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View Poll Results: Ni Dom Users: Which best describes your beliefs about God?

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  • INTJ: I believe there is a God

    8 14.29%
  • INTJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a >50% chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    1 1.79%
  • INTJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a 50-50 chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    3 5.36%
  • INTJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a <50% chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    5 8.93%
  • INTJ: I believe there is no God

    15 26.79%
  • INFJ: I believe there is a God

    9 16.07%
  • INFJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a >50% chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    2 3.57%
  • INFJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a 50-50 chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    4 7.14%
  • INFJ: I am agnostic, but believe there's a <50% chance that some kind of Divinity exists

    5 8.93%
  • INFJ: I believe there is no God

    4 7.14%
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  1. #121
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    I have not had time to read every page of this thread, but I will still venture a few remarks, based upon the most recent exchange.

    1. If I recall Jung correctly, he considered both thinking and feeling to be rational functions. In any case, since everyone uses every function, at least to some degree, F and T cannot be mutually exclusive.

    2. Someone (Mycroft?) wrote: "reason is the faculty concerned with objective phenomenon and, consequently, the only method available to us to arrive at any truthful conclusions about reality, as it is presented to us." Reason might suffice to explain everything if reality is entirely objective. If one admits that reality has a subjective component as well, then a subjective yet rational function would be suited to addressing it.

    3. As an example, consider someone who loves you: your mother, your SO, your best friend. How do you know that they love you? Can it be proven objectively? Their observable behavior might be consistent with a loving attitude, but might it be possible that they have ulterior motives, and are merely acting in such a way as to make you think that they love you? The whole question is subjective, but it is also important. Relationships are a very real part of our daily lives, and we must make decisions based on the subjective evidence of such situations, knowing that we might be wrong. But objectively reasoned conclusions can be wrong, too, since the soundness of the conclusion depends upon the accuracy of the underlying facts, and we often have incomplete or incorrect facts. Even scientific principles are never really proven; if not disproven, they are simply supported.

  2. #122
    Senior Member Daedalus's Avatar
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    I chose "INTJ: I believe there is no God "

    naturally the term "God" (as some entity) implies inequality, thus i cannot accept it (apart from the fact that there is not a single shred of proof to support such an idea). If there is a "god" as some people think...then it implies that the system is rigged. Therefore, its the duty of all those who support equality to oppose it.

    Furthermore, it makes no sense to have a god that is easily influenced by prayers...chosen people(a.k.a those who worship him)....can subvert the system of justice to "forgive" "sinners"...
    When i look at such attributes most of the "gods" have...it makes me want to laugh.
    Why would I want a "god" to forgive anyone who did wrong, but who "repented" and 'prayed" to the god? This reeks of favoritism. A god ought to be even handed when doling out justice.


    And lets not even get into the "you follow me or you will be sent to hell" line most gods seem to follow. Sounds super childish...like the comment of some spoiled brat (no offense meant to religious people) to say the least. Im confused why people give human-centric qualities to "gods"...it makes no sense at all...humans are an insignificant part of this universe(s)...yet supposedly the gods are oh so concerned about us. Its about time we stop thinking in tribal...race..species centric lines.


    Maybe there are some UFO's out there who masquerade as "Gods"...and when one thinks about it...it would have been super easy....
    Hell...give me an aircraft...and send me to 2000 BC, and i will make people think i'm God. its that simple.
    Maybe yeah...those who claim to be gods are some UFO's who played a prank on ancient humans...and the poor humans are still believing in it.


    If Humanity survives the next few centuries....like not being hit by a meteor...or some natural/human made disaster/war...the chances are that we will be set for eternity. It only seems logical that in a couple of centuries we will be all pretty much immortal..due to scientific progress. No death due to old age...or disease....having the blind see, and the lame walk...we could do most of the "miracles" attributed to god(with no evidence to support such claims i hasten to add)


    Extraverted - 25 Introverted - 75
    Sensing - 0 Intuition - 100
    Thinking - 63 Feeling - 37
    Judging - 63 Perceiving - 37
    ______________________________________


    It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see.

  3. #123
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    A psychological preoccupation with emotional responses to the exclusion of the development of one's rational faculties results in a disheveled mind and a lack of a comprehensive and accurate model of reality. Admitting to oneself a disheveled mind and a lack of a comprehensive and accurate model of reality is uncongenial; we all fancy ourselves well-rounded. It's more pleasing to label the resultant psychological miasma that accompanies poorly developed rational faculties as "spirituality" and to label the mystery that reality appears to be as a result of a lack of a comprehensive and accurate model of reality "that which man cannot, in his miserableness and limitation, possibly comprehend" and be done with it.
    Well said [or typed, as it were on computer]. I do have some visceral sentiments when I contemplate the universe, but it's not directed at anyone, let alone a deity.
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  4. #124
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    There is none.

  5. #125

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    I am a nostalgiac agnostic because sometimes God is a lovely thought, but oftentimes, a perverse one.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  6. #126

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    Well said [or typed, as it were on computer]. I do have some visceral sentiments when I contemplate the universe, but it's not directed at anyone, let alone a deity.
    Agreed.

    Why is it that so many people demand 'mystery' dons a hat and carries a resume? Do they lack the imagination to experience wonder in a life absent suprabiological figurehead(s)?
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  7. #127
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Agreed.

    Why is it that so many people demand 'mystery' dons a hat and carries a resume? Do they lack the imagination to experience wonder in a life absent suprabiological figurehead(s)?
    Quoted for truth, indeed
    Maybe it's because the universe is so alien to us that we want to make it more familiar to us, by projecting human features onto it...If so, the universe becomes, for us, a Rorschach test [Damn the implicit mind projection!].
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  8. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    Quoted for truth, indeed
    Maybe it's because the universe is so alien to us that we want to make it more familiar to us, by projecting human features onto it...If so, the universe becomes, for us, a Rorschach test [Damn the implicit mind projection!].
    You could be on to something... maybe the God concept is just meta-personification... or, meta-personification converging with an instinct for self-governance...?
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  9. #129
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    You could be on to something... maybe the God concept is just meta-personification... or, meta-personification converging with an instinct for self-governance...?
    I suppose so. We seem to need outside validation of our actions, so even an invisible means of support will do.
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  10. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    I suppose so. We seem to need outside validation of our actions, so even an invisible means of support will do.
    I don't know if it's validation... is it? /wondering aloud

    I'm not sure. I think it could be more like.... we love vistas, but fear weightlessness...
    ...we need ceilings?
    Do we need ceilings to feel secure?

    Our (I use the "we" perspective loosely) narrow vision is the most effective way to speed us forward...? like a trap-horse with self-applied blinders?

    I dunno, I dunno. I'm doing the unthinkable... and thinking aloud.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

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