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  1. #71
    Aquaria mrcockburn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aphrodite-gone-awry View Post
    I think it's extremely interesting and encouraging that a human being such as yourself didn't know what a spanking was. Really? Where are you from? I think it's awesome that you are researching spanking now, before you have kids. It's definitely not a parenting technique that need be carried on or used. There have been numerous threads here on spanking. I find it's mainly used by people who have been raised in a similar manner, by people who do not care to research other parenting techniques, or people who tie spanking with their religion, irrespective of type.
    Yeah, I truly didn't know what a spanking was until I googled it today. Nobody I know was spanked or discussed it. I just heard about it on news regarding controversies, laws, and I sometimes hear kids being threatened with it at stores. Obviously I knew it involved hitting, from context, but I never investigated further.

    It's not something I would do to my kids - though I don't want any. The idea just seems too deranged and sexually-violating to me.

  2. #72
    Ginkgo
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    I prefer psychological conditioning...
    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UapkfpGktQ"]Do this[/YOUTUBE]

  3. #73
    That chalkboard guy Matthew_Z's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teslashock View Post
    This website is about typology and how typology is evident, applicable, and manifest in society. Of course it is not 100% legitimate, and of course not every person of a single type is going to behave the same way. However, we can make threads that help us gather (rather short-sighted) statistics, and make (rather inconclusive) generalizations.
    Pardon my interjection, but as you have stated above, there are no conclusive generalizations that can be made easily in the realm of typology, especially over the medium of this forum. While criminal profiling does have some solid statistics(prison rates aren't arguable, although how it is measured that a crime was committed is questionable) behind it and even that deserves sensitivity in execution, the empiricism involved in type-to-trait links are highly weak and any consequent generalization is also built upon weak grounds. The initial authors of MBTI were very careful to avoid negative generalizations because they had minimal to no evidence to support such generalizations and using them where they very easily could not apply would easily do more harm that good to any individual reading the profiles.

    In short, I do not see adequate data that can support any conclusion to be drawn about negative traits, at least in the realm of "why." While it is true that SJs may be more inclined to spanking their children, (and that somewhat misrepresents the facts in that any group MAY spank their children and no negative correlations have been noted thus far) I think it is a step very deep into potentially offensive speculation to say "SJs are all about tradition, spanking is a very "traditional" method of discipline" with the implications thereof.
    If a deaf INFP falls in the forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?

  4. #74
    Member ElusiveRain's Avatar
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    It does not concern me which type would be most likely to spank their children. Spanking from any type has only negative consequences.

    I was spanked when I did something wrong, in a controlled manner, with forewarning. And yes, I survived to adulthood and am now "OK".

    When a child is spanked in toddler years, the child is being taught not to do something because they might be inflicted with pain (if found out). It does not teach the real reason the act should not be performed.

    When a child is spanked in young (elementary school) years, the child is taught not to do something out of fear of their parents' wrath--Again, this does not teach the child why he should not be doing something, because they are too afraid of the spanking to think about anything else.

    It is effective. Spanking will, most definitely, in an immediate sense, stop a child from doing something wrong. It does not stop them from wanting to do something wrong. If a child is not obsessed about moral values, they will (past spanking age) resume with vigor any prior leaning they had to doing things against ethics. Spanking works with kids on whom other methods of discipline would also work. It does not work (past spanking age) on those children who are antisocial to begin with. My brother (also spanked as a child), ended up in prison.

    And, in my opinion, spanking has put quite a distance between my mother (spanking afflictor), and myself, because just talking to her now sends chills up my spine. I have remained states away from her for nearly 20 years--as soon as I could leave home.

    If you take into consideration those countries in which it is acceptable to remove a person's hand for thievery (for example), they have a very low theft rate (so I've heard, I don't have any references to cite). However, if these countries were suddenly released of this discipline method, my guess is that the theft rate would sky-rocket higher than countries that never had that consequence. Have they curtailed the people, or just the behavior? With children, inevitably, they will be set free at 18, and will no longer be spanked. It then matters whether they were taught why they should not do something, or whether they were just taught what not to do.

    In my experience, a child spanked will either end up loathing their parents, or will end up in prison. If people get past the loathing of their parents as adults, they cannot say they did not loathe them as children. I know I don't want my children feeling that way about me.

    This is a subject I feel strongly about, and I'm sorry to have offended anyone in particular. If I can save one child from that intense fear, hatred, and self-depricating feeling that spanking can give a young one, this has served its purpose.

  5. #75
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    Time for a fucking shit fest now .. Are you having a fucking laugh? Your sensory bias here is a joke .. I may be traditional in some ways, but i have never spanked my children. Instead i speak to them about their actions and try to reason with them .. Be careful with your stereotyping. My mother is an ESFJ and she never spanked or beat us kids and we probably deserved it sometimes.

    What bullshit.
    You know, I don't think ESFJs spank or beat their kids a lot either. They just yell, really, really loud.

