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  1. #21
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    I think life in itself has enough inherent struggle and then to add to this the stressor of needing to make money in order to eat and sleep!?!?!

    Ugh!!!

    No thanks, mang.

    Working menial jobs kills my soul.
    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

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  2. #22
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    I think Chule makes a fair point that historically the family unit was much more cohesive and multiple generations lived together, and thus supported/nurtured each other both emotionally/socially, and financially (although historically it could be parents continuing to assist their grown children, or equally common (more common?), the children caretaking and providing for their parents through old age, once they became adults themselves).

    I am not certain how I view the topic in today's day and age, and I'm also not certain how widespread this 'problem' is. I think those of us who frequent type-c tend to be more privileged to begin with, so we might be acquainted with many more people who ARE supported by their parents once they hit 25-45, or who are trust fund babies, when it's really not the norm.

    I do agree though that most people are not educated properly in budgeting and even the most basic matters when it comes to money management. That said, I also think right now (at least in America, I don't know about the world over) it's kinda culturally accepted/ 'o.k.' to go into debt and accumulate many more goods than one can technically afford. BUT....it's also not like this phenomenon is terribly new to humanity; materialism, debt, and the like has always bubbled up historically.

    I'm happy I was drilled from a young age by my father to manage my money well - to put money into savings, to never put anything on credit I didn't have the immediate money to pay for, and to always pay all of my credit card statements in full, every single time.

    I think I could rely on my parents if I entered dire straights - and I am incredibly thankful for that fact. But I'd prefer not to have to do that, as I want to find a way to survive on my own.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  3. #23
    Listening Oaky's Avatar
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    My view is that it is ok for parents to financially help their children but only until they're plugged in to the work life in which parents should rather retire and their children help them out financially to repay them for their hard earned money that was spent on them.

    What parents should do is start a small business to keep cash flow coming into the family so that when they pass away they've left something for you to continue on with just in case you're in a financial pinch. Example: renting houses to people would give you a continuous automatic income of cash per month.
    It would financially protect you and your children and their children (if of course you or your children don't shut down the business)

  4. #24
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    The way I see it there is no right and wrong. Only what people are happy to live with.


    But answering the topic question : it would seem sensible to assume that faced with the facts kids would eventually become auto-sufficient one way or another.

  5. #25
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    I think that if the kid can't find a job, they don't have much choice, do they? Also, I think that if you turn to your parents for help after getting injured, major damage to your home, or something like that, it's just natural.

    What I think is problematic would be adult kids relying on their parents to take care of their finances for them or pay their bills on a regular basis. I mean, then they won't learn how to manage money.

    What really freaks me out is the number of people using credit casually. I personally would never use credit unless I had no other choice, but many people rely on it when there's no emergency. The other thing is that many people insist on having things they don't need even when they're low on money. It's almost like they've forgotten the difference between a need and a want.

    I don't know how they can be comfortable with that, because I'm the sort of person that whenever I owe money, the number of what I owe keeps flashing in my head and making me feel stressed. I keep imagining how much money I'd have left if I had to pay it right away for some reason, and get totally freaked out if I can't, imagining myself in prison or on the streets. Not only that, I end up imagining the people I owe feeling cheated and disgusted with me because I took something from them, and thinking of me as little better than a thief. Owing people literally makes me feel like a guilty thief until I can pay them back.

    Anyway... back on topic. I can't imagine how someone could reasonably expect to have their parents help with basic things while they're away from home. That's irrational, I mean, if you're relying on your parents THAT much, you should still be living with them. The whole point of not living with them is not relying on them. Otherwise, it's just wasteful and irrational behavior on both the parents and the childs part that does nothing but create a facade of independence. How insane is it to expect your parents to help pay for you to get out on your own and do things your own way, which was probably to get away from them and their ideas of how you should do things in the first place? I mean, really... your parents supporting you WHILE you're learning to be independent of them? That's almost a contradiction in terms.

  6. #26
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainChick View Post
    I think life in itself has enough inherent struggle and then to add to this the stressor of needing to make money in order to eat and sleep!?!?!

    Ugh!!!

    No thanks, mang.

    Working menial jobs kills my soul.
    Is it possible to achieve emotional independence without achieving financial independence?

    And it seems to me that emotional dependence kills the soul at a deeper level than menial work.

    But emotional dependence whispers in our ear that we can't survive without her. And emotional dependence boldly tells us she is saving our soul. She will give us anything but independence.

    You celebrate Independence Day but remain dependent.

  7. #27
    Nickle Iron Silicone Charmed Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chunes View Post
    It's a matter of perspective. The way most of the western world has lived in the past 60 years or so is an aberration from a long history of families living together. Financial/emotional/physical needs are better taken care of in a group that cares for each member. There is nothing wrong with parents financially supporting their children, but it's really nice if the children return the favor and behave gracefully and gratefully for the assistance.

    There will come a time when we will no longer be able to live the way we do today, and it would do our society well to learn how to function as groups again.
    Wow. All of this. Totally.
    There is a thinking stuff from which all things are made, and which, in its original state, permeates, penetrates, and fills the interspaces of the universe.

  8. #28
    Intriguing.... Quinlan's Avatar
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    I think we make a bit too much of the virtue of independence. Interdependence is the natural state for humans.
    Act your age not your enneagram number.

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  9. #29
    Nickle Iron Silicone Charmed Justice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinlan View Post
    I think we make a bit too much of the virtue of independence. Interdependence is the natural state for humans.
    So true. Look at what we do to our children and our elderly, people who are incapable of acquiring material goods for us. It's scary for me to think that so much of Western family life is based on what others can do for us financially, as individuals, rather than what we can do for each other in a multitude of different ways.
    There is a thinking stuff from which all things are made, and which, in its original state, permeates, penetrates, and fills the interspaces of the universe.

  10. #30
    Seriously Delirious Udog's Avatar
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    Cascade makes a good point that this may be a phenomenon that my financial level allows me to see more frequently. The perks of middle classedness. Perhaps this is fairly rare in general.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quinlan View Post
    I think we make a bit too much of the virtue of independence. Interdependence is the natural state for humans.
    Even though I'm quoting Quinlan, many of you made a good point with this.

    Here's part of my concern, though: I'm not seeing the interdependence. (For the record, I'm all about the symbiosis that occurs between interdependent adults.) This is usually one way. The child depends on parents for money, knowledge, time, and resources, but when the parent needs something from the child, the child suddenly can't spare the effort or time to help.

    It often appears far more parasitic than symbiotic in my observations.

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