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  1. #1
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Default anger transfer in a nf relationship

    Well, I dont know how to explain this, this's kinda stupid .

    I lately noticed (and with lately I mean finally after probably 2 years) that I am having an increased temperament towards totally unimportant things. I lately for example got het up because they charged me in a bill 0,97 € for not participating in their electronic direct debiting scheme. Ok, well they probably have administration costs, but do they really have to so clearly tell me that they hate me ?

    And another thing just today. I walked towards a green traffic light and wanted to cross the street. Just a second before I stepped on the street a BMW came with insane speed from the right took the right of way from me, nearly taking me with him. I showed him "thumbs up" and he saw it in the back mirror. He then stopped the car in the middle of the street came out of the car and asked me why I showed him the middle finger ? I shouted: "I showed you thumbs up you asshole." He then waved his hand and got back into his car because traffic was rushing towards him.

    I dont understanhd this, I get aroused over the simplest things and I have only one explanation for this: my infp.

    When we met years ago I was as boring and dry as stone in a desert. She was more like a volcano, one false word and your head was rolling. Nowadays she's more calm and controlled while I am getting pissed at the smallest things. We usually go on the balcony to smoke and then are having fun over the stupidity of people which always produces a high chaos on the crossroads before our door. Everyone wants to cross it as first and noone watches each other, which always leads to a situation in wish 8 cars are standing on the crossroads and nothing is moving no more.

    When we do this I always have to think of the old farts from the muppet show on the balcony.

    I dont know what to make of this. I dont think it's necessarily bad to have more temperament, the good thing is I stand up for myself and others more often, while I would have been quieter when I was younger and just would have swallowed injustice. Well on the other hand I dont want to become a choleric fart who has to make trouble in every supermarket line.

    What do you think about this ? Can this attitude change in me be at all related to my girlfriend or is it something that naturally comes with age ?
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  2. #2
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    This is interesting..

    The first thing I have to say is.. You own your feelings.. So you have to ask yourself why you are feeling so short tempered.
    Anger is usually a response to a underlying emotion.

    But I also consider this.. Empathy.. It is entirely possible someone or someones, can "influence" your emotional state, either with or without intent.
    Being in proximity with someone intimately, day after day is going to influence you in some ways whether you are aware or not.

    I am not sure.. but I am under the impression you are at least in your late 30's.
    I have been looking into how hormonal changes affect our (males) behavior as we age.
    We apparently start to become a "tad" more sensitive around our late 30's early 40's as our testosterone levels decrease and our estrogen increases.
    There is also the possible theory of tertiary function increase as people age.. you are ENTP.. a sudden increase in Fe awareness would explain an increase in empathy and sensitivity to the actions and behaviors of others.

    Interesting stuff indeed .

  3. #3
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    I think it’s entirely possible to become a bit cantankerous ourselves out of empathy for someone who is somewhat cantankerous, if we spend enough time around them- especially if it’s a seemingly innocuous form of grumpiness (like Statler and Waldorf from the muppets). If the grumpiness is more clearly hurtful, then empathy for others will probably override any empathy for the single cantankerous person.

    In related news, as always, entropie’s op makes me wish it were possible to carry a pocket size entropie around with me. His best effort at being cranky often ends up just being somewhat endearing and strangely comforting.
    Reality is a collective hunch. -Lily Tomlin

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  4. #4
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    This is interesting..

    The first thing I have to say is.. You own your feelings.. So you have to ask yourself why you are feeling so short tempered.
    Anger is usually a response to a underlying emotion.

    But I also consider this.. Empathy.. It is entirely possible someone or someones, can "influence" your emotional state, either with or without intent.
    Being in proximity with someone intimately, day after day is going to influence you in some ways whether you are aware or not.

    I am not sure.. but I am under the impression you are at least in your late 30's.
    I have been looking into how hormonal changes affect our (males) behavior as we age.
    We apparently start to become a "tad" more sensitive around our late 30's early 40's as our testosterone levels decrease and our estrogen increases.
    There is also the possible theory of tertiary function increase as people age.. you are ENTP.. a sudden increase in Fe awareness would explain an increase in empathy and sensitivity to the actions and behaviors of others.

    Interesting stuff indeed .


    Thanks for your response. I am 27 dont make me old . This thread was originally dedicated to end up in the NF forums, dont ask me how I managed to let it end up in the Bonfire instead .

    Well empathy is a thing I thought about too, tho I think aswell this has to go in combination with an underlying emotion, it's good how you said that. I am not very empathic in the official sense. When everybody is crieing in a movie someone usually has to wake me up. But I am unconventionally empathic, I sometimes cry to the strangest things. Like for example theme melodies to movies I like make sometimes rush tears into my eyes. Cant fight it, it just happens. It's always in combination with an intense feeling of being touched by something.

