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View Poll Results: You are going to be a citizen of a new country. But you get to choose what kind of go

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  • No government whatsoever

    4 18.18%
  • Very limited government- no national army/ military

    7 31.82%
  • Limited government- with a national army/military

    7 31.82%
  • Big Government

    4 18.18%
  • All powerful government

    0 0%
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Thread: Choose

  1. #11
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Those are my choices?

    I voted big government... because somewhere inside the cloud of all the different things that could mean, there is something I want.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  2. #12
    Senior Member ObeyBunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Eyebrows View Post
    Do I get to choose the government that rules over me while the rest of the government remains constant, or do I get to choose the government that rules over the entire country?
    You choose the government that rules over the country- a country that you happen to be a citizen of. If you choose "Big Government" you're actually saying "I want government to have total control over my life, the things that I buy, the earnings that I keep, and the times of the year I'm allowed to have a garage sale"

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Eyebrows View Post
    Because in the former case, I'm pretty sure I could break the system by selecting "no government" or "limited government" and thus avoid taxes while still indulging myself in sweet, sweet government services.
    There is no welfare with limited government. If you want all the same benefits, you'd have to find charities or start producing all your own materials. (No one is going to hand food and money to you on a regular basis)
    Q: "What is the process of seeking the truth?"
    A: "Distilled liquor"

    Q: "If you could live anywhere in the world, where would it be?"
    A: "Between a starving prostitute and a steak sandwich."

    Q:How would a mathematician capture an elephant?
    A:He would build a cage, step inside, and rename his new location as "outside."

  3. #13
    Senior Member ObeyBunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Those are my choices?

    I voted big government... because somewhere inside the cloud of all the different things that could mean, there is something I want.
    By "Big government" I mean government control over the econemy of that country.
    Q: "What is the process of seeking the truth?"
    A: "Distilled liquor"

    Q: "If you could live anywhere in the world, where would it be?"
    A: "Between a starving prostitute and a steak sandwich."

    Q:How would a mathematician capture an elephant?
    A:He would build a cage, step inside, and rename his new location as "outside."

  4. #14
    Senior Member Rebe's Avatar
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    Option 1 (No government) are anarchists or nomadic farmers.

    Option 2 (very small goverment) are Libertarians

    Option 3 (Small goverment + army) republicans

    Grease is option 4 (Big Government)- 1/3 of all people working in Grease is working for the government (in my opinion, an unsustainable amount.) They're Socialists/ Communists.
    I choose big government over little government, though not a corrupted big government over not-corrupted little government, the size doesn't matter as much as the structure, the policies, the extend of social welfare, the people (seats occupied by other than old, white men) so ... it's really an odd question to ask ... Big government doesn't necessarily mean evil. Small government doesn't necessarily mean more efficient and more humane.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ObeyBunny View Post
    You choose the government that rules over the country- a country that you happen to be a citizen of. If you choose "Big Government" you're actually saying "I want government to have total control over my life, the things that I buy, the earnings that I keep, and the times of the year I'm allowed to have a garage sale"
    This sounds like the worst thing in the entire world

    I know how I'm voting


    I chose "no army" because it's a new country, and I guess we don't have enemies and aren't particularly aggressive enough to take over our neighbors. When we grow and people start to hate us, and when the public starts to need that sense of security, we're gonna need ourselves an army.

  6. #16
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ObeyBunny View Post
    You choose the government that rules over the country- a country that you happen to be a citizen of. If you choose "Big Government" you're actually saying "I want government to have total control over my life, the things that I buy, the earnings that I keep, and the times of the year I'm allowed to have a garage sale"
    That sounds like all powerful government. What is the difference?
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  7. #17
    Senior Member ObeyBunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    That sounds like all powerful government. What is the difference?
    Difference between Big and Total?

    Well, you still have some individual rights with Big Gov. like being able to vote on the next president, being able to leave the country, having the number of children that you want, being able to vacation where you want, those sort of things.

    With Big Gov. You're still limited on the amount of salt in your food, the healthcare you can buy, wether or not you can build a water well in your backyard and pump you're own drinking water, those sort of things.

    China is an example of Total Government

    Grease is an example of Big Government.

    America, 30 years after it got its independence from England, was closer to option 2

    America, the way it is currently (I mean within the last 3 years), is number 4.
    Q: "What is the process of seeking the truth?"
    A: "Distilled liquor"

    Q: "If you could live anywhere in the world, where would it be?"
    A: "Between a starving prostitute and a steak sandwich."

    Q:How would a mathematician capture an elephant?
    A:He would build a cage, step inside, and rename his new location as "outside."

  8. #18
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Eyebrows View Post
    Do I get to choose the government that rules over me while the rest of the government remains constant, or do I get to choose the government that rules over the entire country?
    The latter is how it generally works. Personally, I make the distinction between what is good for me and what is good for society, and choose policy based on what is good for society. If any of it doesn't suit me, I can find some way to subvert the law; they always exist.
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  9. #19

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    You mean Greece man.

    Anyway, the military-industrial complex in the US probably employs a huge amount of people and it costs US taxpayers and the world probably more than simply cash revenue (although I'm not entirely opposed to US foreign policy either, there's too much in the way of simple minded peaceniks and international ingrates).

    Greece has a lot of problems, its not simply employment on the tax tab, plenty of countries do that well, like Germany and France, it keeps the money in circulation, it doesnt get taken out and put in someones Swiss account, and those state employees can support myriad private businesses, particularly small businesses which would otherwise go to the wall, as consumers with spending money/disposable income.

    No, Greece is corrupt, its gone the wrong way about dealing with the corruption too, people didnt turn up to work on time or stay the whole day so they awarded bonuses for coming in on time or staying the whole day (staying the whole day isnt necessary in offices which would flexi time, that's not exclusive to the public/state services but it doesnt work if everyone takes half days, all the time), there were committees set up to supervise projects which wherent ever wound up and people get receiving payments (like for monitoring a lake that dried up or stuff like that) or ghost working (people worked from home, then they discovered they could work two jobs this way).

    To be honest there's countries like Somalia which should be paradigms of success by libertarian free market standards and they arent. Despite being upheld as a minarchist ideal the Swiss have a pretty generous welfare regime and public services, such as publically owned railways, which the cantonal small governments and consensus requisites prevent the privatisation off.

    A better debate than the supposed size of government, small vs. big, is the scope of government, doing a specific, limited number of functions vs. doing pretty much everything and being expected to behave paternalistically.

  10. #20
    Senior Member JHBowden's Avatar
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    I voted "Limited government- with a national army/military."

    One complaint about the questions though-- while big government does not necessarily mean a sophisticated, high-tech, well-trained military, it doesn't exclude it either. If given a choice to vote for an LBJ versus a Ron Paul, I'd vote for the LBJ. A social democracy that projects military power is more admirable than a libertarian society that does not.

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