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  1. #41
    No Cigar Litvyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    It wasn't the failure of the idea of a unipolar world led by the US, so much as the obsolescence of that reality.
    I don't think it ever realized in the first place, as shown by many blunders of US foreign policy.
    The 90's held the possibility of an ultimate US-dominance in international relations, while America was desperately trying to find a place in the newly formed world order. It didn't succeed, but the consequences weren't visible until the first years of the 21st century.

  2. #42
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Litvyak View Post
    I don't think it ever realized in the first place, as shown by many blunders of US foreign policy.
    The 90's held the possibility of an ultimate US-dominance in international relations, while America was desperately trying to find a place in the newly formed world order. It didn't succeed, but the consequences weren't visible until the first years of the 21st century.
    I think you're right, but I also think that our tendency to look at things in nationalistic terms belies the truth of the situation. What we saw as "US dominance", the power players saw more as the dominance of supra-national business structures, with security guaranteed by an enormous US military (economies of scale lead to a preference for monopolization of military bureaucracy). We didn't realize that countries like China, India and Russia were going to remain as nationalistic as they are, and that nationalism hadn't been fully superseded in the European Union.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Litvyak View Post
    I don't think it ever realized in the first place, as shown by many blunders of US foreign policy.
    The 90's held the possibility of an ultimate US-dominance in international relations, while America was desperately trying to find a place in the newly formed world order. It didn't succeed, but the consequences weren't visible until the first years of the 21st century.
    Ever heard this song?

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6unDcYBQSpQ"]We're All Living In America - Rammstein (2004)[/YOUTUBE]

  4. #44
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    Or of the time French Foreign Minister Hubert Vedrine complained in 1999 at the United Nations that the United States had become the first ever Hyperpower?

    His indictment just happened to coincide with the peak of American power, of course, but, well, no one quite knew that til sometime between 2000 and 2010, depending on how insightful they were.

  5. #45
    No Cigar Litvyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Ever heard this song?
    The cultural influence of a process that emerged from the US, and which is still in it's infancy, is quite clear to me.
    How does this confute my above comment? Unipolar dominance of the States was never a 'reality' to begin with, it was only a possibility followed by rushed interpretations.

    Like this one:

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Or of the time French Foreign Minister Hubert Vedrine complained in 1999 that the United States was the first ever Hyperpower?

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Litvyak View Post
    The cultural influence of a process that emerged from the US, and which is still in it's infancy, is quite clear to me.
    How does this confute my above comment? Unipolar dominance of the States was never a 'reality' to begin with, it was only a possibility followed by rushed interpretations.
    Let's not derail this thread.

    Start another one on the topic, or hit me up via pm or vm.

  7. #47
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Do you think this is a good thing? Have you read Marshall McLuhan's student, Neil Postman? Amusing Ourselves to Death?
    Have you heard the song by roger waters of pink floyd?
    (yes the song does pick up at about 3:20)

    [YOUTUBE="lsspXqCe4kI"]Amused to Death[/YOUTUBE]

    the 80s were about optimism, even if it involved having to ingest speed and spending on debt to achieve it ...somewhat rejecting 70s pessimism.

    the 90s were about Realism (people rejected how overly "perfected" 80s music sounded, and how overly perfect moral right tried to position itself) and Web 1.0 (the web was begun here, but user generated content was nothing). The 90s sort of re-embraced elements of pessimism, but not as much as the 70s.

    the 2000s were about re-embracing illusion-of-perfection (music with corporate engineered superstars, auto-tune, cheesy/easy to digest, "cell phone ring" music), and the emergence of the unholy trinity: narcissism, voyeurism and ADD (Web 2.0 such as blogs, twitter, myspace, facebook, youtube and reality TV). The 2000s will be known as the generation that began basically shouting at each other over the internet to get attention, drive up traffic, and steal most of societies smart individuals into creating zero value business run on advertising.

  8. #48
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    No, no no, the '00s were about the future beginning. We spent the latter half of the 20th century fearing an Orwellian society, when really we shouldn't have been listening to Orwell but rather have been listening to Philip K. Dick's versions of dystopia.

    Babylon, stop calling my generation one of total fuck-ups. No matter how disparaging people get about the next generations, you cannot forget, they are your future.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  9. #49
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Decadence spiralling into oblivion.

  10. #50
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    No, no no, the '00s were about the future beginning. We spent the latter half of the 20th century fearing an Orwellian society, when really we shouldn't have been listening to Orwell but rather have been listening to Philip K. Dick's versions of dystopia.

    Babylon, stop calling my generation one of total fuck-ups. No matter how disparaging people get about the next generations, you cannot forget, they are your future.
    who is your generation, and how are you so sure that I dont share the same generation as you?

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