    Reactivity on the other hand is my forte. Disregardless of what environment you put me in, I'll learn to walk like them, talk like them and to feel with them. Except if you want to make me a tough military guy for that my estrogen levels are already too high . Reactivity must be in correlation with the experience described here but I agree with you that it didnt create the feeling out of nowhere for me. My girlfriend tends to tell me that I am one of the most emotional and sensitive persons she ever met in her life and that I have a huge potential I just dont know it yet.

    It's kinda strange for me and very unconcious. I thought about it and tried to relate it to mbti and I dont think in that case it can be clearly related to a T or F function. Sometimes feelings come and go and never are concious. While I feel completly neutral and peace at mind the body does emotionally react without me being able to control it. This is a strong indicator for underdeveloped feeling that's for sure, yet how can someone with underdeveloped feelings be so emotional ? My theisis is this has to do with being a strong perceiver. To the rational mind perception always goes like this: Someone is sad about something. Your mind makes up a billion scenarios why this could be, analyzes them in accordance to the situation and then tries out scenarios to find out whats going on. The mind nearly always misses the obvious reason. Yet when you find out the reason you give advice according to a standard, may it be the advice you want to hear in that situation, it's all very controlled.

    Yet when someone is sad about a thing you experienced for yourself one time, you feel with them for real. And you can give much better advice or much better understand a situation. I think that especially feeler types have the bigger experience with situatzion like that or the better imagination to empathise in such situations.

    I think that a strong perception with the ability to think abstractly enables you to see the world from different PoVs and that you maybe can master some of these worlds a bit. For me it's definitly clear that there's a lot of undeveloped sensation and feelings with in me, I yet have to discover. Till you get there tho I think a lot of things will happen to yourself you dont understand. It's just a miracle to me how I managed to choke the capability to emotionally react to things to such a huge extent. :/
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  5. #5
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    Thanks for your response. I am 27 dont make me old . This thread was originally dedicated to end up in the NF forums, dont ask me how I managed to let it end up in the Bonfire instead .

    Well empathy is a thing I thought about too, tho I think aswell this has to go in combination with an underlying emotion, it's good how you said that. I am not very empathic in the official sense. When everybody is crieing in a movie someone usually has to wake me up. But I am unconventionally empathic, I sometimes cry to the strangest things. Like for example theme melodies to movies I like make sometimes rush tears into my eyes. Cant fight it, it just happens. It's always in combination with an intense feeling of being touched by something.

    Reactivity on the other hand is my forte. Disregardless of what environment you put me in, I'll learn to walk like them, talk like them and to feel with them. Except if you want to make me a tough military guy for that my estrogen levels are already too high . Reactivity must be in correlation with the experience described here but I agree with you that it didnt create the feeling out of nowhere for me. My girlfriend tends to tell me that I am one of the most emotional and sensitive persons she ever met in her life and that I have a huge potential I just dont know it yet.

    It's kinda strange for me and very unconcious. I thought about it and tried to relate it to mbti and I dont think in that case it can be clearly related to a T or F function. Sometimes feelings come and go and never are concious. While I feel completly neutral and peace at mind the body does emotionally react without me being able to control it. This is a strong indicator for underdeveloped feeling that's for sure, yet how can someone with underdeveloped feelings be so emotional ? My theisis is this has to do with being a strong perceiver. To the rational mind perception always goes like this: Someone is sad about something. Your mind makes up a billion scenarios why this could be, analyzes them in accordance to the situation and then tries out scenarios to find out whats going on. The mind nearly always misses the obvious reason. Yet when you find out the reason you give advice according to a standard, may it be the advice you want to hear in that situation, it's all very controlled.

    Yet when someone is sad about a thing you experienced for yourself one time, you feel with them for real. And you can give much better advice or much better understand a situation. I think that especially feeler types have the bigger experience with situatzion like that or the better imagination to empathise in such situations.

    I think that a strong perception with the ability to think abstractly enables you to see the world from different PoVs and that you maybe can master some of these worlds a bit. For me it's definitly clear that there's a lot of undeveloped sensation and feelings with in me, I yet have to discover. Till you get there tho I think a lot of things will happen to yourself you dont understand. It's just a miracle to me how I managed to choke the capability to emotionally react to things to such a huge extent. :/
    you certainly sound more NF than NT to me, and almost certainly NFJ. reacting to and synchronizing your environment is a function of very strong extraverted feeling. you sound like an overall ration person who has trouble controlling their emotions, much like my INFJ father. NT's biggest advantage over NFs is there unnaturaly cool and collected demeanor which is evident usually at a very young age. intuition is enough to explain the unconventionality of your empathy. we tend to see things in very unique perspectives that rarely end up being conventional or normal, especially if you're INF.

  6. #6
    Senor Membrane
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    I've noticed this phenomenom. At first it seemed like people were having a strong impact on me by just being around and being themselves, but the first time I realized I have the same effect on people was when I left a house I was living in with three friends, and when I came to visit them the athmosphere of the house had changed quite a lot. And this wasn't just me. One of them told me exactly the same thing. The reason I hadn't noticed is because I seem to have a calming effect on people.

