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  1. #1
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    Default Kill in order to not be killed yourself

    I just read these news:

    A German court has sentenced an 88-year-old former member of the Nazi SS to life in prison for the murder of three Dutch civilians in 1944.

    Heinrich Boere had told the court in Aachen that he killed a bicycle shop owner, a pharmacist and a member of the resistance as part of a death squad.

    But he said he was following orders and would have been shot for not doing so.

    Prosecutors said Boere was a willing member of the SS, which he joined after the Netherlands was invaded in 1940.
    BBC News - Former Nazi SS member convicted of Dutch murders

    I don't know what to make of this. If it is true that he would have been shot if he disobeyed, then who can claim to be any better than this guy?

  2. #2
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Being weak willed doesn't keep you from punishment.

  3. #3
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    he shouldn't have joined the SS then
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    Being weak willed doesn't keep you from punishment.
    Aren't we expecting a lot if we think that people will rather sacrifice themselves than others? Normal people are not that moral. The law cannot be made in a way that normal people can't obey it.

    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    he shouldn't have joined the SS then
    Yes, I thought so too. But how was SS seen back then? Was it like "I suppose I will be asked to kill people if I join" or was it like... umm... joining the police or something?

  5. #5
    Oberon
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    Well, in his case he got 66 extra years of life by following orders. Time to kick him off the gravy train.

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    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Yes, I thought so too. But how was SS seen back then? Was it like "I suppose I will be asked to kill people if I join" or was it like... umm... joining the police or something?
    well, he should have noticed that their primary concerns weren't tolerance, feeding the poor and planting urban flower gardens in parks... don't join a group unless you're SURE you want to be a member!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Well, in his case he got 66 extra years of life by following orders.
    He will probably think that he made the right choice back then. Which makes me wonder what is the point of punishing him..? It isn't like he will learn anything from it and see it differently... and this usually is the idea of punishment.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    I just read these news:



    BBC News - Former Nazi SS member convicted of Dutch murders

    I don't know what to make of this. If it is true that he would have been shot if he disobeyed, then who can claim to be any better than this guy?
    He could have hoped the deathsquad sent out to kill him was terrible shooters and would constantly miss and hope it would have continued until the end of the war.

    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    He will probably think that he made the right choice back then. Which makes me wonder what is the point of punishing him..? It isn't like he will learn anything from it and see it differently... and this usually is the idea of punishment.
    Usually I think most military personnel dont get sentenced for killing other humans if it was ordered from above, but it is different when we have to do with WWII since germany wants to be cleared as a nation for what was done back during WWII

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    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    There are people who would have chosen to be shot rather than obey. Some of them died under Nazi Germany. And yeah, he shouldn't have joined the SS.

    I'm not saying I would have done such-and-such (or the right thing) in such a situation. I hope and pray I would have, but you only find out for sure how strong your convictions are when you're IN the situation.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowriot View Post
    Usually I think most military personnel dont get sentenced for killing other humans if it was ordered from above, but it is different when we have to do with WWII since germany wants to be cleared as a nation for what was done back during WWII
    I don't really get that national shame thing. Who is ashamed? The regular Germans? Why, if they didn't do anything? And how does it help to punish people who normally wouldn't get punished?

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