  6. #76
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teslashock View Post
    Ok, saslou, you need to calm down. I am not making any serious conclusions here; it was supposed to be a joke, me drawing a conclusion from one post. Wow.
    I am the first to admit i went off at the deep end on this one. No, you didn't make any serious conclusions but you did make an initial conclusion .. Based on the evidence that SJ's like tradition and as spanking is a traditional form of disipline .. 1+1=??.

    I apologise for my initial emotional response to this thread .. However, i didn't see that as a joke. Infact i thought it was rather rude.

    I was under the impression people/adults hit their children .. and this had bugger all to do with type.


    Quote Originally Posted by mrcockburn View Post
    Why is everyone taking things so personally? Is it wrong to be curious? This is why people can never talk about things and analyze them, particularly things like patterns within a group of people. Because people get a goddamn heart attack if you're not walking-on-eggshells PC.

    Chill the fuck out. I didn't say "Which type spanks their kids", implying that members of that type would ALWAYS choose to. I said, "Which type is MORE LIKELY to spank their kids". In fact, I *intentionally capitalized* "MOST LIKELY" in case someone jumped the gun and got hysterical about my "stereotyping". Look at the page title if you don't believe me.

    Here, let me stereotype myself: As an NT, I tend to have my head in the clouds and forget about the needs of others. It's not true of ALL NTs, and it's not true of anybody 24/7, but it's frequently true of me.

    I had an ESFJ mother too, and I was never spanked either. And I'm not aiming this rant to you, saslou. This is to everyone who's convulsing over my innocuous question.

    Jesus Christ. Relax.
    Good play to twist it.

    If i made a thread 'Are all ENTP's pedophiles?' based on something i pulled from the ENTP profile .. How many people would jump down my throat and rip my theory to pieces? As opposed to which type is more likely to be a pedophile?

    Why did i take that personally? You haven't been here very long darling, the S bias at times is utter bullshit although calmed down lately (which is nice to see )

    No it is not wrong to be curious .. You did, it seem want to cause some controversy as you was the one who stated ESFJ, ISTJ. Is that an open ended question or are you leading at that point??? .. Please inform my if my thinking is wrong here but there are 16 types out there, and your asking if it is a SJ thing .. How very narrow minded.

    I didn't say the rant was aimed at me .. I am just one of the few SJ's that will speak up and let the shit fly, should it need to.


    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    You know, I don't think ESFJs spank or beat their kids a lot either. They just yell, really, really loud.
    Lol .. I have been honest with my boys in that they have never seen me lose my temper and the day that happens, then the shit will hit the fan.
    My bark is worse than my bite
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  7. #77
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    Spankings fine. The PC people should get over themselves and realise that good behaviour is dictated by both carrots and sticks.

  8. #78
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    I was reared in a strictly conservative family and I was spanked whenever I misbehaved. I have a few unpleasant recollections of being punished with a belt when I didn't even do anything. I must admit that many children learn that physical violence is an appropriate mode to reprimand people when their parents display this behavior. I couldn't bring myself to spank my children and inflict these memories (once I have children). What's a decent alternative form of punishment? There's retraction of privileges, time-out, and perhaps some more creative means... All of which are probably less expedient and convenient than spanking...





    ps - I doubt type has very much to do with it, but I suppose SJs would be more likely to create structure through retribution. All I can do is provide my own subjective case.

    Quote Originally Posted by ElusiveRain View Post

    It is effective. Spanking will, most definitely, in an immediate sense, stop a child from doing something wrong. It does not stop them from wanting to do something wrong. If a child is not obsessed about moral values, they will (past spanking age) resume with vigor any prior leaning they had to doing things against ethics. Spanking works with kids on whom other methods of discipline would also work. It does not work (past spanking age) on those children who are antisocial to begin with. My brother (also spanked as a child), ended up in prison.

    I agree. Children should be edified as to why something is morally wrong so they can appreciate a clearer perspective on how ethics function within society. Furthermore, it has been shown that positive reinforcement generally produces better behavior from both children and adults (even on a broader judicial level). For instance, a frugal student might commit to achieving higher grades to improve their insurance rates.

  9. #79
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElusiveRain View Post
    In my experience, a child spanked will either end up loathing their parents, or will end up in prison. If people get past the loathing of their parents as adults, they cannot say they did not loathe them as children. I know I don't want my children feeling that way about me.
    Wow, I missed this earlier. This is a really inflammatory and overdramatic comment, don't you think?

    I know that many people currently out of prison and who do not loathe their parents have been spanked as children, including (but not limited to) myself and my sisters, my parents, some of my friends, and many people on these forums.

    While many have suggested that spanking may lead to future problems in some children, there is no need for grossly inaccurate blanket statements. If that's your experience with anyone who's ever been spanked, I think you need to get out more and meet new people. Seriously.
    -end of thread-

  10. #80
    Senior Member tinkerbell's Avatar
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    there is evidence that spanked kids preform better in school and in life and have no adverse effects. Spanking moderately that is, spanking doesn't leave marks and their are no impliments ought to be used. In European countries where spanking is illegal (not the UK), punishment gets pretty twisted like being locked in places etc...

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