    It's actually quite funny how an ENFJ friend of mine will bring incredible amount of joy and randomness to everywhere she goes. She spent some time living with us and it was like a different world. And it isn't like you need to be an NF to have this influence. Everyone has it, I think, it's just not the way people think about it most of the time.

    Nowadays my perspective on relationships is quite different than before because of the way I see this unconscious influence. I don't anymore "blame" people in the same way as before, because it is a synergy. In a way, I don't see relationships being about individuals anymore.

  7. #7
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Thanks for your responses. I'm flattered you'ld type me NF and not too long ago I've given this some thought myself. I found a german mbti test then, one of like two on the whole interwebz and it told me I am an enfj.

    Well see, I may have some qualities of an enfj. If you break down the entp function order the first real extrovert functions is Fe. So if you learnt to use that to an extent, you may come off as a primary Fe-dom.

    I am not completly ruling out the possibility to be an enfj, but if you make a list of my abilities, there are a lot of things that dont fit into the enfj profile.

    - First I like to work with people, but only for so long. I'ld never do a job in a social area where the main focus of the work would be people. I like to work alone on projects and I like to work with non-human things. I like the most when I have an assignment where a technical problem needs to be solved. Something where I can brainstorm my own ideas and then analyze for the best fit

    - Second, I've studied engineering and about 90 % of my intrest and time is devoted to topics from that field. I find philosophy and psychology ridicoulus to the most extent, still I am not blind to it and try to understand theories from that field first, before I judge them. Yet most psychological mumbojumbo is too much for me, especially when it's about me

    If you'ld strictly analyze me and watch my doings and what I am good at and what not, you'll pretty much find the atypical entp function order; so I think this is the closest match for me. I cant imagine how I could have developed a devoted intrest in complex mathematics and astronomy with a T - function ranked place 4 in the enfj. That doesnt ring for me. I am not saying that an enfj cant be a good astronomer, but I've understood the whole mbti in the way that, being a complex mathematician wouldnt intrest an enfj; because he has a preference for Fe which excludes an intrest in complex math.

    Do you understand what I mean ? I am quite sure I have a strong Fe, yet it's very insecure and sometimes there sometimes not. There are times I am so abrasive towards people, you wouldnt think I am a prim Fe dom.

    I think to solve the riddle of this reactivity in my case, the combination of Ne - Fe plays a bigger role. They say a good match for the infp, this the type too of my girlfriend, would be an enfj or esfj. I hope I am not giving off a wrong impression in that sense. But since my girlfriend is oblivious to mbti, I hope she has a better clue about myself
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  8. #8
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    Reactivity on the other hand is my forte. Disregardless of what environment you put me in, I'll learn to walk like them, talk like them and to feel with them. Except if you want to make me a tough military guy for that my estrogen levels are already too high . Reactivity must be in correlation with the experience described here but I agree with you that it didnt create the feeling out of nowhere for me. My girlfriend tends to tell me that I am one of the most emotional and sensitive persons she ever met in her life and that I have a huge potential I just dont know it yet.
    I don't know if I buy into the people of this type should use XXX functions any more. It seems the more you look at people of different types, the more similarities you see than differences. I truly believe it's unfair to say somebody that's T dom shouldn't be using Fe... because I would call what you described as a textbook Fe response (if somebody ever write up a textbook). That's how I see Fe works... all reactivity based on the current situation.

    Oh and tough military guys are overrated...

    It's kinda strange for me and very unconcious. I thought about it and tried to relate it to mbti and I dont think in that case it can be clearly related to a T or F function. Sometimes feelings come and go and never are concious. While I feel completly neutral and peace at mind the body does emotionally react without me being able to control it.
    Hmmm I think even for somebody with strong F, you would find that feelings just bubble up unconsciously. It also makes very little sense to say I will be happy so I'm happy. More like the situation, e.g. your g/f made you muffins as a surprise just makes you feel happy. Maybe stop trying to quantify / objectify emotions because it just doesn't work that way. What is, just is.

    This is a strong indicator for underdeveloped feeling that's for sure, yet how can someone with underdeveloped feelings be so emotional ? My theisis is this has to do with being a strong perceiver. To the rational mind perception always goes like this: Someone is sad about something. Your mind makes up a billion scenarios why this could be, analyzes them in accordance to the situation and then tries out scenarios to find out whats going on. The mind nearly always misses the obvious reason. Yet when you find out the reason you give advice according to a standard, may it be the advice you want to hear in that situation, it's all very controlled.
    You know... this is usually what goes on in my head on a daily basis... Although I don't usually miss the obvious reasons... but sometimes you start off with the wrong assumptions and this can go very very wrong.

    I would have call it Ni Fe, but *shrugs* maybe that's not it. Maybe it's N plus Fe plus Ti, or whatever crappy mix of functions. In the end, does functions matter?

    And going back to the OP, YES. I would say interacting with people of a specific type definitely changes how we see/feel about things. Your g/f probably helps you understand your emotions better... and consequently you think more about them... which might in return make you notice sudden changes in emotions more frequently.
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