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  1. #11
    Senior Member Pixelholic's Avatar
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    Okay,

    It's scientifically proven that bears can feel pain.

    Pain is bad, all creatures instinctively avoid pain.

    Humans can deduce that inflicting pain is bad (this is part of the golden rule and exists in all societies. Only sociopathic people fail to understand it, therefore it is a reasonable assertion to use.)

    Humans must eat to survive

    eating animals inflicts pain

    Humans can either not eat animals, or inflict as little pain as possible to the animal.

    Some humans pick the first choice, most go with the second. (Most hunters I know want to kill an animal cleanly so that the animal doesn't suffer.)

    Bear dancing inflicts pain for entertainment.

    Entertainment is not necessary for survival.

    Pain is bad

    Bear dancing is cruel.

    Also, just because some people think it's not cruel, does it magically become okay. Some people think waterboarding isn't torture.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  2. #12
    Senior Member Pixelholic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al-Tair View Post
    I am a human that is why I value the consciousness of a human over that of an non-human animal. We are at the top of the food chain, we are technologically superior to non-human animals. The achievements humans have made is unprecedented. Our high cognitive abilities makes us gods in the eyes of non-human animals. Even a small child has far high ability cognitive ability, then even a great ape.

    Humans have invented vaccines, fertilizers, and medicines, which has not only benefited human animals, but also non-human animals.
    Got a bit of a god complex going on there buddy?

    You're a hairless monkey that is good at using tools. Get over yourself.

    Also chimp children increase in intelligence faster than human children until about age 5 or 6 when chimp intelligence stops advancing.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  3. #13
    Senior Member Rebe's Avatar
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    I am a human that is why I value the consciousness of a human over that of an non-human animal. We are at the top of the food chain, we are technologically superior to non-human animals. The achievements humans have made is unprecedented. Our high cognitive abilities makes us gods in the eyes of non-human animals. Even a small child has far high ability cognitive ability, then even a great ape.
    So what?

    We have done a tremendous, tremendous amount of damage to the animal kingdom/to the natural world because we weren't smart or compassionate enough. So now we have to deal with global warming, and so do they, they are suffering sooner than us from the melting ice, lack of resources and space, etc. I am not saying animals are superior, smarter or compassionate but those three traits does that give humans the right to trample all over the other living creatures.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Pixelholic's Avatar
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    The problem with eating already dead animals is that our bodies can't handle the parasites and bacteria that show up on decomposing bodies. We'd have a tiny window of edibility. That's why scavenger animals are rare in the biosphere. It is possible to survive without eating animals if you can get access to the right kinds of grains and proteins.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  5. #15
    Senior Member Pixelholic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al-Tair View Post
    I mean you could argue keeping dogs and cats is cruel, teaching a dog tricks is cruel.
    I eagerly await to hear your argument then.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  6. #16
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al-Tair View Post
    ...why is it not OK to kill a human child and eat it?
    Human children eat too much processed food and the chemicals aren't healthy for any adult trying to watch their health. (Do you see what they put in Lunchables nowadays?) Bears are natural, like bamboo shoots and honeysuckle nectar.

    Next thread.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #17
    Senior Member Pixelholic's Avatar
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    It's not the production of CO2 that's bad, it's the addition of CO2 that was formerly trapped in the ground that's bad.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  8. #18
    Senior Member Rebe's Avatar
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    That's only one tiny piece of the whole picture.

  9. #19
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    You know if you want to argue for the sake of arguing you really should get a basic grasp of what you're arguing about.
    “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.” -Nietzsche

  10. #20
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Al-Tair View Post
    Well I think Global Warming has been exaggerated. Was there not a scandal recently about these scientists sending emails to each other in which they confessed to lying about some of the data or embellishing it?
    I think the consensus, if you read the article more closely, is the OPPOSITE of what you were saying. IOW, their research was fine and reputable, but it was unfortunate that the e-mails gave the appearance of potential falsehood.

    Google stuff and read it all again.



    Confused: Are we discussing dancing bears or global warming?

    I already know which one I find more interesting...
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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