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  1. #21
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I despise FGC as a practice and think it is a heinous thing, but how did this topic start on cosmetic surgery for girls to help them avoid bullying, and within only two posts end up on FGC? I would consider them explicitly different in the nuances and reasoning. (For example, I'm sure this mother who had her daughter's ears pinned back for me would have had a much different reaction to the thought of performing FGC... or do you think if they had lived in the culture where FGC was dominant, the mother would have done it for the same reasons?)
    Um, sorry about the comparison. In hindsight, it's pretty harsh... In any case, I was simply making the observation that modifying your body for social pressure-related reasons under the guise of "protection" (from bullying/molestation) is nothing new. Again, sorry, miss.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    In this case, you lessen/resolve the social issues driving the need for the surgery. This particular instance was driven by legitimate physical and social dangers, not by the mother or daughter's need to "look a certain way" all on their own.
    This. I said something similar in the "protection from bullying" thread - we need to address the stigmatization instead of dodging it by subjecting children to those sorts of surgery.

  2. #22
    Member amazingdatagirl's Avatar
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    Ear pinning is a hot button for me simply because I love kids with big ears. It is an endearing feature of childhood like freckles or a first grader with giant front teeth. Sadly, parents are buying into an unnatural and socially restrictive standard of beauty.

    Despite my personal bias, gotta agree with Jennifer on this one...
    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I can't simply make a blanket statement about all instances of cosmetic surgery for children. I would rather take things on a case-by-case basis, if solely to respect the needs and wishes of the people who actually have to bear the burden of the situation driving the surgery (typically the parents and the child) rather than deciding for people from a safe distance.
    As long as insurance companies are willing to pay for the procedure then it's none of my business.

  3. #23
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amazingdatagirl View Post
    Ear pinning is a hot button for me simply because I love kids with big ears. It is an endearing feature of childhood like freckles or a first grader with giant front teeth. Sadly, parents are buying into an unnatural and socially restrictive standard of beauty.
    Baby Happy was so cuuuute!



    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    This. I said something similar in the "protection from bullying" thread - we need to address the stigmatization instead of dodging it by subjecting children to those sorts of surgery.
    And here is where realism bumps into idealism.
    Here's the reason I don't have as much issue with a backup plan.

    Is the idealism actually, actively solving the problem right now?

    People are very vocal about "changing society," but is society actually being changed or are we simply always complaining about the problem without actually making a difference? Is there a tangible answer forthcoming? I don't see bullying slowing down or stopping, despite the idealism.

    So, then: In the process of people working to change society, what do bullied people do in the meanwhile?

    Idealism is demanding that the victims continue to endure terrible hardship, while it's easy for someone to be idealistic in speech about how best to resolve this issue without doing anything practical or realistic that resolves the issue.

    Net Result: The victims are victimized even further, while options to protect themselves and/or alleviate their bullying (even if not the "preferred" idealistic solution) are removed (either literally or socially) from them.

    I think the people making the decision should be the ones who are bearing the cost of the decision. (This is my same stance on abortion, btw. Unless you are helping to bear the cost, then you have no right to impose a solution on a family that is reaching their own legitimate answer.)

    To whit: If my child was being bullied to the point where he or she was under risk of long-term psychological or physical harm and/or even suicide, I'd consider all of my options regardless. Some cases of childhood cosmetic surgery might not fall into that category, but that's why one should examine the cases independently.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #24
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Anyone else have concerns about cosmetic surgery, in that it's the gift that keeps on giving to that particular industry?

    Adults are fair game for them, since they're responsible for themselves. But not only has this industry targeted adults, it's worked its way into teenage girls with rhinoplasty and breast enhancements and in another thread, are now targeting little girls using guilt on parents, that if they don't "fix" their children, they're leaving them open to bullying.

    To me this smacks of serious inethical and predatory business practices. Everything is legal but this is going too far. Leave the teenagers and children alone.

    This commercial free, non-profit broadcast has been brought to you by Fi.
    Sorry to hear this but its probably just a reflection of people feeling less like trying to change social attitudes or others and more focused in on themselves.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    I see your point, Miss Jennifer... Yeah, like I said, I see nothing wrong with the modifications, as long as it's a pretty safe procedure. One could argue that bullying needs stricter punishment, but it can be a very sneaky and hard to detect behaviour... I don't know where to stand anymore.

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