughtful nature and bionic's rigid standards for choosing a mate. In the thread entitled Too ugly for a "beautiful people" dating site?, bionic asserted that she would be unwilling to take a lover with an IQ lower than 130.
    I smell something funny.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    I smell something funny.
    Then you should take your head out of your ass.

    With the entirety of my love; you left yourself wide open for that.

  10. #10
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    Then you should take your head out of your ass.

    With the entirety of my love; you left yourself wide open for that.
    That was illogical and impossible.
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

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