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  1. #21
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    Like, OMG!
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  2. #22
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nebbykoo View Post
    Sytpg: I would say that this issue has nothing to do with type. It has everything to do with habits and styles of comminication you learned in the past.

    Kick any dog enough, and one of two things will happen: the dog will become more aggressive or less so. Breed of dog is irrelevant.

    So who kicked you to make you more aggressive? (not implying that you are a dog! just thinking metaphorically)
    My environment growing up, to an extent I think. Some of my traits weren't really valued. It has it's downsides, but also it's upsides, like being more logical than the average ENFP, and being cautious, and not completely scattered, and not completely trusting or unhealthily optimistic (naive) etc.

  3. #23
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    I think the fact that you want to change would make doing this authentic.

    I relate to you though in thinking that people are morons, so you have a hard time being nice. Whatever's advice is good though. Leave things out to not offend people; and try as hard as possible to bite your tongue when it's important. Just practice some peacemaking.

    Though that's difficult too. Because when I find that someone's a moron, my mind fills up with rude things to say and I'm totally blank on positive things to say. So I guess try to make a concentrated effort to say anything other than something bad.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  4. #24
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    Not to bring to much of my thoughts from another thread, but trying things on and seeing how they fit is a way to change while still being authentic.

    We can try on lots of different things, its simply called experience. This could be ideas, sensory, feelings, logic, etc to merge it with MBTI terms.
    Im out, its been fun

  5. #25
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    My environment growing up, to an extent I think. Some of my traits weren't really valued. It has it's downsides, but also it's upsides, like being more logical than the average ENFP, and being cautious, and not completely scattered, and not completely trusting or unhealthily optimistic (naive) etc.
    I think you just found the answer.
    You say that being undervalued for yourself had an upside, but I would say that that is a statement of someone who has no other frame of reference, so a state of mind that does not contain the haibits/attitudes/conditioning that you grew up with feels inauthentic and unstable. You have to accept this on order to find your authentic self. Changing yourself will fill you with more fear than jumping out of an airplane...but what one man can do, another can do.

  6. #26
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    hmm...i guess i just don't get it. i feel like i'm always authentic and say what i mean...but i guess i have the rule of say what i mean when it's someone close to me and i think they need to hear it and if it's someone i'm not close to and they're not asking for my opinion i guess i don't go out of my way to confront them or bust their chops on something...i guess i just disengage or something...so i feel like i'm being authentic because i'm not pretending to value or agree with them on whatever issue...it's probably that my mother taught me that if you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all...haha so i guess i do that unless they ask or it's someone i'm especially close to that i know/think would value my perspective.

    but maybe i just generally have a high opinion of others so it's not so much an issue for me??? not sure
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  7. #27
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by poki View Post
    Not to bring to much of my thoughts from another thread, but trying things on and seeing how they fit is a way to change while still being authentic.

    We can try on lots of different things, its simply called experience. This could be ideas, sensory, feelings, logic, etc to merge it with MBTI terms.
    I hate the idea of that though. I see meaning in all kinds of experiences, big or small. And I must only be part of the kine of experiences that jive with my Fi.

    Think of it like cheating. You don't do it just to see how it fits. Guilt is involved not only because it hurts your partner, but because you have the notion you violated something holy and you feel unauthentic. I use the same reasoning on lesser scales.

    I prefer to believe in things like meditation, than actually trying things out. I believe there is sufficient material WITHIN myself to be the best person I can be. Experiences teach, but theory teaches more...specially if one is like me and must first make sure something would jive with his principles before doing it. Foresight rather than hindsight in order to get INsight.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sytpg View Post
    I hate the idea of that though. I see meaning in all kinds of experiences, big or small. And I must only be part of the kine of experiences that jive with my Fi.

    Think of it like cheating. You don't do it just to see how it fits. Guilt is involved not only because it hurts your partner, but because you have the notion you violated something holy and you feel unauthentic. I use the same reasoning on lesser scales.

    I prefer to believe in things like meditation, than actually trying things out. I believe there is sufficient material WITHIN myself to be the best person I can be. Experiences teach, but theory teaches more...specially if one is like me and must first make sure something would jive with his principles before doing it.
    Please explain a little more why cheating makes you feel unauthentic? Is it because alot of other people do it as well and to struggle with things seems more authentic?

    Being authentic is not in the details of what it is you do, but the fact that when you roll everything up no one is like you. I understand where an ISTJ would need things to jive first before doing it. That to me is trying it on. Experiencers do things differently then introverts. I have made a comment "I like the way you make me feel". I tend to try people on alot The only time I have huge problems while being married is not the fact that I tried someone on, but its dependent on the combination of feelings that I tried on. Its strange and hard to explain, but I can do the exact same action while trying on a different feeling. This is a struggle for me right now and I am learning and changing, but I am doing it through experience and I may stumble at times, but I am growing and changing in a way that fits myself.
    Im out, its been fun

  9. #29
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Blackcat : Yeah, I get it. I've been doing just that lately. It still feels very weird.

    Quote Originally Posted by nebbykoo View Post
    I think you just found the answer.
    You say that being undervalued for yourself had an upside, but I would say that that is a statement of someone who has no other frame of reference, so a state of mind that does not contain the haibits/attitudes/conditioning that you grew up with feels inauthentic and unstable. You have to accept this on order to find your authentic self. Changing yourself will fill you with more fear than jumping out of an airplane...but what one man can do, another can do.
    Hmm, maybe. I must say it was because I learned about other frames of references that I even thought of changing in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady X View Post
    hmm...i guess i just don't get it. i feel like i'm always authentic and say what i mean...but i guess i have the rule of say what i mean when it's someone close to me and i think they need to hear it and if it's someone i'm not close to and they're not asking for my opinion i guess i don't go out of my way to confront them or bust their chops on something...i guess i just disengage or something...so i feel like i'm being authentic because i'm not pretending to value or agree with them on whatever issue...it's probably that my mother taught me that if you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all...haha so i guess i do that unless they ask or it's someone i'm especially close to that i know/think would value my perspective.

    but maybe i just generally have a high opinion of others so it's not so much an issue for me??? not sure
    If you disengage from people that you are not close to in that manner, how are you having a high opinion of others?


    Me thinking most people are stupid does not deter me from being honest and understanding why they are like they are and wanting to help them become better. I'm hard with people BECAUSE I respect them. I respect everyone's intellect in the sense that I think everyone is capable of everything that I'm capable. I hate condescending or ignoring people...by ignoring people I'm not reaching out and I'm not connecting, I'm isolating myself from the world.

  10. #30
    Senior Member professor goodstain's Avatar
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    sometimes when i fake it a little (or alot) i'll start to crack up right then and there. usually in small laughter. i know what you mean. but when a good 'fake it' job is in order...when it really counts, i can produce and hold in the 'crack up' for later.
    my justification: i'll never loose touch with my authenticity due to being aware of when i'm fakin it. i know when it's superficial, i think you do to. or you wouldn't be so aware to the point of even making a thread that second guesses. you trust yourself enough to this very point of second guessing.
    go, my friend...into the brave new world of exploring different levels of fakin it. you will not compromise your values. you will find (a somewhat) precise recipe for each situation or combination of spontaneous situations. if it is not perfect...neither are the people or environment existing around it. you will find that your authenticity shines....specially when you can't help but to crack up at the least convenient time in accordance with superficial social rules
    everyone uses every function about evenly. take NE for example. if there are those who don't use it much, then why are there such massive amounts of people constantly flowing through Wallmart with 20 items or less?

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